IainB Posted March 26 Report Share Posted March 26 On 3/26/2025 at 5:02 PM, The White Knight said: I actually agree with you. But my question was - Is it morally right? I honestly don't believe it is. What you are doing is robbing the Champions to make more money, if the Champions lose, "nobody remembers them" as stated earlier in tthis Thread. That's not right. Expand Morally, if everybody knows the rules at the start of the season, then I think it's fine, when the play offs are fiddled at the end of the season that's where things start to get iffy... but don't get me started on all that again! 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaddlebowRoad Posted March 26 Report Share Posted March 26 On 3/26/2025 at 5:10 PM, IainB said: Morally, if everybody knows the rules at the start of the season, then I think it's fine, when the play offs are fiddled at the end of the season that's where things start to get iffy... but don't get me started on all that again! Expand that clearly shouldnt have happened but at least morris took ownership of it and admitted he got it wrong 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreverblue Posted March 26 Report Share Posted March 26 On 3/26/2025 at 5:10 PM, IainB said: Morally, if everybody knows the rules at the start of the season, then I think it's fine, when the play offs are fiddled at the end of the season that's where things start to get iffy... but don't get me started on all that again! Expand Morals in sport! Yes most of the trouble comes from how the rules are written. It doesn't take much for a highly paid lawyer to find a loophole. Years ago I thought it would mean more if we won the play offs and topped the final table because some would say we only won the play offs not the league but I don't think anyone cares about that anymore so all we worry about is getting in to the play offs. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted March 26 Report Share Posted March 26 On 3/26/2025 at 5:20 PM, foreverblue said: Morals in sport! Yes most of the trouble comes from how the rules are written. It doesn't take much for a highly paid lawyer to find a loophole. Years ago I thought it would mean more if we won the play offs and topped the final table because some would say we only won the play offs not the league but I don't think anyone cares about that anymore so all we worry about is getting in to the play offs. Expand And THAT devalues the League Competition itself. The Team that wins the League are the true Champions. The 'Play Off Champions' are just that. Nothing more. By the way, I care, so do many others. Why don't the powers that be have the League Championship as a seperate competition, and perhaps another Competion between the top four Teams in the League as a League Cup competition which would mean you get roughly the same number of Meetings to make up your money. That way, you would not be robbing anybody of their rightfully, hard earned Title over a full Season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IainB Posted March 26 Report Share Posted March 26 On 3/26/2025 at 6:09 PM, The White Knight said: And THAT devalues the League Competition itself. The Team that wins the League are the true Champions. The 'Play Off Champions' are just that. Nothing more. By the way, I care, so do many others. Why don't the powers that be have the League Championship as a seperate competition, and perhaps another Competion between the top four Teams in the League as a League Cup competition which would mean you get roughly the same number of Meetings to make up your money. That way, you would not be robbing anybody of their rightfully, hard earned Title over a full Season. Expand Are they really the Champions though? As all teams know the rules they could easily run at 58% effort all year and sneak into the play offs, assuming they don't care where they finish and then put 100% effort in to the "title" 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LisaColette Posted March 26 Report Share Posted March 26 (edited) On 3/25/2025 at 7:45 PM, SUPERACE said: Boo hoo stop crying Expand I see the level of debate is really high in the Prem section!! 😂 On 3/25/2025 at 11:12 PM, SUPERACE said: Yes mate after 29 years, 2 league titles in 3 years really hits the nerve. 14 stars. Expand 2 times in 29 years is quite poor tbh. Plus even if you do 2 in 3 years, not as good as 3 in a row. On 3/26/2025 at 5:02 PM, The White Knight said: I actually agree with you. But my question was - Is it morally right? I honestly don't believe it is. What you are doing is robbing the Champions to make more money, if the Champions lose, "nobody remembers them" as stated earlier in tthis Thread. That's not right. Expand I remember Birmingham finishing top in 2013 and Poole 4th and we won play offs. Edited March 26 by LisaColette 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bellevueace Posted March 26 Report Share Posted March 26 On 3/26/2025 at 10:01 AM, Steve Irving said: Meh. As I say each to their own. If you’re a win is all that matters kinda person and get just as much satisfaction taking advantage of someone else’s misfortune when you’re blatantly not the best side then crack on. Takes all sorts I suppose. Expand Ipswich arent the only team to suffer misfortune, we lost out in the play offs when Bjerre broke his leg and we couldnt replace him, Kurtz injury at Peterborough and going back farther i can remember Les Collins at Sheffield in a league match and his ef on the last lap cost us a win and hence the title that year. Thats not to say we would have beaten Coventry with Bjerre or Peterborough with Kurtz, we all know who should win meetings games etc but it doesnt always work out as it should, Liverpool v Wimbledon for example if Liverpool had a catalogue of injuries when Dons won the cup people would be saying Liverpool would have won with a full team but they didnt. Ipswich could also have come up short with a full side ef/injury/ exclusion etc. Stop feeling sorry for yourself weve all been there. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERACE Posted March 26 Report Share Posted March 26 (edited) On 3/26/2025 at 7:17 PM, LisaColette said: I see the level of debate is really high in the Prem section!! 