Peter Collins Book

[RoundTheBoards]

Since we lost Peter Craven in 1963 and the first World Pairs Championship wasn't staged until 1968, it's hardly surprising that Craven's total number of World Pairs title wins exactly matches the total number of terminal cancer patients he callously insulted.

[OveFundinFan]

I assume none on here know exactly how Peter Collins stroke has affected him. I assume you all seen the current adverts on TV where quick action is needed to treat a stroke victim - remember the advert uses F.A.S.T. (face, arms, speech, time). The internet has just informed that every minute a stroke is not attended 1.9 billion brain cells die. So how long was PC not attended that morning he had the stroke.              
The internet also informed me a stroke can affect different parts of the brain, and therefore different functions. I know that by exprience. My dad, in his late 80’s dropped one morning, well over an hour (we don’t know how long) before he was found in a coma. Never recovered, 4 days later he died. He was worrying about mum, his wife for over 60 years. She had a number of strokes, such that when she died some 2 years after her first stroke she couldn’t do anything for herself. Internet also informs me one type of stroke affects logical thinking. Maybe that’s the type of stroke PC suffered, no one here probably knows. But if that is the case it could be why he acted the way he did that night signing books.                    
As my mum and dad died of a stroke(s), I am being treated as likely to have a stroke. I just hope if I survive and my actions are at times unusual, even offensive, people around me will cut me some slack.  We are all imperfect humans and at times will, and do, offend others.
 

Edited February 17, 2023 by OveFundinFan

[JC!]

Again, PC put himself in a position where he wrote, and publicised, his book - those around him, including his publisher, knew his condition.

You can carry on excusing him, but, he was out of order and has apologised accordingly.

[Vic Meldrew]

22 hours ago, JC! said:

What do his riding achievements have to do with this? Or are you just being juvenile and spiteful?

Maybe contact him about this, he seems like a reasonable person and would likely hear you out.

Thank you for those few kind words.

I was responding to Ian Corcoran's post of 16/2/2023 where he seems to be comparing the respective status of Peter Collins with that of Mark Lemon. I am well aware of the riding achievements of Peter Collins and everything he has done for Belle Vue throughout the years but I am not familiar with Mark Lemon's riding achievements.

Perhaps you can elucidate how the comments can be classified as juvenile or spiteful.

[IanCorcoran]

1 hour ago, Vic Meldrew said:

Thank you for those few kind words.

I was responding to Ian Corcoran's post of 16/2/2023 where he seems to be comparing the respective status of Peter Collins with that of Mark Lemon. I am well aware of the riding achievements of Peter Collins and everything he has done for Belle Vue throughout the years but I am not familiar with Mark Lemon's riding achievements.

Perhaps you can elucidate how the comments can be classified as juvenile or spiteful.

You really have got hold of the wrong end of the snooker cue. I make NO mention of comparing the riding status of Peter Collins and Mark Lemon. I will let you re-read the section :-

 I noticed in his book that ''all Mark Lemon needs to do is go to his house and sort it out with him'' which suggests he still believes he is the 'A' aide as they would say in boxing. He still believes he holds the power position and that is simply delusional.  

Please show me where I compare the respective riding achievements? Mark Lemon is the PROMOTER at Belle Vue Speedway and the person making the call on who does and does not enter on a free pass. Not Peter Collins. I also quote directly from his book. I do not compare them as speedway riders. For some strange and bizarre reason - you do. 

[JC!]

3 hours ago, Vic Meldrew said:

Thank you for those few kind words.

I was responding to Ian Corcoran's post of 16/2/2023 where he seems to be comparing the respective status of Peter Collins with that of Mark Lemon. I am well aware of the riding achievements of Peter Collins and everything he has done for Belle Vue throughout the years but I am not familiar with Mark Lemon's riding achievements.

Perhaps you can elucidate how the comments can be classified as juvenile or spiteful.

Yeah sure you did. Might be easier to believe if Ian had compared their riding careers - you just took the opportunity to take a cheap shot.

At least be big enough to accept that when you are called out, back pedalling like this makes you look, quite frankly ridiculous. 

[steve roberts]

One of the best races I ever witnessed was between PC (guesting for Dave Morton) and White City's Gordon Kennett at Hackney in 1977. They rode shoulder to shoulder for the entire four laps (PC on the outside and Gordon the inside) giving each other plenty of room to race and finished a "dead heat" as they crossed the line...great stuff!

[nw42]

23 minutes ago, steve roberts said:

One of the best races I ever witnessed was between PC (guesting for Dave Morton) and White City's Gordon Kennett at Hackney in 1977. They rode shoulder to shoulder for the entire four laps (PC on the outside and Gordon the inside) giving each other plenty of room to race and finished a "dead heat" as they crossed the line...great stuff!

