Peter Collins Book

[mikebv]

3 hours ago, falcace said:

WWE is hardly dripping with credibility.

I am being a tad facetious of course. I accept speedway's lack of credibility is an issue. But its not the biggest issue. If you had a time machine and brought 70s and 80s British Speedway back to the modern day and presented that to a 2023 audience, it would still be badly struggling.  

I would suggest it is the biggest issue with regards to getting big sponsorship on board from major companies...

Betard would drop Wroclaw like a stone if Majic went guesting for another team, and top scored for them in a win, with that team then subsequently beating Wroclaw by a point to the last play off place..

Something that easily can and does happen over here...

The league too will never get major sponsorship given its "Mickey Mouse" reputation...

There is a very good reason Poland hasnt followed the UK operating model and its because they have seen the results of it...

[Ray Stadia]

1 hour ago, steve roberts said:

I remember at Cowley on one occasion that the sound system had failed on the back straight and the fans were without public announcements for a number of meetings (?) because the owners were in no hurry to put it right and you can imagine the fans reaction?

That isn't good, but why didn't the promoter sort it? Even if he/she had to dip into their own pocket? 

[steve roberts]

11 minutes ago, Ray Stadia said:

That isn't good, but why didn't the promoter sort it? Even if he/she had to dip into their own pocket? 

...to be honest I can't recall the outcome now or how it was resolved? The Stadium owners weren't that concerned and it wasn't treated as high priority because the stadium was managed by a Dog racing fraternity (GRA?) and nobody used to stand on the back straight during meetings...all residing in the grandstand.

[steve roberts]

8 hours ago, steve roberts said:

...to be honest I can't recall the outcome now or how it was resolved? The Stadium owners weren't that concerned and it wasn't treated as high priority because the stadium was managed by a Dog racing fraternity (GRA?) and nobody used to stand on the back straight during meetings...all residing in the grandstand.

On another note, if I recall, the SKOL sponsorship that the "Cheetahs" attracted during the eighties/early nineties wasn't based on a monetary incentive but the stadium having their bar outlets supplied by the Beer Company and therefore of no direct benefit to the speedway and/or stadium? I'd be happy to be told differently but that's how it was explained to me at the time?

[Ray Stadia]

2 hours ago, steve roberts said:

On another note, if I recall, the SKOL sponsorship that the "Cheetahs" attracted during the eighties/early nineties wasn't based on a monetary incentive but the stadium having their bar outlets supplied by the Beer Company and therefore of no direct benefit to the speedway and/or stadium? I'd be happy to be told differently but that's how it was explained to me at the time?

Maybe a few free pints for the promoter! 

[TonyMac]

From the final chapter of PC's book:

I STILL love speedway and don’t like to think that it is in its death throes but a lot of things seem to point that way.

I was fortunate enough to ride in what was a golden age for British speedway, in the 1970s and early 80s, and things have gone downhill since then. Make no mistake, British speedway is in crisis, with promoters and riders battling the effects of crippling running costs, dwindling attendances and very few major sponsors.

A lot of tracks are on the brink, struggling to keep going. Hardly a year goes by without another closure. As I write, at least three clubs operating in 2022 may not be around next year.

Speedway gets hardly any publicity in the national media these days and I think one of the reasons for that, and why crowds are down, is because there have been too many rule changes. Some of them are a joke and fans are sick of it. Their patience and loyalty has been tested to the limit.

How can we expect the sport to be taken seriously by the media or non-fans when teams are so heavily dependent on guests and the rider replacement facility? There is clearly a shortage of quality riders but for most of them to be doubling-up (or doubling-down) and appearing for different clubs each week is farcical and leaves speedway’s credibility in tatters.

Even if disenfranchised supporters can be lured back and much-needed new ones found from somewhere, how will British speedway keep them when so much about the way the sport is being run is wrong? Stadium facilities are an issue at many places but clubs who rent their tracks where greyhounds, and maybe stock cars, are also staged have their hands tied. The woeful state of dilapidated stands and toilet facilities are beyond their control. 

All the continental countries have youth training schemes or community stadiums which encourage kids to become speedway riders. Too many of our tracks are bound by council regulations and curfews.

