Arch Stanton Posted October 9 Report Share Posted October 9 2 hours ago, mikebv said: Many of today's riders in the number three and four berths were riding in higher positions in the teams until the GP riders came back... Creating almost a false expectation of their true capability... Some were "one and fives" only in a severely watered down top league.. Sheffield for example, had pretty much "3 top HL's" which can only dilute tbe scoring of their opposite numbers, four times a year.. Some perspective needed as to expectation levels I would suggest... Scoring points against Polish top tier riders is somewhat different than scoring points against other GB riders second tier HL's... Which, until the those top tier Polish riders came back, many riders had built their averages on... Riding against the same lads in both divisions several times a week... And to the likes of Bewley, Doyle, Emil, Fricke, Woffy, Jack Holder, Lidsey, Lindgren, Cook, and Janowski, you can add Chris Holder, Musielak, and Kurtz who are top tier level in all but name in Poland (Kurtz now riding their next season, plus being a GP rider).. As I say, perspective needed... Not sure that’s the case with Ellis Mike. Even if his 8+ season was an anomaly, his GSA’s since around 2018 have been close to the 7 point mark bar the last couple of season’s. I take Pinny’s point about injuries, they do seem to have crept in recently, but the ex British champ is surely good value on 5 and a half particularly the way he rides Ipswich. Unlike the likes of Bomber and King with all due respect to them, he’s still the right side of 30 so has plenty left in the tank. He won’t be short of offers. I don’t see many of those similar “3 and 4” riders who look the same value. I’ll be disappointed if he doesn’t return. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted October 9 Report Share Posted October 9 1 minute ago, Arch Stanton said: Not sure that’s the case with Ellis Mike. Even if his 8+ season was an anomaly, his GSA’s since around 2018 have been close to the 7 point mark bar the last couple of season’s. I take Pinny’s point about injuries, they do seem to have crept in recently, but the ex British champ is surely good value on 5 and a half particularly the way he rides Ipswich. Unlike the likes of Bomber and King with all due respect to them, he’s still the right side of 30 so has plenty left in the tank. He won’t be short of offers. I don’t see many of those similar “3 and 4” riders who look the same value. I’ll be disappointed if he doesn’t return. 100℅ agree, a bargain average, especially at home... I just think some believe that this kind of rider "should" be beating much higher level opponents more regularly, away from home in particular..... They don't, simply because the level of rider in the top tier is that much higher than ever it was over the past decade.. King, Ellis, Wright, Worrall, Lawson and Nichols, all seem to do better at "four or two," than when riding at "three"... Meaning their default position is as a second string.. With Brennan being an exception this season as he has started to establish himself in a HL position... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
89buttons Posted October 9 Report Share Posted October 9 You ride half your meetings at home and Ellis is very good at Foxhall, injuries are an issue but I think he’s good value on his average. would like to see doyle, Ellis, rew, Brennan, emil, dan t, rising star wpuld like to see Boughen as the rising star but can’t see Oxford letting him go and I’m not really clued up on who would be eligible for the rising star list next year so time will. Tbh I’d be more than happy to keep Jordan and Dan as our reserve pair and just swap out king for Brennan from this years side if the rules allowed 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siggysigalos Posted October 9 Report Share Posted October 9 4 hours ago, Arch Stanton said: Not sure that’s the case with Ellis Mike. Even if his 8+ season was an anomaly, his GSA’s since around 2018 have been close to the 7 point mark bar the last couple of season’s. I take Pinny’s point about injuries, they do seem to have crept in recently, but the ex British champ is surely good value on 5 and a half particularly the way he rides Ipswich. Unlike the likes of Bomber and King with all due respect to them, he’s still the right side of 30 so has plenty left in the tank. He won’t be short of offers. I don’t see many of those similar “3 and 4” riders who look the same value. I’ll be disappointed if he doesn’t return. Must admit, all your reasons for keeping