Birmingham Speedway

[Heathcote]

5 minutes ago, LagutaRacingFan said:

Artem Laguta was open to riding in the UK.

Every rider in the world is open to riding in the UK.....at a cost which far out exceeds any UK promoters budget.

Its blatantly obvious why they stuck with Pawlicki, no other rider was willing to set up in the UK at the money that was being offered to them. 

Edited Thursday at 02:20 PM by Heathcote

[speedwaysliders]

Are they really throwing the kitchen sink at promoting Speedway in the city and in the midlands in general? Only Birmingham fans will know the answer.Why are thet trying just to find sponsorship,go out there and drag the extra people needed by to make it work,Its great that the club has backers but Birmingham isnt a small city get the word out and about.

[Hamish McRaker]

So it sounds like they currently owe money which they are unable to pay (presumably including to riders) and unless this is cleared, they will be unable to declare 2025 participation when the deadline comes up (I e. BSPL conference).

The Directors are unable to finance this, and are seeking persons to contribute and bail them out, and enable them to declare participation in 2025. 

If the Directors can't provide this finance, then what chance is there of them being able to keep chipping in and keep the club afloat during 2025, as they seem to have done during the past three seasons? And as someone has said, this puts them down in the bottom of rider preferences. 

I heard that, when David Hemsley's promotion at Leicester hit the buffers at the end of their previous and ill-fated dabble with the top league, Keith Chapman bought the club and cleared the debts before selling it on to the Bateses. Maybe he could do the same for Birmingham, although obviously not selling to the Bateses this time 

Edited Thursday at 02:38 PM by Hamish McRaker

[FishersGate]

9 minutes ago, Hamish McRaker said:

So it sounds like they currently owe money which they are unable to pay (presumably including to riders) and unless this is cleared, they will be unable to declare 2025 participation when the deadline comes up (I e. BSPL conference).

The Directors are unable to finance this, and are seeking persons to contribute and bail them out, and enable them to declare participation in 2025. 

If the Directors can't provide this finance, then what chance is there of them being able to keep chipping in and keep the club afloat during 2025, as they seem to have done during the past three seasons? And as someone has said, this puts them down in the bottom of rider preferences. 

I heard that, when David Hemsley's promotion at Leicester hit the buffers at the end of their previous and ill-fated dabble with the top league, Keith Chapman bought the club and cleared the debts before selling it on to the Bateses. Maybe he could do the same for Birmingham, although obviously not selling to the Bateses this time 

That's what happened with Leicester  that is correct. Difference is though Buster saw potential at Leicester. There isn't a lot of hope at Birmingham 

[Pinny]

I think it should be said that promotions crying to the fanbase about needing more people through the gate doesn't work and if anything has a negative impact. 

Moving up a tier when already losing money was just ridiculous and was never going to end well. Then fielding a team that wasn't going to compete was another foolish move. Tolley also made himself look daft when stating money wasn't an issue or something along those lines. You can't go crying that your then losing money and need more fans in. 

I saw it with my own eyes at Newport, the Mallett's had many faults which everyone knows about but they put their money into it and done all they could regarding signing riders. And if they hadn't of been in the press crying about crowds each week then I am sure they would have gained a lot more sympathy and understanding from fans. 

Winning teams are important, but history shows it has to be done from the off. Losing your first few home fixtures basically writes off the season, especially these days with such small league tables. Newport had crowds of about 300 each week and by the time changes were made to the side (which incidentally made them the best side in the league by some distance) the crowds didn't go up when results changed as the league title was well out the window. We got to the KO cup final and had a crowd of 1000 ish watch us absolutely batter Glasgow (who walked away with the league title that year). This just proves that when a team is winning and has a chance of lifting silverware, fans will come.

But back to Birmingham, yes it will be great for British Speedway if they have another go next season but the best thing for them to do would be to drop to the Championship and try and sign a top side. Another season like the one just gone and it will only be the same negative comments or worse.

And for God sake sort the management out. Get rid of Ermolenko and get a proper manager in.

 

[TTT]

I think everyone can respect Tolley and his team for giving it a go but they really should call it a day.

It'll be sad for Brum fans but you've got to be realistic by saying it's not financially possible to run Speedway at Brum with all of the obstacles in the way.

 

1. Having to run at Prem level is financial suicide for a club like Birmingham, They'll never have a winning team on track because they're in the KL bracket when it comes to team building where they're left with the riders that nobody else wanted, The Bates family and very well run clubs like BV and Ips will always snap up the big name HL's.