Great post, enough description to create a picture in the minds eye of that race, the noise, smell, crowd noise, brilliant.    I was fortunate enough to see the run-off between PC & Michanek in the 73 cup final, said by those present to be the best race they had ever seen.  I can still take myself back to that night and recall the excitement.

[steve roberts]

27 minutes ago, nw42 said:

Great post, enough description to create a picture in the minds eye of that race, the noise, smell, crowd noise, brilliant.    I was fortunate enough to see the run-off between PC & Michanek in the 73 cup final, said by those present to be the best race they had ever seen.  I can still take myself back to that night and recall the excitement.

That's a race I would have enjoyed...it's written down in speedway folklore.

My first visit to Hyde Road (1984) I remember well a race involving Hans Nielsen, PC & Chris Morton. Hans made the gate and tried to cover as much of the track as possible as PC & Mort were buzzing around his rear wheel and they both eventually passed him...one on the outside the other the inside and there was nothing that Hans could do about it!

Going back to the 1973 PC & Mich encounter I recall that PC was operating both the clutch and throttle on the same right (?) handlebar...quite a feat!

Edited February 18, 2023 by steve roberts

[Vic Meldrew]

3 hours ago, IanCorcoran said:

You really have got hold of the wrong end of the snooker cue. I make NO mention of comparing the riding status of Peter Collins and Mark Lemon. I will let you re-read the section

Thank you Ian.

I never said that you were comparing the riding status of the two parties. I said that you seem to be comparing the status of Peter Collins and Mark Lemon. If this interpretation is incorrect then my apologies for any misunderstanding.

I am well aware that Mark Lemon is the manager of Belle Vue and that Peter Collins is a retired ex rider. If we were comparing the status of the two parties in this apparent dispute over free passes for ex riders how would you compare the status of the two parties and what criteria would you use? You say that PC still thinks that he holds the power position and that he is delusional. How do you know this as a fact? 

[Vic Meldrew]

2 hours ago, JC! said:

Yeah sure you did. Might be easier to believe if Ian had compared their riding careers - you just took the opportunity to take a cheap shot.

At least be big enough to accept that when you are called out, back pedalling like this makes you look, quite frankly ridiculous. 

Thanks, JC - but you have not answered my question regarding an explanation for the terms "juvenile" and "spiteful".  Apparently I have now been "called out" and that it is a "cheap shot"!!! 

[nw42]

26 minutes ago, steve roberts said:

That's a race I would have enjoyed...it's written down in speedway folklore.

My first visit to Hyde Road (1984) I remember well a race involving Hans Nielsen, PC & Chris Morton. Hans made the gate and tried to cover as much of the track as possible as PC & Mort were buzzing around his rear wheel and they both eventually passed him...one on the outside the other the inside and there was nothing that Hans could do about it!

Going back to the 1973 PC & Mich encounter I recall that PC was operating both the clutch and throttle on the same right (?) handlebar...quite a feat!

Yes he did, right handlebar, also Mich was on Bernie Leigh's bike, not one known for speed round Hyde Rd Bernie irrc but Mich had it working like a dream in that race.  The other day I came across an audio commentary of the meeting on cd, no idea where I got it but I did have a quick listen and then fast forwarded to 'that race', great to hear.  

[JC!]

11 minutes ago, Vic Meldrew said:

Thanks, JC - but you have not answered my question regarding an explanation for the terms "juvenile" and "spiteful".  Apparently I have now been "called out" and that it is a "cheap shot"!!! 

Here you are, attempting to take the moral high ground - fooling nobody. Oh, and I'm not here to answer your questions so you'll have a long wait. 

[IanCorcoran]

17 minutes ago, Vic Meldrew said:

Thank you Ian.

I never said that you were comparing the riding status of the two parties. I said that you seem to be comparing the status of Peter Collins and Mark Lemon. If this interpretation is incorrect then my apologies for any misunderstanding.

I am well aware that Mark Lemon is the manager of Belle Vue and that Peter Collins is a retired ex rider. If we were comparing the status of the two parties in this apparent dispute over free passes for ex riders how would you compare the status of the two parties and what criteria would you use? You say that PC still thinks that he holds the power position and that he is delusional. How do you know this as a fact? 

I am going to simplify as much as possible. You have either not read my prior posts or are unable to absorb information and facts presented. I am not too sure but I will give you the benefit of the doubt.

You brought the word status into the conversation, so I will go with that if it helps.

The promoter of the speedway club decides who comes in on a free pass. The ex-rider who has no status in this decision making process does not. 

The criteria I would use if I was the promoter would be - I own the P&L and I am responsible for the financial success or failure of the club. Therefore I will make the call as to who gets in for free. This will not be decided for me and certainly not by an ex-rider who wants 100s of his associates and cronies to come in for free week in, week out. I also will not be told what I can and cannot do by a long retired ex-rider. 