Adam are spot on, his Home average alone, if fit, for me is a given. The fact he still comes in on a 5 and a half average just shouts out as a No Brainer. I'm sure Mr Brennan's phone is on fire, but as you know more than me, the Team Limits haven't been finalised as of yet and although Tom is getting the calls, i expect Ipswich could just start as favourites for his signature. We all assume Doyley is the 1st name signed, and i'm sure we all hope that is the case, waiting on Emil is huge, but let's hope that ends as a positive. I know you will be spot on about Mark Lemon trying to persuade Keynan Rew to join Belle Vue, but i read he loves it at Ipswich, so let's hope he is retained as well. I'm not going to even try and workout the R/S situation or Reserve as i haven't a clue how it works, apart from Birmingham, Kings Lynn and Oxford get 1st dibs on the R/S before we do, so i see that as Flint at Birmingham (if they come to tapes), i fear Jordan will be a target for Kings Lynn as Anders Rowe wont be a R/S next season, and won't be at Lynn either, Oxford surely stick with Boughen, again though is Luke Killeen a R/S?? Then it's us, so don,t know where we go as Dan Thompson will be a Number 6 due to his average....Again that's me guessing. Oh how we all love the silly season........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
89buttons Posted October 9 Report Share Posted October 9 When is the agm? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTT Posted October 9 Report Share Posted October 9 I don't think Ipswich have much competition for Brennan when you look at the bigger picture. Belle Vue can't fit him in, They've got to release one of Lidsey or B. Cook in order to retain Kurtz & Bewley. Nobody's committing to Birmingham with uncertainty surrounding the clubs future. King's Lynn are no threat to anyone when it comes to signings, They'll just have to sign what's left after retaining certain riders from this years 1-7. Leicester will just retain 2 from the following three (Masters, Douglas or Becker) to join Fricke and Lawson considering Dickson has apparently said that Lawson is staying. Janowski's already confirmed himself at Oxford, They'll retain Tungate after the season he's had and it's a certainty that they'll go for Woffinden if he's released by Sheffield or they'll go for Musielak imo, If they go weak at reserve then they'll likely retain Harris or Wright as the No.4. Sheffield can't fit him in unless it's a 40.00 limit and even if it is Tom doesn't really perform well around Sheffield so I'll be surprised if they're willing to go for Brennan over a rider like Chris Harris. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GiveusaB Posted October 9 Report Share Posted October 9 Love watching Emil....but I'd go for Lindgren! Zach Cook would be a decent shout, if you lose Rew/Ellis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gavan Posted October 9 Report Share Posted October 9 I’m still bemused how people think that riders like King and Ellis … who both were signed as riders to get maybe 8-9 at home and 6-7 away …. were all of a sudden expected to be banging in double figures when Jason and Emil got injured 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinny Posted October 9 Report Share Posted October 9 4 minutes ago, Gavan said: I’m still bemused how people think that riders like King and Ellis … who both were signed as riders to get maybe 8-9 at home and 6-7 away …. were all of a sudden expected to be banging in double figures when Jason and Emil got injured If your operating rider replacement for a missing heatleader the rest of the team has to step up and when push came to shove both King and Ellis went missing. Ellis was signed on what people described as a bargain average yet according to the BSPA site he put only 0.04 on his average last season (as a second string). Add that to his injury record and its not exactly good is it? the first thing you should look at when building your team is riders who have scope for plenty of improvement and dependable for the season. Which for me would rule Ellis out. But thats just an opinion . Id still take King over Ellis though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
