SGP and SGP 2 qualifying round nominations

[bruno]

I think some of the regular GP riders if they don't have decent years should be kicked out next year, there's to many relying on past achievements and reputation 

[OveFundinFan]

13 minutes ago, bruno said:

I think some of the regular GP riders if they don't have decent years should be kicked out next year, there's to many relying on past achievements and reputation 

What is your definition of “some of the regularGP riders”, as in some kicked out, some left in?

[Dawkins20]

3 hours ago, Lorenzo558 said:

Sad that Kolodziej missed out. Thorsell seems to be back after struggling last year

Kolodziej missed the gate in his first 2 heats and it was impossible to overtake anyone. Awful track only one line if they made a bad start than it was all over...

Huckenbeck was very unlucky in his first heat his bike stopped on the last bend when leading... If he finishes he is up there in the top3 and Lebedevs didnt...

[Technik]

On 5/29/2023 at 4:54 PM, Triple.H. said:

I still think none of the 15 GP riders should be allowed to enter the qualifiers.

Leave the SEC winner as only other direct qualifier

End of GP season those who finished outside the top 6 race against 10 who have qualified through the rounds.

Top 3 into GP then pick your 5 wildcards.

My feelings are somewhat different regards the current SGP 15.

I believe they should be required to make an entry into the qualification series if they think there is a chance they may not make the top 6 for an automatic seeded spot for the next year. If they finish outside the top 6 for any reason & have not entered the qualifiers then they cannot be considered for a wild card spot for the following season. This would stop those that maybe believe they are entitled to a place coming in each year & stopping the chance of a young rider that has invested vast amounts to navigate a path to the world championship,

My idea is in essence the same as your line 3 but my idea means the current SGP riders have to make a commitment. I understand that injuries may cause a rider to fall out of the top 6 but that's all part of the game that you cannot predict.

[OveFundinFan]

On 6/3/2023 at 10:04 AM, Technik said:

My feelings are somewhat different regards the current SGP 15.

I believe they should be required to make an entry into the qualification series if they think there is a chance they may not make the top 6 for an automatic seeded spot for the next year. If they finish outside the top 6 for any reason & have not entered the qualifiers then they cannot be considered for a wild card spot for the following season. This would stop those that maybe believe they are entitled to a place coming in each year & stopping the chance of a young rider that has invested vast amounts to navigate a path to the world championship,

My idea is in essence the same as your line 3 but my idea means the current SGP riders have to make a commitment. I understand that injuries may cause a rider to fall out of the top 6 but that's all part of the game that you cannot predict.

What rider would stick is nose out and say “I’m going to make the top 6” and therefore not enter the qualifier for the next year. None. So you going to have a qualifier with 15 of the current riders which ends up being the same as a GP meeting of which they already done 10 in the season, and only room for 1 “fresh” name in the qualifier. Me thinks that needs more thought.

[MARK246]

1 hour ago, OveFundinFan said:

What rider would stick is nose out and say “I’m going to make the top 6” and therefore not enter the qualifier for the next year. None. So you going to have a qualifier with 15 of the current riders which ends up being the same as a GP meeting of which they already done 10 in the season, and only room for 1 “fresh” name in the qualifier. Me thinks that needs more thought.

Both Lambert and Fricke failed to make the GP challenge final, are you sure the 15 GP 'stars' really are the best out there. The GP challenge is a race point based, one off meeting. The also rans in the GPs stay there because they score enough over 10 rounds to make the top 12, which always get the wild card picks. Unless they are Polish.

 

[OveFundinFan]

11 hours ago, MARK246 said:

Both Lambert and Fricke failed to make the GP challenge final, are you sure the 15 GP 'stars' really are the best out there. The GP challenge is a race point based, one off meeting. The also rans in the GPs stay there because they score enough over 10 rounds to make the top 12, which always get the wild card picks. Unless they are Polish.

 

The winner of last years GPChallenge is riding in this years GP series, that’s what you want.  Are you sure he should be there?  I agree with the GPChallenge, but does it always throw up the best rider for a 10 meeting long GP series. Riding at GP level is different to riding in any league. So much mental commitment as well as other resources needed in abundance.  Vaculik dropped out of GP series for a bout 4 years (if I recall correctly) so to “mature”as a rider. Lambert was in the GPs as the SEC champion, dropped out of the GPs, came back last year, from series reserve, a different (more mature) rider. Sometime human judgement is better than statistics ie league averages. It must be a headache for those that have to decide and this discussion we having now takes place every year…….just seems to have started earlier this year.