2. Once the average 1-7 starts it's inevitable losing streak it'll result in fans walking away, Even more will walk away in 2025 than ever before with funds being the tightest they've been in years due to Labour trying to push as many English people to the financial brink as possible, Especially the pensioners who as we all know by now make up much of British Speedway's fanbase these days, You just need to see an EUROSPORT meeting to see the average age of a crowd, Therefore nobody is going to be throwing around £20+ for a ticket and a couple of quid for parking plus extra's to watch a bang average side that'll get hammered.

3. Once the above happens, Brum would have to fold mid-season because they won't have to money to continue and it'll just lead to jobs being lost, fans being left disappointed after buying season tickets, Tolley and co being left even more out of pocket while other clubs will have points deducted after having results against Birmingham wiped off the board.

 

All the above is VERY HIGH RISK with NO REWARD to a point where it doesn't make any sense to even risk it.

[Pinny]

Another thing, from what I have read it seems 2025 will be the final year of speedway at Birmingham regardless of success and crowd levels so what sane person is going to throw their money into that?

If your club is getting the begging bowl out, then IMO it's time for the promotion to shut shop. 

[spin king]

You have to ask the question is there ever going to be the support for speedway in Birmingham.

They returned to the sport in 2007, and in that time they have had the following Promoters/ owners.

Tony Mole (Premier League)

Gary Patchett and Mick Bratley (Premier League)

Back to Tony Mole (Premier League and Elite League)

Phillips Group (Elite League 2 seasons fold halfway through the 2nd season)

Back to Tony Mole (National League)

Mason Family (National League and Championship)

Tolley Group ( Championship and Premiership) 

That is 6 changes of Promotions/ Owners in 16 seasons (2020 was not counted as no speedway due to the pandemic).

Also factor in that Nigel Tolley at present does not know whether the stadium will be available, and cannot be 100% sure that the club will run because of stadium availability.

This has to impact upon his ability to sign riders, for instance a rider like Tom Brennan.

Tom has an offer from Ipswich who are definitely going to run next season

or 

Tom receives an offer from Birmingham, who wants him in their team next season, only problem is Birmingham won't know if they can run due to stadium availability.

Who is Tom going to choose?

Hates me to say it, but you could put the two best and most successful Promoters to run Birmingham speedway and I think that they would struggle to make it viable. 

[FishersGate]

Birmingham have been piss poor for many years now. If tolley wanted the best for Birmingham speedway then he should shut it years ago. I'm assuming he's put in tens of thousands of his own money to the club, just think he could saved all that money returned the club in a much better financial situation. Take a step back to take two steps forward if you get me. Take 3/4 years out save a fortune and pump it back into the club and give it a right go. Instead of just barely surviving and having a rubbish team every season. I don't get this argument of supporters saying ' be grateful that you've got a club to support' , well nobody wants to see a losing team every season and if fans aren't turning up then what is the point? Ofcourse if my club went bust I'd miss it, but would I miss losing every week year in year out watching my club slowly die? No I wouldn't. I'd rather it go for abit and come back with a bang. The closures of Wolves and Peterborough are different, they were successful on and off the track. That's why it going to hurt more. Birmingham on the other hand are disaster and need to start from the very beginning. New stadium, track, location, would that work though? Doubt it. Clearly the brummies are just a poor supported club. 

[IainB]

1 hour ago, Heathcote said:

Every rider in the world is open to riding in the UK.....at a cost which far out exceeds any UK promoters budget.

Its blatantly obvious why they stuck with Pawlicki, no other rider was willing to set up in the UK at the money that was being offered to them. 

And don't forget they dropped Zack Cook when they wanted to bring Lindgren in! In what world do you ever do that?

10 minutes ago, FishersGate said:

Birmingham have been piss poor for many years now. If tolley wanted the best for Birmingham speedway then he should shut it years ago. I'm assuming he's put in tens of thousands of his own money to the club, just think he could saved all that money returned the club in a much better financial situation. Take a step back to take two steps forward if you get me. Take 3/4 years out save a fortune and pump it back into the club and give it a right go. Instead of just barely surviving and having a rubbish team every season. I don't get this argument of supporters saying ' be grateful that you've got a club to support' , well nobody wants to see a losing team every season and if fans aren't turning up then what is the point? Ofcourse if my club went bust I'd miss it, but would I miss losing every week year in year out watching my club slowly die? No I wouldn't. I'd rather it go for abit and come back with a bang. The closures of Wolves and Peterborough are different, they were successful on and off the track. That's why it going to hurt more. Birmingham on the other hand are disaster and need to start from the very beginning. New stadium, track, location, would that work though? Doubt it. Clearly the brummies are just a poor supported club. 

The history shows that clubs don't really close for 3 or 4 years, especially in city venues, it's more like 20 to 25 years before they make a comeback, if at all, due to the scarcity of land  available at the right price in the right area.

