UK Speedway in Turmoil?

[Byker Biker]

On 7/9/2023 at 6:12 AM, ch958 said:

funny - just what this debate needs

I like you're comment, the original post gives the powers that be complete licence to ignore anything constructive on any of these pages. As a collective the BSF are no better than the BSPL consequently neither can respect each other's opinions - shame 'cos there are some good suggestions from time to time that are ripped to shreds by other posters before any logic is applied or consideration can be given.

All in my humble opinion of course.

[truthsayer]

15 minutes ago, secsy1 said:

Only a handful of tracks are presently sustainable, but they also need to change and adapt to what the paying fans want to keep them coming.

There are not enough paying fans, this is a major part of the problem. The point you are referring to is they need to find a formula which attracts new fans as well as keeping the old ones.

Engine rebuilds is a relevant point though, as cost cutting (without reducing quality) is something which needs to be looked at because costs need cutting and income needs increasing. But if speedway wants to rely on paying fans to keep it afloat then it needs to grow the audience, not simply retain it.

[mikebv]

On Circa 80 to 90 riders, well over a million quid will be paid out this year..

Maybe even two million given the level of rider now over here..

Yet hardly a penny spent on advertising and marketing  the sport collectively...

The GP riders and Emil and Artem do put "bums on seats", however, that can be a short term novelty value, rather than generating "repeat visits"..

The vast majority of riders over here wouldnt attract much of a "floating follower" to attend the night that they are in town..

And the superstars have little "external fanfare" generated by the promotions the nights that they are in attendance.. 

Sadly. No point bringing someone expensive over when the vast majority of the local populace have never even heard of you, never mind him...

 

[steve roberts]

9 minutes ago, mikebv said:

On Circa 80 to 90 riders, well over a million quid will be paid out this year..

Maybe even two million given the level of rider now over here..

Yet hardly a penny spent on advertising and marketing  the sport collectively...

The GP riders and Emil and Artem do put "bums on seats", however, that can be a short term novelty value, rather than generating "repeat visits"..

The vast majority of riders over here wouldnt attract much of a "floating follower" to attend the night that they are in town..

And the superstars have little "external fanfare" generated by the promotions the nights that they are in attendance.. 

Sadly. No point bringing someone expensive over when the vast majority of the local populace have never even heard of you, never mind him...

 

I remember being all excited during my first year of speedway knowing that the reigning World Champion Ole Olsen would be riding that evening at Cowley. I recall getting off the bus from a day at school and couldn't get round to the stadium quickly enough. I obviously got to hear/read of his appearance beforehand.

[midlandred]

1 hour ago, steve roberts said:

I remember being all excited during my first year of speedway knowing that the reigning World Champion Ole Olsen would be riding that evening at Cowley. I recall getting off the bus from a day at school and couldn't get round to the stadium quickly enough. I obviously got to hear/read of his appearance beforehand.

Televising speedway meetings has eliminated the chance of having such anticipation of a live appearance

[Derrickn]

On 7/9/2023 at 7:43 AM, truthsayer said:

FWIW I agree with you. There's no need for such expensive equipment if it was standardised. It would save costs and possibly even improve the show.

But four-valve engines aren't the cause. Progress is. If rules stated 'two valves only' then we'd still be riding just as highly-tuned and expensive engines - the only difference is that they would have two-valves rather than four. People want a competitive edge and will spend to do so, and will push the rules as far as they can. 

A standard engine, two-valves or four, is in theory the solution but the sport couldn't afford it as a rule change. Someone would need to buy them. Current journeymen would probably quit because of the investment. Current equipment would become obsolete and worthless and the cost to police it would likely be prohibitive. Although, in theory, it would save money the investment needed would be beyond most stakeholders currently involved in the sport.

Maybe the grass/longtrackers would be interested in the engines that become available,the rolling chassis should still be usable for speedway.

[Sings4Speedway]

1 hour ago, Derrickn said:

Maybe the grass/longtrackers would be interested in the engines that become available,the rolling chassis should still be usable for speedway.

Maybe all internal combustion engines will be banned from public roads in the next two years and you are forced to buy electric....don't worry though because you could still sell your car to a handful of banger racers

[iris123]

Personally i thought they passed through turmoil about a decade ago and after speeding through crisis have put the foot down to get to oblivion before the 2030 deadline

[dontforgetthefueltapsbruv]

36 minutes ago, iris123 said:

Personally i thought they passed through turmoil about a decade ago and after speeding through crisis have put the foot down to get to oblivion before the 2030 deadline

Yes looks like British Speedway will achieve carbin neutral staus by 2030 by virtue of not existing

[Toady]

Reading all this doom and gloom reminds me of how we felt on hearing the news that Swindon would not be running in 2020/21 and subsequently never.

We had been watching the Robins since the demise of the cheetahs and followed them everywhere.

Team sometimes good sometimes bad,they achieved a couple of titles in that period but then came 2019 they started with a reasonable team  but nothing special then midway made a couple of changes that transformed that team and we continued to follow them and sometimes would question whether we should travel to kings lynn, Peterborough or Ipswich again but always came to the conclusion that we should as you never know the future.

What a team that was Doyley,batch,Adam,rasser,Toby,ellis,Claus. Speedway out of the top draw at home on the new Abbey circuit and away wherever they went.