[MARK246]

8 hours ago, OveFundinFan said:

The winner of last years GPChallenge is riding in this years GP series, that’s what you want.  Are you sure he should be there?  I agree with the GPChallenge, but does it always throw up the best rider for a 10 meeting long GP series. Riding at GP level is different to riding in any league. So much mental commitment as well as other resources needed in abundance.  Vaculik dropped out of GP series for a bout 4 years (if I recall correctly) so to “mature”as a rider. Lambert was in the GPs as the SEC champion, dropped out of the GPs, came back last year, from series reserve, a different (more mature) rider. Sometime human judgement is better than statistics ie league averages. It must be a headache for those that have to decide and this discussion we having now takes place every year…….just seems to have started earlier this year.

What I would like to see is, 15 riders that have qualified to ride in the GPs through a real qualification system. 

Lambert and Fricke both tried to do this and failed. Is it right they could get wild card picks over any rider who has made the GP challenge final.

[Bagpuss]

19 minutes ago, MARK246 said:

What I would like to see is, 15 riders that have qualified to ride in the GPs through a real qualification system. 

Lambert and Fricke both tried to do this and failed. Is it right they could get wild card picks over any rider who has made the GP challenge final.

Depends what you want to base it on. If you want it to be the best 15 in the world then surely GP, SWC, league form and everything else should come into it too? 

Kim Nilsson deserves his place in the series as he won the challenge, however would you say he has enhanced the GP's so far? I wouldn't, and I wouldn't want him or someone of a similar standard in at the expense of anyone else better had he not won at Glasgow last year and just missed out instead. 

[Technik]

1 hour ago, MARK246 said:

What I would like to see is, 15 riders that have qualified to ride in the GPs through a real qualification system. 

Lambert and Fricke both tried to do this and failed. Is it right they could get wild card picks over any rider who has made the GP challenge final.

I was at a press conference where Ivan Mauger was talking about how he disliked the GP selection & that no matter how hard you tried if the selection panel didn't like you you were never going to get in. He went on to say the old way was the best when he could wake up on New Years Day with a licence A motor bike & a dream to be the World Champion & before the year was over that could happen but today you know on that first day you can't be the champion. 

[OveFundinFan]

2 hours ago, MARK246 said:

What I would like to see is, 15 riders that have qualified to ride in the GPs through a real qualification system. 

Lambert and Fricke both tried to do this and failed. Is it right they could get wild card picks over any rider who has made the GP challenge final.

Ok, re your last statement. You name 2 riders who were in last years Challenge final in Glasgow that should be riding in this years GPs instead of Lambert and Fricke......that is do better than Lambert and Fricke.

[MARK246]

1 hour ago, OveFundinFan said:

Ok, re your last statement. You name 2 riders who were in last years Challenge final in Glasgow that should be riding in this years GPs instead of Lambert and Fricke......that is do better than Lambert and Fricke.

What has last years GP challenge final got to do with anything. Lambert and Fricke failed to qualify for the 2024 GP challenge final. 

[DazS]

you might as well be asking for 1 off world finals. 

[Najjer]

5 hours ago, Bagpuss said:

Depends what you want to base it on. If you want it to be the best 15 in the world then surely GP, SWC, league form and everything else should come into it too? 

Kim Nilsson deserves his place in the series as he won the challenge, however would you say he has enhanced the GP's so far? I wouldn't, and I wouldn't want him or someone of a similar standard in at the expense of anyone else better had he not won at Glasgow last year and just missed out instead. 

As per norm, that’s well summarised - Nilsson went through 3 qualifying meetings (at least, as not sure he had to do a Swedish qualifier too so possibly 4) so was well deserving of his position. This is probably the reason why the GP challenge has been moved away from a UK track.

[HenryW]

I'd still like to see more riders in the GP series. 15 permanent riders feels too limiting and makes it difficult to get new riders in, however the qualification process is structured.

The era with 24 rider meetings obviously gave more opportunity for fresh faces, but the race format wasn't ideal.

Something different definitely needs done to help introduce new riders.

[DazS]

have 2 divisions with top 5 in dive 2 going up and bottom 5 div 1 going down then have a gp change for div 2. 

[OveFundinFan]

2 hours ago, DazS said:

have 2 divisions with top 5 in dive 2 going up and bottom 5 div 1 going down then have a gp change for div 2. 

There is potential for 4 new faces each year, 3 from Challenge, 1 from SEC. Majority of riders need more than the first year to get accustomed to the commitment needed at GP level. GPRacing is not league, it is much higher and much more intense. So my opinion is there is enough potential, need to be careful the series is not weakened by too many changes all at the same time.