Oxford v Swindon Select - Rescheduled April 19

[Toady]

36 minutes ago, steve roberts said:

I think that it's fair to say that the debate has shifted slightly as regards the "right" or "wrongs" as regards booking in advance and all that involves?

This debate was had weeks ago but has yet again been brought  back by the usual suspects

[steve roberts]

Just now, Toady said:

This debate was had weeks ago but has yet again been brought  back by the usual suspects

...that's the way forums operate I'm afraid "round and round" in circles.

[Bojangles]

Just now, Toady said:

You are debating it with people who have no intention of going whether they accept cash,card,advance or even bitcoin.

I'm debating it with you, so you have no intention of going? You seem to have a massive issue with people bringing this up based on your responses, why don't you just accept not everybody thinks the same way as you? We're all fellow Oxford fans, who ultimately want the best for the club, but it works both ways. You may not feel a £3 increase is excessive (or a £1 increase if you book ahead of time), but there are others that do. That's life. There's no point trying to say they're wrong, because they're not.

[Chris Brown]

5 minutes ago, Toady said:

This debate was had weeks ago but has yet again been brought  back by the usual suspects

Do you think that it is reasonable that the club respond to a question about this subject though? You can argue the debate was had but never answered

[lucifer sam]

33 minutes ago, Chris Brown said:

To pick up on a couple of points

I emailed club@oxfordspeedway.club which is the email address for General Enquiries. I mailed on 3 January and 25 January and never heard anything. The club were happy to contact me and ask for contacts for potential sponsorship though !

I support not taking cash on the day and why would any club want to ?  What I do not understand is why a debit card cannot be used for admission, not everyone has a smart phone but pretty much everyone has a debit card. Once you enter the stadium you can only pay cash for your programme and at the bars you can only use a debit card. You do not have to pre-book your drinks the day before on an app and have to pay more for a pint if you have not pre-booked it. Debit cards are a universally convenient way of paying. I understand that paying with a debit card means some sort of readmission ticket needs to be given but that could be a receipt from the debit card. You could of course incentivise people to pay in advance through the app and reduce the charge and make it more expensive on the day to use a debit card, that would possibly encourage the use of the app. Increasing the price £2 on the day is nonsense and the reluctance of the club to offer an explanation is disappointing

I accept that some football clubs are more expensive on the day but I do hope that speedway is not comparing itsself with football. Speedway has to work harder for its spectators than football and should not be complacement

I am delighted to see Oxford back and there are so many things about the way the club is run that are just brilliant, the track is a transformation from the last incarnation, the stadium itself has had a real spruce up, the track equipment is at another level, the renewing of the pits on the back straight is really good but that does not mean that there are things that could be better and I guess the disappointing thing is that not responding to an email is a conscious choice, somebody should have read that and twice made the decision to ignore it and not respond. For me that is not something any body who is trying to attract people to come through the door should do whether they like the question ot not

There are a fair few Oxford fans who knock anyone who is not constantly blowing smoke up the rear ends of the club but to grow you have to listen to your customers

Just my view

 

  

Hi Chris,

The views have been listened to. Jamie asked me about programme sales, and I said occasionally some came into the stadium without cash, and then had to walk half a mile up the road to the nearest cash point to get cash for a programme. As a result, no-one will have to do that this year. Anyone wanting to buy a programme with a card this year simply needs to go upstairs to the track shop, which will also sell the programme, and which accepts both card and cash (and Apple Pay and all sorts).  As for downstairs, it'll remain cash only, because there's no way I could sell around 500 in the last hour (which happened at times last year) while faffing around with card payments.

For those who didn't like having to pay online for every meeting, there's now the option of season tickets. Otherwise, anyone introducing or bringing back a speedway track is going to run it as a modern business, which is payment upfront online. Today's call-off has again showed the benefit of ease of transfer - this was even more obvious with the mid-meeting postponement of the Newcastle meeting last year, where everything wasn't left frantically searching for their re-admission ticket. Such antiquated policies went out out the ark - it's now 2023 and not 1983.

As we know, no matter how progressive a promotion is, they will always be people who like to moan (and are fully entitled to have a moan, if they like), because it's not run exactly like it was in 2007.  But it's one reason I rarely come on the BSF these days, because forums are largely redundant and largely populated by people who have little interest in current day speedway.

Speedway does not thrive by operating like it did 15 years ago. It acts like a modern, progressive business, and then like Oxford, it will attract plenty of younger support to go alongside the older die-hard supporters. The die-hards can't sustain a business alone. 