😂 2 times in 29 years is quite poor tbh. Plus even if you do 2 in 3 years, not as good as 3 in a row. I remember Birmingham finishing top in 2013 and Poole 4th and we won play offs. Expand 3 in a row been there and done that twice and four in a row. Most successful club in league history. Edited March 26 by SUPERACE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Knight Posted March 26 Report Share Posted March 26 On 3/26/2025 at 7:17 PM, LisaColette said: I see the level of debate is really high in the Prem section!! 😂 2 times in 29 years is quite poor tbh. Plus even if you do 2 in 3 years, not as good as 3 in a row. I remember Birmingham finishing top in 2013 and Poole 4th and we won play offs. Expand Exactly. Sort of proves my point, I think. On 3/26/2025 at 6:15 PM, IainB said: Are they really the Champions though? As all teams know the rules they could easily run at 58% effort all year and sneak into the play offs, assuming they don't care where they finish and then put 100% effort in to the "title" Expand Proves my point even more, if true. Shouldn't they be 100% all of the time. They would have to if the Team that finished the Season top of the League won the League as they should. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IainB Posted March 26 Report Share Posted March 26 On 3/26/2025 at 10:17 PM, The White Knight said: Proves my point even more, if true. Shouldn't they be 100% all of the time. They would have to if the Team that finished the Season top of the League won the League as they should. Expand Absolutely they should... but they just don't have to be in a play off system. We've all seen riders giving that extra effort (100%) when the play offs come around, whether that's sustainable over a whole season is a different matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreverblue Posted March 26 Report Share Posted March 26 (edited) On 3/26/2025 at 10:02 PM, SUPERACE said: 3 in a row been there and done that twice and four in a row. Most successful club in league history. Expand During the war Uncle Albert!!! Edited March 26 by foreverblue 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
szkocjasid Posted March 26 Report Share Posted March 26 On 3/26/2025 at 4:41 PM, The White Knight said: Is that morally right though. Team does hard work throughout the Season to finish TOP OF THE LEAGUE at the end of it. Then loses in the Play Offs after two or three Meetings - it doesn't seem right to me.............. Sorry. Expand I don't like the play-offs & think whoever tops the table should be Champions. However as they all know the rules before the season starts I don't feel bad if the table toppers fail in the play-offs, even if it's injuries that cause that. The only way I would feel for them, would be if they voted against the play-offs but the majority voted for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralMelchett Posted March 27 Report Share Posted March 27 On 3/26/2025 at 7:17 PM, LisaColette said: I see the level of debate is really high in the Prem section!! 😂 2 times in 29 years is quite poor tbh. Plus even if you do 2 in 3 years, not as good as 3 in a row. I remember Birmingham finishing top in 2013 and Poole 4th and we won play offs. Expand Given that statistically it's a 1 in 7 chance to win the title now and has been for the last few seasons - it should be nearer double that 😉 anyway back to the match.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilTheAce Posted March 27 Report Share Posted March 27 turned into an embarrassing threat this 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*JJ Posted March 27 Report Share Posted March 27 On 3/26/2025 at 7:17 PM, LisaColette said: I remember Birmingham finishing top in 2013 and Poole 4th and we won play offs. Expand By signing the World Champion for the play offs ... 😖 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreverblue Posted March 27 Report Share Posted March 27 (edited) On 3/27/2025 at 9:13 AM, *JJ said: By signing the World Champion for the play offs ... 😖 Expand Not quite, Hancock was not World Champion at the time and I believe his first meeting for Poole was early August. Edited March 27 by foreverblue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ouch Posted March 27 Report Share Posted March 27 On 3/27/2025 at 9:13 AM, *JJ said: By signing the World Champion for the play offs ... 😖 Expand That was the year of Chris Holders awful crash I believe and Poole were quite rightly allowed an injury replacement. Anyone who feels a badly injured rider cannot be replaced at any point in the season is not my kind of folk. Anything that negates the impact of an injury to one of our hero’s is to be commended in my book. The current system adopted by the BSPL that sees guests - the former necessary evil of the sport - as the preferred option is lunacy. Play offs are not compatible with speedway as a way of determining the champions but this has been done to death over the years and forgetting logic it’s just down to if you like them or not. I’ve never seen a full play off since they came in. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreverblue Posted March 27 Report Share Posted March 27 Yes it was the awful crash at Coventry, I was there and I spoke Chris Holder couple of years ago and he said he didnt think he would make it and I think a lot of us thought that in the stadium. Guests are a necessary evil because it is the only affordable way. I expect Lambert would have been only too pleased to help Ipswich if it had been allowed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IainB Posted March 27 Report Share Posted March 27 On 3/27/2025 at 11:54 AM, foreverblue said: Yes it was the awful crash at Coventry, I was there Expand Me too, and the same design flaw still exists with the air fence to this very day. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambo95 Posted March 27 Report Share Posted March 27 On 3/26/2025 at 9:23 AM, szkocjasid said: By that logic Zmarzlik shouldn't celebrate winning the world title because he didn't beat Laguta or Sayfutdinov, or we could question why Bewley celebrated so much when he won at Cardiff, when he didn't defeat the best 15 riders in the world! Expand Bewley possibly only won at Cardiff because of Laguta and Sayfutdinov. Bewley and Holder got into the GP's when the Russians were kicked out. Who knows who would be in the GP's if that didn't happen.😁 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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