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Birmingham Brummies 2023


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15 minutes ago, noaksey said:

Has anyone ever made any money promoting speedway at Birmingham at this stadium, not including the first season back which must have been successful....presumably 

I think Tony Mole made it pay for most of the seasons he was Promoting with Graham Drury as team manager, Patchett never took up his option to buy so I guess he lost money, Phillips lost money hand over fist so much so that Tony Mole had to rescue them, and now Nigel Tolley seems to be losing money by the bucket loads, National League speedway would have at least limited the loses.

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51 minutes ago, heathen52 said:

I think Tony Mole made it pay for most of the seasons he was Promoting with Graham Drury as team manager, Patchett never took up his option to buy so I guess he lost money, Phillips lost money hand over fist so much so that Tony Mole had to rescue them, and now Nigel Tolley seems to be losing money by the bucket loads, National League speedway would have at least limited the loses.

Not great is it and that's assuming Mole did ok, don't forget the Mason's

Edited by noaksey
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6 minutes ago, noaksey said:

Not great is it and that's assuming Mole did ok, don't forget the Mason's

Whoops yeah, how did I miss the Masons out ?, and if I remember correctly the Cradley promotion also said they lost money at Birmingham when they rode National League, so as you say not great, There does seem to be a consistency no matter who tries.

Edited by heathen52
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I think the future of Birmingham depends on how deep Nigel Tolleys pockets are and how long his enthusiasm lasts, more than attendance numbers. 

I honestly thought Morris was a decent signing and should finish in the top 3 of the averages in this league, but it's just happening for whatever reason 

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3 minutes ago, The Dog said:

I think the future of Birmingham depends on how deep Nigel Tolleys pockets are and how long his enthusiasm lasts, more than attendance numbers. 

I honestly thought Morris was a decent signing and should finish in the top 3 of the averages in this league, but it's just happening for whatever reason 

I suspect the length of that future will depend to an extent on the meeting with the Landlords later this month, if the Landlords want to follow the same pathway as Entain are doing at Monmore, then what's the point in carrying on ?.

Edited by heathen52
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26 minutes ago, the hobbit said:

Predicted costs

divided by number of meetings,

then, number of paying fans at £20 a head , to cover those expected costs. 


simples 

I can't imagine it's easy trying to run a business with 'predicted' costs. Your basically guessing from one week to another and this must be why it's so hard to be sustainable. Maybe riders demands outweigh income? But if you have no riders you have no income and no sport. Maybe it needs wage-capping and going back to amateur status to be sustainable and build from the ground up. 

Obviously some clubs don't seem to be suffering like Birmingham or Newcastle last season but you need more coming in than going out to survive. I know it's basic economics but I wonder how many clubs follow it? 

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7 hours ago, the hobbit said:

Predicted costs

divided by number of meetings,

then, number of paying fans at £20 a head , to cover those expected costs. 


simples 

I was there and that was followed with the more sponsorship we get the the lower that figure becomes. There is more sponsors this year so that figure goes down. The 1000 is without any sponsorship,  so please don't just use the facts that suits your argument.  Nigel Tolley is having a hard enough time at the  moment and like the rest of speedway needs our support. It's easy to kick a dog when it's down.

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The 2018 NDL season saw Brummies and Eastbourne forced up in reality by BSPL, Stoke and Buxton effectively forced out.

Kent are still in but in a very different setting, only Mildenhall and BV Colts remain.

Kent were effectively also forced up after 2019 season although Len I gather seriously considered PL but was blocked out. 

Plymouth were similarly forced up after Somerset folded , Newcastle moved in and quickly out, IOW forced out , Coventry vanished but Landlords Leicester moved in.

It really does emphasise that the ideal scenrio would be an enhanced PL and a development secod tier that hoovers up anyone in CL not riding in PL and bona fide NDL riders with the caveat that those on the Rising Star Scheme have NDL Exemption to ride in NDL for 3-4 seasons.

Two tiers who are self managed by their own Management Committees. 

The issues with many ideally suited to that level has been dictated by a Management Committee not interested in NDL in reality, other than to neuter the product.

Whilst the PL remains a closed shop in terms of numbers the danger is where do Clubs like Poole / Glasgow / Oxfrod gravitate to, whilst the cartel protects the TV money and allows little if any trickle down.

No doubt Messers Bates, Louis and Ford would be in PL, Godfrey would have to decide but i suspect he is very good at managing to a budget at some point below PL that could fit in an enhanced NDL and not impact negatively on his crowd levels or business model. 

 

 

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I said at the beginning of the season Birmingham should have gone National league. Watching a league winning team on smaller wages in front of more fans would make more financial sense. I hope the stadium owners don't kick them out and they can rebuild next year.

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1 hour ago, eric i said:

I said at the beginning of the season Birmingham should have gone National league. Watching a league winning team on smaller wages in front of more fans would make more financial sense. I hope the stadium owners don't kick them out and they can rebuild next year.

I would agree with considering the loss made last season.The entertainment factor is still very good.Could see a couple of other Clubs going the same way IMO

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