Warsaw GP Saturday May 13th 2023

[Bavarian]

1 minute ago, chunky said:

Is it really a joke that the winner of the GP gets the most points?

Yes, because in a speedway GP it is not only one race, it is five heats, two semis, and a final, and points are there to be scored in each and any of these 23 events. 

[chunky]

4 minutes ago, Bavarian said:

Yes, because in a speedway GP it is not only one race, it is five heats, two semis, and a final, and points are there to be scored in each and any of these 23 events. 

That is irrelevant. I don't necessarily like the current points system,  but the winner of a GP SHOULD get the most points. There are better alternatives...

[gbrussell]

I am away on holidays at present so I won't be seeing this GP until at least Thursday. Judging by the comments this was a call that could have gone either way. It did however go in favour of a home rider which does create doubts in fans thoughts. 

I've just searched the live updates site for the decision to exclude Sayfutdinov at Wroclaw in 2021, when Janowski came from behind at speed and clattered into Emil. As the referee was contemplating his decision the home crowd were chanting Janowski over and over again to pressure the referee. Like Warsaw the referee went the way of the home rider. It was however a different referee. 

I will watch the meeting with Interest when I get home. I am getting frustrated with home ground special decisions in other sports, particularly  cricket. Hopefully that is not permeating it's way into speedway.

Edited May 14, 2023 by gbrussell

[screm]

7 hours ago, Falubaz said:

Bullrubbish. Doyle did what Neymar is famous of. 

Since when was Neymar in SGP.

[mikebv]

7 hours ago, Wee Eck said:

Cracking GP from the first heat. I’m not a Holder fan but he must feel robbed, and rightly so. The referee had two decision to make, both involving Zmarzlik, and my view is he got both right. The first one was cut and dried, the second one seems to be controversial. If you watch a rerun and keep your eye on BZ from when he drew level with Doyle as they came off bend 2, then you’ll see he didn’t deviate from his line. After he was ahead of Doyle, Doyle turned into him and Doyle did the Chris Harris jump off (something Doyle criticised Harris for doing!) 

Doyle is usually the master of histrionics but he seemed to take his disqualification more calmly. No pushing cameras away or flouncing into his pit bay. That suggests to me he knew the disqualification was fair. 

Or revenge is a dish best served cold? 

[Chrisdonnelly]

Zmarslik seems to have become an untouchable force in the gps. Everyone is s@#&t scared to race him, the amount of room he was given to pass on the back straight was laughable. Imo he was never getting excluded in the final, Doyle could have stayed on but what would that have achieved….

Edited May 14, 2023 by Chrisdonnelly

[FAST GATER]

51 minutes ago, Chrisdonnelly said:

Zmarslik seems to have become an untouchable force in the gps

This maybe the  case IMO it is not down to the other rider's fear  but due to the fact he is at the top of his game and in a real purple patch ,all the great riders have these periods .Bart great skill is the speed he generates on the bike as to racing room I think that is something he creates himself and  in most cases affords his fellow riders .

With regards to "fear factor" that is Doyle's stock- in- trade he  has used throughout his entire career ,the school bully ended up on his bum last night  rightly or wrongly !

Edited May 14, 2023 by FAST GATER

[Ghostwalker]

Referee decision on Doyle vs Zmarzlik was definitely correct. Its hardly the first time Doyle tries a move like that and perhaps the referees hold him accountable for it. It was the same with Nicki Pedersen who were really hard on the others but was quick to play the victim when others were hard on him.

However I agree that the race should have been awarded to Jack.

[screm]

1 hour ago, Ghostwalker said:

Referee decision on Doyle vs Zmarzlik was definitely correct. Its hardly the first time Doyle tries a move like that and perhaps the referees hold him accountable for it. It was the same with Nicki Pedersen who were really hard on the others but was quick to play the victim when others were hard on him.

However I agree that the race should have been awarded to Jack.

So your saying Doyle was excluded for things he has done in the past.

Watched the incident back a few times and still come to the same conclusion, Zmarzlik knocked Doyle off, it clear and its simple. The referee bottled.

Edited May 14, 2023 by screm

[screm]

2 hours ago, Chrisdonnelly said:

Zmarslik seems to have become an untouchable force in the gps. Everyone is s@#&t scared to race him, the amount of room he was given to pass on the back straight was laughable. Imo he was never getting excluded in the final, Doyle could have stayed on but what would that have achieved….