[Hamish McRaker]

Unfortunately, and ironically on the day that the Premiership concludes it's season, this is a reminder that attempting to sustain a higher-level league in this country is becoming ever more impractical and may have gone beyond that stage. 

It just isn't sustainable and is financially bonkers. Professional sport now involves having to accumulate and run with terrible levels of loss and debt, meaning that the weaker clubs in so many sports are falling like leaves from the autumn trees. 

[FishersGate]

2 minutes ago, Hamish McRaker said:

Unfortunately, and ironically on the day that the Premiership concludes it's season, this is a reminder that attempting to sustain a higher-level league in this country is becoming ever more impractical and may have gone beyond that stage. 

It just isn't sustainable and is financially bonkers. Professional sport now involves having to accumulate and run with terrible levels of loss and debt, meaning that the weaker clubs in so many sports are falling like leaves from the autumn trees. 

Phil Morris pushing more GP riders to Britian is actually financially ruining some clubs. 

[Wolfie456]

1 hour ago, Pinny said:

I think it should be said that promotions crying to the fanbase about needing more people through the gate doesn't work and if anything has a negative impact. 

Moving up a tier when already losing money was just ridiculous and was never going to end well. Then fielding a team that wasn't going to compete was another foolish move. Tolley also made himself look daft when stating money wasn't an issue or something along those lines. You can't go crying that your then losing money and need more fans in. 

I saw it with my own eyes at Newport, the Mallett's had many faults which everyone knows about but they put their money into it and done all they could regarding signing riders. And if they hadn't of been in the press crying about crowds each week then I am sure they would have gained a lot more sympathy and understanding from fans. 

Winning teams are important, but history shows it has to be done from the off. Losing your first few home fixtures basically writes off the season, especially these days with such small league tables. Newport had crowds of about 300 each week and by the time changes were made to the side (which incidentally made them the best side in the league by some distance) the crowds didn't go up when results changed as the league title was well out the window. We got to the KO cup final and had a crowd of 1000 ish watch us absolutely batter Glasgow (who walked away with the league title that year). This just proves that when a team is winning and has a chance of lifting silverware, fans will come.

But back to Birmingham, yes it will be great for British Speedway if they have another go next season but the best thing for them to do would be to drop to the Championship and try and sign a top side. Another season like the one just gone and it will only be the same negative comments or worse.

And for God sake sort the management out. Get rid of Ermolenko and get a proper manager in.

 

As has been mentioned on here god knows how many times they cannot ride in the championship as Monday is the only night of the week they can use the stadium.

[Falcon1983]

Pie in the Sky stuff but someone with alot of money needs to build a stadium somehow incorporate a smaller track inside a larger one

 

Let Wolves, Brum and Cradley share it with Wolves running on the smaller track, 3 different race nights, same owner running all 3 sides 

 

Win win win

[Pinny]

Thanks for that , didn't realise race nights had been agreed for both leagues already next season. 
 

Most sensible decision is to shut the doors now then. 
 

[heathen52]

5 minutes ago, Falcon1983 said:

Pie in the Sky stuff but someone with alot of money needs to build a stadium somehow incorporate a smaller track inside a larger one

 

Let Wolves, Brum and Cradley share it with Wolves running on the smaller track, 3 different race nights, same owner running all 3 sides 

 

Win win win

You my friend have made some pretty valid points, right location with 2 teams and two different tracks one inside the other but where I differ is it could be with two different promoters sharing overheads, the obvious teams in the West Midlands would be Wolves and Cradley, Birmingham Brummies simply do not have enough support, unless this scenario comes to fruition I cannot for the life of me see where the West Midlands will have a Speedway again team in the near future, from what I have posted you will gather I doubt Birmingham will come to the tapes in 2025, what's the point when it will only be for one season anyway, well done for those that have kept Brummies going over the past few years but it will most probably all have been in vain.

[Hamish McRaker]

16 minutes ago, Pinny said:

Thanks for that , didn't realise race nights had been agreed for both leagues already next season. 
 

Most sensible decision is to shut the doors now then. 
 

UK has gradually given up priority race nights including Thursdays as the Polish juggernaut continues to crush all in it's path. May as well just run at championship level with remaibing UK tracks on whatever night they choose. 

[Fromafar]

Fair play to Tolley he put his money in Club.But to be honest there were some strange comments and decisions on Team front.Doesn’t look to good for the future IMO.Suprised by his financial situation he always said money wasn’t the problem.

[longmeadow]

Total disgrace of a club. They cancel the Alan Grahame memorial. I bet his little brother is well impressed. Maybe the owners dont realise that andy was a birmingham legend

[Racin Jason 72]

To blame the away fixtures for cash flow is ridiculous. They have had equal amount of home and away fixtures over the course of a season. 
Why would anyone invest in a team who only have a year left to run ? That’s not an investment that’s a donation !