For 7 years, said ex-rider has pursued a quest that he is never going to attain and believes he can on the basis of his own perceived status of himself that he has the power to enforce this. That in my book is delusional. 

I go back to another post (which you should read or re-read) - he has issued demands and threats for the above to be enforced, not requests. He is not entitled to it. End of. 

If Peter Collins decides to buy Belle Vue tomorrow and has a successful bid accepted (watch out for pigs flying in the skies over Gorton) then he is fully entitled as the business owner to decides who does and does not enter for free. Based on 1988 when he did have the promotion status - he did not issue passes to many, many riders. Hypocrisy of the highest order.

Great rider, fantastic achievements and represented his country on the world stage

Based on my own experience - despicable human being. 

 

[JC!]

3 minutes ago, IanCorcoran said:

I am going to simplify as much as possible. You have either not read my prior posts or are unable to absorb information and facts presented. I am not too sure but I will give you the benefit of the doubt.

You brought the word status into the conversation, so I will go with that if it helps.

The promoter of the speedway club decides who comes in on a free pass. The ex-rider who has no status in this decision making process does not. 

The criteria I would use if I was the promoter would be - I own the P&L and I am responsible for the financial success or failure of the club. Therefore I will make the call as to who gets in for free. This will not be decided for me and certainly not by an ex-rider who wants 100s of his associates and cronies to come in for free week in, week out. I also will not be told what I can and cannot do by a long retired ex-rider. 

For 7 years, said ex-rider has pursued a quest that he is never going to attain and believes he can on the basis of his own perceived status of himself that he has the power to enforce this. That in my book is delusional. 

I go back to another post (which you should read or re-read) - he has issued demands and threats for the above to be enforced, not requests. He is not entitled to it. End of. 

If Peter Collins decides to buy Belle Vue tomorrow and has a successful bid accepted (watch out for pigs flying in the skies over Gorton) then he is fully entitled as the business owner to decides who does and does not enter for free. Based on 1988 when he did have the promotion status - he did not issue passes to many, many riders. Hypocrisy of the highest order.

Great rider, fantastic achievements and represented his country on the world stage

Based on my own experience - despicable human being. 

 

Good post, very clear.

[steve roberts]

37 minutes ago, nw42 said:

Yes he did, right handlebar, also Mich was on Bernie Leigh's bike, not one known for speed round Hyde Rd Bernie irrc but Mich had it working like a dream in that race.  The other day I came across an audio commentary of the meeting on cd, no idea where I got it but I did have a quick listen and then fast forwarded to 'that race', great to hear.  

36 minutes ago, nw42 said:

 

Was that by Wally Loak by any chance?

[nw42]

7 minutes ago, steve roberts said:

Was that by Wally Loak by any chance?

Unsure, would have to revisit, which I will when I get chance, to establish who it is, not that I would recognise his voice, hopefully an introduction at the start will help.

[steve roberts]

11 minutes ago, nw42 said:

Unsure, would have to revisit, which I will when I get chance, to establish who it is, not that I would recognise his voice, hopefully an introduction at the start will help.

...his commentary style often went something like "Chase, chase, chase!"

[chunky]

35 minutes ago, IanCorcoran said:

believes he can on the basis of his own perceived status of himself that he has the power to enforce this.

Sadly, there are a lot of people who seem to feel that way these days...

[mikebv]

21 hours ago, OveFundinFan said:

I assume none on here know exactly how Peter Collins stroke has affected him. I assume you all seen the current adverts on TV where quick action is needed to treat a stroke victim - remember the advert uses F.A.S.T. (face, arms, speech, time). The internet has just informed that every minute a stroke is not attended 1.9 billion brain cells die. So how long was PC not attended that morning he had the stroke.              
The internet also informed me a stroke can affect different parts of the brain, and therefore different functions. I know that by exprience. My dad, in his late 80’s dropped one morning, well over an hour (we don’t know how long) before he was found in a coma. Never recovered, 4 days later he died. He was worrying about mum, his wife for over 60 years. She had a number of strokes, such that when she died some 2 years after her first stroke she couldn’t do anything for herself. Internet also informs me one type of stroke affects logical thinking. Maybe that’s the type of stroke PC suffered, no one here probably knows. But if that is the case it could be why he acted the way he did that night signing books.                    
As my mum and dad died of a stroke(s), I am being treated as likely to have a stroke. I just hope if I survive and my actions are at times unusual, even offensive, people around me will cut me some slack.  We are all imperfect humans and at times will, and do, offend others.
 

Post...

Well done....

No one will know what impact such things will have...

Edited February 18, 2023 by mikebv