Agree with you, how many times do we see Zmarzlik get a clear run down the back straight on the first lap, riders need to be moving over to block his run, though after knocking off Doyle last night Zmarzlik would likely call all kinds of mayhem.

[Aries]

9 hours ago, iainb said:

https://twitter.com/iainebrown/status/1657513075187101697?t=M9Lj1_4R7ReHhxzbYNz05w&s=19

Pretty comprehensive that. No surprise that those tiny minority in the “right call” camp have shown a previous dislike of Jason Doyle. Not that their judgment is in any way clouded of course! 

[IainB]

2 minutes ago, Aries said:

Pretty comprehensive that. No surprise that those tiny minority in the “right call” camp have shown a previous dislike of Jason Doyle. Not that their judgment is in any way clouded of course! 

Seems pretty clear cut doesn't it... though if I'd posted it in Polish the numbers may be different 

 

 

[CB252]

Yes, it's as conclusive as it gets, some bloke on twitter that hates Zmarzlik and has 22 followers has started a poll and got the answer he desired 

You lot are hilarious

It was a 50-50 call which Doyle rolled the dice on. Can't blame him as he might have won the re run had it gone his way.

[orion]

2 hours ago, Chrisdonnelly said:

Zmarslik seems to have become an untouchable force in the gps. Everyone is s@#&t scared to race him, the amount of room he was given to pass on the back straight was laughable. Imo he was never getting excluded in the final, Doyle could have stayed on but what would that have achieved….

Not sure about..that..in the re run Holder stuff him up and gave him zero room at all 

[Pinny]

Zmarzlik definitely at fault and the ref bottled it. Clear as day. 
 

Glad Holder slammed the door on him in the re run. 

[FAST GATER]

17 minutes ago, orion said:

Not sure about..that..in the re run Holder stuff him up and gave him zero room at all 

For all Holder's efforts  Bart still ended up about  300mm away from winning the final !

[FAST GATER]

3 minutes ago, Pinny said:

Zmarzlik definitely at fault and the ref bottled it. Clear as day. 
 

Glad Holder slammed the door on him in the re run. 

So Holder's robust action is to be admired but Bart 's is unacceptable !

[AFCB Wildcat]

This type of incident has been discussed many times and as usual people see it different ways.

For a long time, the falling rider getting the decision was the default decision by referees, so this is what people expect, but it seems now that the tide is turning a bit. 

For me, Doyle left Zmarzlik a gap coming off bend 2 that he was inevitably going to take and he was passed. While I agree with the comments saying that Doyle didn't lean in on Zmarzlik, and that he continued on his natural line, was that wise when you know that someone else is already on that line now?

Zmarzlik didn't move towards Doyle either, and had nowhere else to go, but Doyle had probably 70% of the track width available to him to avoid the collision. 

It's racing, and we all want to see close racing, so this type of incident is inevitable unfortunately. It was a racing incident and without prejudice, I think the referee got it right.

[CB252]

6 minutes ago, Pinny said:

Zmarzlik definitely at fault and the ref bottled it. Clear as day. 
 

Glad Holder slammed the door on him in the re run. 

He should have laid it down and played the game.  Or, you know, show some balls and race 

Doyle must have been to the Verstappen school of driving. He has someone alongside him that actually has a wheel ahead when they get to the turn, and he expects them to disappear into thin air.

[CB252]

1 minute ago, AFCB Wildcat said:

This type of incident has been discussed many times and as usual people see it different ways.

For a long time, the falling rider getting the decision was the default decision by referees, so this is what people expect, but it seems now that the tide is turning a bit. 

For me, Doyle left Zmarzlik a gap coming off bend 2 that he was inevitably going to take and he was passed. While I agree with the comments saying that Doyle didn't lean in on Zmarzlik, and that he continued on his natural line, was that wise when you know that someone else is already on that line now?

Zmarzlik didn't move towards Doyle either, and had nowhere else to go, but Doyle had probably 70% of the track width available to him to avoid the collision. 

It's racing, and we all want to see close racing, so this type of incident is inevitable unfortunately. It was a racing incident and without prejudice, I think the referee got it right.

Spot on