[ch958]

7 hours ago, steve roberts said:

On another note, if I recall, the SKOL sponsorship that the "Cheetahs" attracted during the eighties/early nineties wasn't based on a monetary incentive but the stadium having their bar outlets supplied by the Beer Company and therefore of no direct benefit to the speedway and/or stadium? I'd be happy to be told differently but that's how it was explained to me at the time?

I believe Radio station sponsors were the same - free radio ads/ reporting in return for being called Signal Potters, Radio Tees Tigers, etc

[Ray Stadia]

15 minutes ago, TonyMac said:

From the final chapter of PC's book:

I STILL love speedway and don’t like to think that it is in its death throes but a lot of things seem to point that way.

I was fortunate enough to ride in what was a golden age for British speedway, in the 1970s and early 80s, and things have gone downhill since then. Make no mistake, British speedway is in crisis, with promoters and riders battling the effects of crippling running costs, dwindling attendances and very few major sponsors.

A lot of tracks are on the brink, struggling to keep going. Hardly a year goes by without another closure. As I write, at least three clubs operating in 2022 may not be around next year.

Speedway gets hardly any publicity in the national media these days and I think one of the reasons for that, and why crowds are down, is because there have been too many rule changes. Some of them are a joke and fans are sick of it. Their patience and loyalty has been tested to the limit.

How can we expect the sport to be taken seriously by the media or non-fans when teams are so heavily dependent on guests and the rider replacement facility? There is clearly a shortage of quality riders but for most of them to be doubling-up (or doubling-down) and appearing for different clubs each week is farcical and leaves speedway’s credibility in tatters.

Even if disenfranchised supporters can be lured back and much-needed new ones found from somewhere, how will British speedway keep them when so much about the way the sport is being run is wrong? Stadium facilities are an issue at many places but clubs who rent their tracks where greyhounds, and maybe stock cars, are also staged have their hands tied. The woeful state of dilapidated stands and toilet facilities are beyond their control. 

All the continental countries have youth training schemes or community stadiums which encourage kids to become speedway riders. Too many of our tracks are bound by council regulations and curfews.

In fairness, we all knew Peter's comments, but decent inner town/city, new stadiums are not going to happen, in this over populated, demand for housing country we live in. I have said it before, a 'track in a field' is more likely the future for speedway's survival, along with the sport being more amateurish, although and perhaps, many fans feel the sport is amateurish now. 

[arnieg]

1 hour ago, ch958 said:

I believe Radio station sponsors were the same - free radio ads/ reporting in return for being called Signal Potters, Radio Tees Tigers, etc

Definitely the case for Radio Trent Invaders.

[JC!]

2 hours ago, TonyMac said:

From the final chapter of PC's book:

I STILL love speedway and don’t like to think that it is in its death throes but a lot of things seem to point that way.

I was fortunate enough to ride in what was a golden age for British speedway, in the 1970s and early 80s, and things have gone downhill since then. Make no mistake, British speedway is in crisis, with promoters and riders battling the effects of crippling running costs, dwindling attendances and very few major sponsors.

A lot of tracks are on the brink, struggling to keep going. Hardly a year goes by without another closure. As I write, at least three clubs operating in 2022 may not be around next year.

Speedway gets hardly any publicity in the national media these days and I think one of the reasons for that, and why crowds are down, is because there have been too many rule changes. Some of them are a joke and fans are sick of it. Their patience and loyalty has been tested to the limit.

How can we expect the sport to be taken seriously by the media or non-fans when teams are so heavily dependent on guests and the rider replacement facility? There is clearly a shortage of quality riders but for most of them to be doubling-up (or doubling-down) and appearing for different clubs each week is farcical and leaves speedway’s credibility in tatters.

Even if disenfranchised supporters can be lured back and much-needed new ones found from somewhere, how will British speedway keep them when so much about the way the sport is being run is wrong? Stadium facilities are an issue at many places but clubs who rent their tracks where greyhounds, and maybe stock cars, are also staged have their hands tied. The woeful state of dilapidated stands and toilet facilities are beyond their control. 

All the continental countries have youth training schemes or community stadiums which encourage kids to become speedway riders. Too many of our tracks are bound by council regulations and curfews.