Edited March 29, 2023 by lucifer sam

[Toady]

20 minutes ago, Chris Brown said:

Do you think that it is reasonable that the club respond to a question about this subject though? You can argue the debate was had but never answered

Yes

[Toady]

25 minutes ago, Bojangles said:

I'm debating it with you, so you have no intention of going? You seem to have a massive issue with people bringing this up based on your responses, why don't you just accept not everybody thinks the same way as you? We're all fellow Oxford fans, who ultimately want the best for the club, but it works both ways. You may not feel a £3 increase is excessive (or a £1 increase if you book ahead of time), but there are others that do. That's life. There's no point trying to say they're wrong, because they're not.

No issues but it’s the same old suspects who no longer attend speedway anywhere I expect

[Bojangles]

28 minutes ago, lucifer sam said:

Hi Chris,

The views have been listened to. Jamie asked me about programme sales, and I said occasionally some came into the stadium without cash, and then had to walk half a mile up the road to the nearest cash point to get cash for a programme. As a result, no-one will have to do that this year. Anyone wanting to buy a programme with a card this year simply needs to go upstairs to the track shop, which will also sell the programme, and which accepts both card and cash (and Apple Pay and all sorts).  As for downstairs, it'll remain cash only, because there's no way I could sell around 500 in the last hour (which happened at times last year) while faffing around with card payments.

For those who didn't like having to pay online for every meeting, there's now the option of season tickets. Otherwise, anyone introducing or bringing back a speedway track is going to run it as a modern business, which is payment upfront online. Today's call-off has again showed the benefit of ease of transfer - this was even more obvious with the mid-meeting postponement of the Newcastle meeting last year, where everything wasn't left frantically searching for their re-admission ticket. Such antiquated policies went out out the ark - it's now 2023 and not 1983.

As we know, no matter how progressive a promotion is, they will always be people who like to moan (and are fully entitled to have a moan, if they like), because it's not run exactly like it was in 2007.  But it's one reason I rarely come on the BSF these days, because forums are largely redundant and largely populated by people who have little interest in current day speedway.

Speedway does not thrive by operating like it did 15 years ago. It acts like a modern, progressive business, and then like Oxford, it will attract plenty of younger support to go alongside the older die-hard supporters. The die-hards can't sustain a business alone. 

I hate to say this, but it's posts like this that suggest the exact opposite of fans being listened to. Other than the programme now be available at the track shop, it seems most of what's being raised on here is being taken with a pinch of salt. Saying things like "forums are largely redundant and largely populated by people who have little interest in current day speedway" is just plain wrong.

1) If you only go to Cheetahs meetings (which the majority do based on the difference between attendances), the season ticket option is a bit of a joke. £269 for Cheetahs only matches works out at £24.46 per meeting! Who is going to buy that? Why is there no Cheetahs only season ticket available? I'd be very interested to see how many have actually been sold.

2) Not being able to pay by card on the gate doesn't make Oxford a 'progressive business'. A cashless system arguably does, but making everybody pay ahead of time is crazy. You can pay for most football and cricket matches at the gate, it's only when it's sold out ahead of time that they aren't available. People moan on here because they aren't happy about it, and a good business shouldn't restrict any potential paying customer - it's simply bad business regardless of how many people actually take up the option. Oxford should be trying attract younger support and the die-hards at the same time, why focus on only one demographic? How about try and make everybody happy?

3) Not responding to emails from fans is extremely disappointing. There are numerous examples of fans messaging for a variety of different reasons, and all have fallen on deaf ears.

I'm extremely happy to see Oxford back, but I can't help think that the promotion is currently expecting to get the same crowd levels for the next 10 years. They won't! Last year (and potentially this year), seeing speedway back at Sandy Lane was a novelty. The promotion needs to ensure they keep getting the fans back through the gates, and that means listening to them. History tells us crowd levels at Oxford can go downhill quickly and start to cause problems. Let's hope that doesn't happen.

P.S: If Oxford is running such a modern business model, maybe they should try updating their website regularly. It's still got the 2022 team listed!

Edited March 29, 2023 by Bojangles

[Fromafar]

26 minutes ago, Toady said:

No issues but it’s the same old suspects who no longer attend speedway anywhere I expect

Why would anyone no longer attending be even interested in this issue.I’m afraid it’s your opinion which you seem to think is always right.In this case I would disagree.

