Double exclusion?

[ElmParkRG2]

What would happen if rider A,  on gate 1 and is already on a warning makes rider B on gate 2 touch the tapes. .Are they both excluded or is rider B "saved" by another rider being excluded first?  Also,, is the rule the same if the incident happens to riders in gate 1 and 4 where the rider who touches the tapes cannot claim he was conned into it? Has this happened at any time, in the past?

Edited July 31, 2024 by ElmParkRG2

[Dave_minall]

One would assume common sense would prevail and the rider on the warning would be excluded and the rider who touched the tapes would be allowed back in the re-run, but on a warning also.

[Fromafar]

  On 8/1/2024 at 12:16 PM, Dave_minall said:

One would assume common sense would prevail and the rider on the warning would be excluded and the rider who touched the tapes would be allowed back in the re-run, but on a warning also.

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Common sense and Speedway you can’t be sure what would happen.

[King Jamie]

  On 7/31/2024 at 5:52 PM, ElmParkRG2 said:

riders in gate 1 and 4 where the rider who touches the tapes cannot claim he was conned into it? Has this happened at any time, in the past?

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I vaguely remember Christian Henry (Edinburgh) and a home rider from Newport both being shunted back 15 metres for tape touching at the same time in the same race. Pretty sure it was a heat 8 and, as Henry was riding for us, I'm guessing it was either 2001 or 2002.

Can't recall ever seeing that either before or since?

[1 valve]

  On 7/31/2024 at 5:52 PM, ElmParkRG2 said:

What would happen if rider A,  on gate 1 and is already on a warning makes rider B on gate 2 touch the tapes. .Are they both excluded or is rider B "saved" by another rider being excluded first?  Also,, is the rule the same if the incident happens to riders in gate 1 and 4 where the rider who touches the tapes cannot claim he was conned into it? Has this happened at any time, in the past?

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If two or more riders in the referees opinion touch the tapes then they would be excluded. However, in nearly all cases there is a clear indication (in the eyes of the referee) of who actually touched the tape first.
There is no penalty directly linked to a rider prematurely moving and thus influencing a second rider to touch the tapes. However, the first rider may/should receive a warning for moving before the tapes went up and if already on a warning would also be excluded. this is why nearly all riders on a warning tend to stay still.

[Andrew]

  On 8/1/2024 at 12:37 PM, King Jamie said:

I vaguely remember Christian Henry (Edinburgh) and a home rider from Newport both being shunted back 15 metres for tape touching at the same time in the same race. Pretty sure it was a heat 8 and, as Henry was riding for us, I'm guessing it was either 2001 or 2002.

Can't recall ever seeing that either before or since?

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Only ever seen a double tape touch exclusion once, but it was way back in time.

One of the riders involved was Neil Collins,sometime in the early 90's.I do remember Dad and myself were sat in the Panorama Room looking down at the start line when it happened.

[Fromafar]

  On 8/1/2024 at 3:04 PM, 1 valve said:

If two or more riders in the referees opinion touch the tapes then they would be excluded. However, in nearly all cases there is a clear indication (in the eyes of the referee) of who actually touched the tape first.
There is no penalty directly linked to a rider prematurely moving and thus influencing a second rider to touch the tapes. However, the first rider may/should receive a warning for moving before the tapes went up and if already on a warning would also be excluded. this is why nearly all riders on a warning tend to stay still.

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Would agree with that.

[Tracy Bird]

Somerset v scunthorpe 2016 Thomas jorganson and Michael palm toft both excluded heat 1.

Edited August 3, 2024 by Tracy Bird

[KIRKYLANE]

Many years ago, Hull had two riders in the race after two exclusions.

The Hull riders rode around in the rerun.

The two Hull riders were both excluded for not making a bona fide attempt  to race

Result…0 - O score for the race

[Technik]

  On 7/31/2024 at 5:52 PM, ElmParkRG2 said:

What would happen if rider A,  on gate 1 and is already on a warning makes rider B on gate 2 touch the tapes. .Are they both excluded or is rider B "saved" by another rider being excluded first?  Also,, is the rule the same if the incident happens to riders in gate 1 and 4 where the rider who touches the tapes cannot claim he was conned into it? Has this happened at any time, in the past?

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This would be treated as two separate offences, Rider A had been warned prior to this start so would be disqualified for a second offence,. Rider B is a straight disqualification for touching the tapes. It would be exactly the same for the second example

[NWS]

  On 8/1/2024 at 12:37 PM, King Jamie said:

I vaguely remember Christian Henry (Edinburgh) and a home rider from Newport both being shunted back 15 metres for tape touching at the same time in the same race. Pretty sure it was a heat 8 and, as Henry was riding for us, I'm guessing it was either 2001 or 2002.

Can't recall ever seeing that either before or since?

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I remember exactly this instance. Also the only time i can ever remember seeing it.