89buttons Posted October 9 Report Share Posted October 9 3 hours ago, Gavan said: I’m still bemused how people think that riders like King and Ellis … who both were signed as riders to get maybe 8-9 at home and 6-7 away …. were all of a sudden expected to be banging in double figures when Jason and Emil got injured If king had of scored 6-7 away to Leicester in the play offs we’d have been in the final, but he didn’t he scored 2 riding at no.2 he’s been a fantastic servant to the club, criticisms of him often have been ott like you’ve described above with people expecting him to ride beyond his level, but the fact is when it’s gotten to the business end of the season in the biggest meetings he’s let us down more than once. for me it’s time to say thanks for the memories and move on. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MP78 Posted October 9 Report Share Posted October 9 There is of course a different route Ipswich could go… if there is no Emil and King stays (as I suspect he will). Doyle, King, Brennan, Rew, Kvech, Ellis + RS… fits in a 40 limit Still got the muscle of Doyle in 13 & 15 and a rock solid reserve all season… something to ponder maybe? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aries Posted October 9 Author Report Share Posted October 9 3 minutes ago, MP78 said: There is of course a different route Ipswich could go… if there is no Emil and King stays (as I suspect he will). Doyle, King, Brennan, Rew, Kvech, Ellis + RS… fits in a 40 limit Still got the muscle of Doyle in 13 & 15 and a rock solid reserve all season… something to ponder maybe? Looks a good team, but you have to utilise Dan Thompson on a 25% reduction imo. That’s one immediate average jumper right there due to the reduction. Let’s not forget he spent most of this year in the main body of the team so you’d expect him to be one of the stronger number 6’s in the league. Doyle Rew Brennan Ellis Emil Dan RS Thats still the team for me if it remains 40. Barring injury, that’s a title winning team. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arch Stanton Posted October 9 Report Share Posted October 9 6 hours ago, GiveusaB said: Love watching Emil....but I'd go for Lindgren! Zach Cook would be a decent shout, if you lose Rew/Ellis. Lindgren over Emil? Nah you’re alright thanks 😜 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Youhave2minutes Posted October 9 Report Share Posted October 9 6 hours ago, 89buttons said: When is the agm? All gone Mad Is in November ennit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MP78 Posted October 9 Report Share Posted October 9 22 minutes ago, Aries said: Looks a good team, but you have to utilise Dan Thompson on a 25% reduction imo. That’s one immediate average jumper right there due to the reduction. Let’s not forget he spent most of this year in the main body of the team so you’d expect him to be one of the stronger number 6’s in the league. Doyle Rew Brennan Ellis Emil Dan RS Thats still the team for me if it remains 40. Barring injury, that’s a title winning team. Oh that is 100% the team we should go for… but can’t help thinking that we will keep King again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GiveusaB Posted October 10 Report Share Posted October 10 14 hours ago, Arch Stanton said: Lindgren over Emil? Nah you’re alright thanks 😜 Just my opinion based on the gate and go track that Ipswich is 👍 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arch Stanton Posted October 10 Report Share Posted October 10 8 minutes ago, GiveusaB said: Just my opinion based on the gate and go track that Ipswich is 👍 Absolutely fine, you’ll be alone with that opinion though 😉 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 valve Posted October 10 Report Share Posted October 10 15 hours ago, MP78 said: There is of course a different route Ipswich could go… if there is no Emil and King stays (as I suspect he will). Doyle, King, Brennan, Rew, Kvech, Ellis + RS… fits in a 40 limit Still got the muscle of Doyle in 13 & 15 and a rock solid reserve all season… something to ponder maybe? Kvech apparently saying he will not be in UK next year. Thursday night meetings not giving him sufficient time for travel & preparation for Gp’’s? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AceBelle Posted October 10 Report Share Posted October 10 21 minutes ago, Arch Stanton said: Absolutely fine, you’ll be alone with that opinion though 😉 Foxhall is gate & go Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arch Stanton Posted October 10 Report Share Posted October 10 (edited) 21 minutes ago, AceBelle said: Foxhall is gate & go Every track in the Premiership is predominantly “gate and go” except for the NSS. That wasn’t my point though. My point was there’ll be very few if any, that would choose Lindgren over Emil Sayfutdinov. Edited October 10 by Arch Stanton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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