[lucifer sam]

9 minutes ago, Bojangles said:

 

P.S: If Oxford is running such a modern business model, maybe they should try updating their website regularly. It's still got the 2022 team listed!

Team – OXFORD SPEEDWAY

Looks like the 2023 team to me!

PS I didn't say anything about still not appealing to the die-hards, who are still there every week.

Edited March 29, 2023 by lucifer sam

[Bojangles]

5 minutes ago, lucifer sam said:

Team – OXFORD SPEEDWAY

Looks like the 2023 team to me!

About time. Only weeks/months after every other team in the league!

Still struggling with this bit, though. 'Oxford Speedway is pleased to confirm six of the seven riders who will represent Oxford Chargers in the National League in 2023 following a successful first campaign'

Edited March 29, 2023 by Bojangles

[steve roberts]

32 minutes ago, Toady said:

No issues but it’s the same old suspects who no longer attend speedway anywhere I expect

...if I still lived in Oxford I would be round in a shot unfortunately living in East Yorkshire "speedways" are a bit thin on the ground and I have to take into account petrol costs and other factors which I won't raise again as no doubt that would raise a negative response.

[Chris Brown]

6 minutes ago, lucifer sam said:

Hi Chris,

The views have been listened to. Jamie asked me about programme sales, and I said occasionally some came into the stadium without cash, and then had to walk half a mile up the road to the nearest cash point to get cash for a programme. As a result, no-one will have to do that this year. Anyone wanting to buy a programme with a card this year simply needs to go upstairs to the track shop, which will also sell the programme, and which accepts both card and cash (and Apple Pay and all sorts).  As for downstairs, it'll remain cash only, because there's no way I could sell around 500 in the last hour (which happened at times last year) while faffing around with card payments.

For those who didn't like having to pay online for every meeting, there's now the option of season tickets. Otherwise, anyone introducing or bringing back a speedway track is going to run it as a modern business, which is payment upfront online. Today's call-off has again showed the benefit of ease of transfer - this was even more obvious with the mid-meeting postponement of the Newcastle meeting last year, where everything wasn't left frantically searching for their re-admission ticket. Such antiquated policies went out out the ark - it's now 2023 and not 1983.

As we know, no matter how progressive a promotion is, they will always be people who like to moan (and are fully entitled to have a moan, if they like), because it's not run exactly like it was in 2007.  But it's one reason I rarely come on the BSF these days, because forums are largely redundant and largely populated by people who have little interest in current day speedway.

Speedway does not thrive by operating like it did 15 years ago. It acts like a modern, progressive business, and then like Oxford, it will attract plenty of younger support to go alongside the older die-hard supporters. The die-hards can't sustain a business alone. 

Apologies for being a luddite Rob and being stuck decades back.

You have addressed none of the points I raised, of course programmes should be cash, its a few quid. Without doubt a fall back of the track shop is positive so well done for that

To argue that a rain off at 1pm justifies the ease of advance payment is nonsense because pay on the gate nobody has bought a ticket as at the point of calling off so struggling with that argument. I do understand that for the one rain off last season it was easier. I would also argue that for the one meeting I purchased in advance and then due to family illness I was unable to attend and therefore lost my £18 was a good argument for NOT having to pay in advance. Its swings and roundabouts but I had no choice but to lose my money.........unless I had paid for insurance. Just for comparison, if I purchase a ticket for Oxford United and cannot attend then OUFC will refund my ticket as long as it was before the game. Oxford Speedway do not offer that luxury

So if you do not want to pay for each meeting in advance at the time you can for EVERY meeting in at the start of the season, OK that is a cracking response, not sure I see the link but then I am stuck in the past. Good to see you dismiss all the fans on here as not interested in modern day speedway, I am sure they are all over the moon with being dismissed as luddites with me 

I did not see my points as a moan, I believe it was constructive and I tried to balance my point with positives and negatives but as I also said there are some who want to blow smoke and will not accept any points. I actually take your comment as somewhat offensive to suggest that a moan because its not like 2007. If that was aimed at me then yep, I am offended. Paying with a debit card is not 2007, its how the vast majority of transactions take place including at all the bars where you do not have to prepay through an app

Having said all that, fair play to you for responding, you are the closest thing to the club who does respond. Out of interest is the club mailbox attended and do you think a response should be expected ? If not then I suggest the club do not publish it, email was of course around in 2007 but is still live today.................unless I have to put my questions in advance in an app !