Fortunately for us Oxford came back to cushion the blow so we were lucky

The main reason for most of the failures is loss of stadia out of most promotors hands

What I am trying to say Enjoy what you’ve got now as it could be gone in a flash. Support your Team now

[Piotr Pyszny]

On 7/11/2023 at 5:52 PM, steve roberts said:

I remember being all excited during my first year of speedway knowing that the reigning World Champion Ole Olsen would be riding that evening at Cowley. I recall getting off the bus from a day at school and couldn't get round to the stadium quickly enough. I obviously got to hear/read of his appearance beforehand.

Had a similar experience whilst in the lower sixth - in October 1981 (just dug out, from the loft, the meeting programme!).

In what was a seriously big deal in the area - the pre-meeting build-up in the local evening paper cranked up, night after night - Kenny Carter met (and beat, 2-1) new world champion Bruce Penhall in the Motor Cycle News Golden Helmet. Followed by Halifax 42 Swindon 35 then Halifax 41 Cradley 37. What an evening at the Shay!

You simply don't get them like that any more.

Edited July 12, 2023 by Piotr Pyszny

[steve roberts]

6 minutes ago, Piotr Pyszny said:

Had a similar experience whilst in the lower sixth - in October 1981 (just dug out, from the loft, the meeting programme!).

In what was a seriously big deal in the area - the pre-meeting build-up in the local evening paper cranked up, night after night - Kenny Carter met (and beat, 2-1) new world champion Bruce Penhall in the Motor Cycle News Golden Helmet. Followed by Halifax 42 Swindon 35 then Halifax 41 Cradley 37. What an evening at the Shay!

You simply don't get them like that any more.

I wish that I had witnessed speedway at the Shay. Visited a few years back but there was no trace of the track despite attempting to use my imagination but the ends had been squared off. I have spoken to Ian Cartwright a number of times in Kilburn and he gave a fascinating insight.

Edited July 12, 2023 by steve roberts

[Piotr Pyszny]

5 minutes ago, steve roberts said:

I wish that I had witnessed speedway at the Shay. Visited a few years back but there was no trace of the track despite attempting to use my imagination but the ends had been squared off.

For a while, after the Dukes left in 1985, the two straights survived. But, eventually, the football/rugby league pitch was moved towards the Skircoat Stand (swallowing up the home straight) to make room for a larger, new east stand, some of which sits on what was the back straight. Now, you'd never imagine speedway had taken place at the Shay (similarly, the modern version of Holker Street, Barrow!).

Edited July 12, 2023 by Piotr Pyszny

[Humphrey Appleby]

On 7/9/2023 at 10:18 PM, steve roberts said:

Fascinating stuff...just goes to demonstrate what's involved today and questions whether it's sustainable under the current climate?

It's a good documentary, but I think you'd have to put similar effort into maintaining any sort of racing engine. I'd guess where you could save costs is insisting on stock parts rather than the custom-made bits (e.g. cam shaft) which I assume are expensive to make, but these are never made equal and you'd end-up buying multiple parts to select the best ones anyway. 

I'd guess you could also try make the engines run longer before needing maintenance which would save a bit on the 5-8 hours manpower each time, but realistically unless you can make an engine last a full season, you're probably only going to be saving GBP 2-3k on the actual labour over a season, which is probably relatively insignificant for a professional rider. 

[truthsayer]

38 minutes ago, Humphrey Appleby said:

It's a good documentary, but I think you'd have to put similar effort into maintaining any sort of racing engine. I'd guess where you could save costs is insisting on stock parts rather than the custom-made bits (e.g. cam shaft) which I assume are expensive to make, but these are never made equal and you'd end-up buying multiple parts to select the best ones anyway. 

I'd guess you could also try make the engines run longer before needing maintenance which would save a bit on the 5-8 hours manpower each time, but realistically unless you can make an engine last a full season, you're probably only going to be saving GBP 2-3k on the actual labour over a season, which is probably relatively insignificant for a professional rider. 

Not really. Making an engine with more longevity would be relatively easy. The high maintenance is largely because they are tuned to rev to high rpm to make maximum power. Capping rpm would cause less wear and should create a more tractable engine.

Making a sealed engine to a lower spec would do away with a lot of the more expensive parts and would increase service life. I'd suggest an engine could last half a season easily, against six meetings at present. I'd suggest your £3k saving is quite a way out. I'm not too up on prices these days, but I'd suggest the saving in buying the engine and maintaining it would be much more - probably like £10k a season.

[mikebv]

Weren't rev limiters proposed and supposedly going to be implemented? 

[Sings4Speedway]

36 minutes ago, mikebv said:

Weren't rev limiters proposed and supposedly going to be implemented? 

Yup clever idea (rev limiters integrated into the coil system) however they never considered the amount required so non were available before the season started and rather than postpone it just got dropped/forgotten about

[ch958]

23 hours ago, steve roberts said:

I wish that I had witnessed speedway at the Shay. Visited a few years back but there was no trace of the track despite attempting to use my imagination but the ends had been squared off. I have spoken to Ian Cartwright a number of times in Kilburn and he gave a fascinating insight.

to be honest, despite the spectacular action due to the banking I'm not sure I saw one overtake in 4/5 visits

[steve roberts]

1 minute ago, ch958 said:

to be honest, despite the spectacular action due to the banking I'm not sure I saw one overtake in 4/5 visits

I guess part of the thrill was being able to stand right up close to the fence (as was Exeter)?

[Fromafar]

Seem some tremendous racing at The Shay on my visits,great race track.I will always remember  Vaclav Verner for Exeter,the number of times he bounced of the 3rd/4th fence and took of down the straight as though it was normal way to ride it,incredible stuff.