Just out of interest, you made the point that tracks would have upfront payment with no option on the gate. How many tracks did you visit last year that had no option to pay either with cash or debit card on the day. As its the way forward I am just interested to know

Apologies for daring to say that not everything is perfect. I also do not frequent this forum any more and thank you for reminding me why

 

[Bagpuss]

I really don't think its unreasonable to want or expect to pay on the door by card/phone, we are talking crowds of a few thousand at most. And I think its fair enough to be a bit miffed at paying more for an online ticket on the day than other days. 

[Tim G]

It’s not unusual for motorsport events to be cheaper to get in if you pay in advance.

Silverstone no longer have ticket offices on the day and you buy the ticket in advance and they have a cut off date for cheaper tickets.

[lucifer sam]

3 minutes ago, Tim G said:

It’s not unusual for motorsport events to be cheaper to get in if you pay in advance.

Silverstone no longer have ticket offices on the day and you buy the ticket in advance and they have a cut off date for cheaper tickets.

As has Cardiff for many years.  It's standard practice - an enticement to persuade people to book.

 

[Ovalman]

Apart from the admission and lack of communication issues  the Ox are in the enviable position of being in a catchment area of millions of would be fans, half of London, and with no Swindon or Reading, the Thames Valley, m4 corridor, some of the west country, most of southern England, south Midlands, perhaps a bigger catchment than Belle Vue, around 10 Million? potential supporters. With good promoting and marketing should be very well supported, getting at least 2-3000 regularly per meeting, best supported in Britain, especially in warmer weather. I used to follow Workington, stuck out on a limb on the west Cumbria coast, but still well supported. Teams such as Lynn and Berwick out on a limb with small surrounding population.

Still feel Ox need to be in top div. for massive interest, so fans can watch the top riders, Doyley, Sayfutdinov, Pedersen, etc., It's a far better stadium than the Swindon Shabbey, more seats, better viewing, cleaner bogs, free car parking. They need to have a good season with exciting racing to sustain the fans interest. And to eventually have Premiership status as the Robins did . Speedway not the same without Poole, Coventry, Swindon, Reading in the elite level. Look forward to visit this season.

Edited March 29, 2023 by auntie doris

[Toady]

1 hour ago, Bojangles said:

I hate to say this, but it's posts like this that suggest the exact opposite of fans being listened to. Other than the programme now be available at the track shop, it seems most of what's being raised on here is being taken with a pinch of salt. Saying things like "forums are largely redundant and largely populated by people who have little interest in current day speedway" is just plain wrong.

1) If you only go to Cheetahs meetings (which the majority do based on the difference between attendances), the season ticket option is a bit of a joke. £269 for Cheetahs only matches works out at £24.46 per meeting! Who is going to buy that? Why is there no Cheetahs only season ticket available? I'd be very interested to see how many have actually been sold.

2) Not being able to pay by card on the gate doesn't make Oxford a 'progressive business'. A cashless system arguably does, but making everybody pay ahead of time is crazy. You can pay for most football and cricket matches at the gate, it's only when it's sold out ahead of time that they aren't available. People moan on here because they aren't happy about it, and a good business shouldn't restrict any potential paying customer - it's simply bad business regardless of how many people actually take up the option. Oxford should be trying attract younger support and the die-hards at the same time, why focus on only one demographic? How about try and make everybody happy?

3) Not responding to emails from fans is extremely disappointing. There are numerous examples of fans messaging for a variety of different reasons, and all have fallen on deaf ears.

I'm extremely happy to see Oxford back, but I can't help think that the promotion is currently expecting to get the same crowd levels for the next 10 years. They won't! Last year (and potentially this year), seeing speedway back at Sandy Lane was a novelty. The promotion needs to ensure they keep getting the fans back through the gates, and that means listening to them. History tells us crowd levels at Oxford can go downhill quickly and start to cause problems. Let's hope that doesn't happen.

P.S: If Oxford is running such a modern business model, maybe they should try updating their website regularly. It's still got the 2022 team listed!

You hate to say it because someone has a different view to you 

Edited March 29, 2023 by Toady
Spellling

[Bojangles]

Just now, Toady said:

You hate to say it because some has a different view to you 

And that's your take away from my post? Says it all really.

[Toady]

1 hour ago, Fromafar said:

Why would anyone no longer attending be even interested in this issue.I’m afraid it’s your opinion which you seem to think is always right.In this case I would disagree.

My opinion yes but just as valid as yours and you believe is right.There are plenty of people  who no longer go to speedway on the forum just look at the post above that eludes to the same.