Business practice in speedway has not noticeably changed in many years, this could have been written 30 years ago. 

The sport needs to lose the victim mentality, 'our hands are tied by circumstance'. The opportunities are out there to go after, and they have far less to do with minor rule changes than they do with modern communication/ 'cheap' media.

[mikebv]

On 1/19/2023 at 3:26 PM, JC! said:

Business practice in speedway has not noticeably changed in many years, this could have been written 30 years ago. 

The sport needs to lose the victim mentality, 'our hands are tied by circumstance'. The opportunities are out there to go after, and they have far less to do with minor rule changes than they do with modern communication/ 'cheap' media.

70 million live in GB...

Many millions of which live 45 mins or less away from a track...

That many dont even know about the "local track",and even the professional sport that takes place there, is simply down to the custodians of the sports' lack of capability in getting their message out there...

Maybe ensuring every track has to put £20k into a joined up national marketing scheme would be a better idea than just paying out literally hundreds of thousands per track to riders who few of the local populace would ever have heard of..

Similar to the way they ran meetings to pay for air fences, why not do the same to raise some marketing budget...?

[Ray Stadia]

2 hours ago, mikebv said:

70 million live in GB...

Many millions of which live 45 mins or less away from a track...

That many dont even know about the "local track",and even the professional sport that takes place there, is simply down to the custodians of the sports' lack of capability in getting their message out there...

Maybe ensuring every track has to put £20k into a joined up national marketing scheme would be a better idea than just paying out literally hundreds of thousands per track to riders who few of the local populace would ever have heard of..

Similar to the way they ran meetings to pay for air fences, why not do the same to raise some marketing budget...?

I can't see forcing every promoter, to stump up £20,000.00 (might have to be every year), will be music to the ears of promoters, who are likely losing money each season anyway. Marketing, I believe, with a bit of thought, can be achieved without huge expense. For a start, the riders should be prepared to market themselves during the season and without receiving a fee!, i.e. high streets, shopping malls. Make better use of local press, local radio stations, including the internet radio stations. Make use of fans to assist with marketing, such as, bring a friend/family member along for free. Have a track pick-up van with an advert attached to it, with perhaps a bike also on the van, driving around the locality a few days before each meeting. Just ideas!        

[steve roberts]

1 hour ago, Ray Stadia said:

I can't see forcing every promoter, to stump up £20,000.00 (might have to be every year), will be music to the ears of promoters, who are likely losing money each season anyway. Marketing, I believe, with a bit of thought, can be achieved without huge expense. For a start, the riders should be prepared to market themselves during the season and without receiving a fee!, i.e. high streets, shopping malls. Make better use of local press, local radio stations, including the internet radio stations. Make use of fans to assist with marketing, such as, bring a friend/family member along for free. Have a track pick-up van with an advert attached to it, with perhaps a bike also on the van, driving around the locality a few days before each meeting. Just ideas!        

...recall one time Weymouth promoter Mervyn Stewkesbury driving round Weymouth with placards advertising the meeting due to take place that evening. I even remember seeing posters around Oxford/Eastbourne advertising the speedway...had one on my bedroom wall for years! Apparently Len Silver used to post adverts all around the Hackney area? I personally used to take friends/work colleagues to meetings in the hope that it would ignite a spark.

[nw42]

1 hour ago, Ray Stadia said:

I can't see forcing every promoter, to stump up £20,000.00 (might have to be every year), will be music to the ears of promoters, who are likely losing money each season anyway. Marketing, I believe, with a bit of thought, can be achieved without huge expense. For a start, the riders should be prepared to market themselves during the season and without receiving a fee!, i.e. high streets, shopping malls. Make better use of local press, local radio stations, including the internet radio stations. Make use of fans to assist with marketing, such as, bring a friend/family member along for free. Have a track pick-up van with an advert attached to it, with perhaps a bike also on the van, driving around the locality a few days before each meeting. Just ideas!        

In Gorton mate, not happening, the bike would be gone at the first set of traffic lights on red.

[JC!]

On 1/18/2023 at 5:22 PM, Ray Stadia said:

Personally, I don't think it matters whether a promoter owns or rents a stadium. If the promotion is a success, the stadium owner will be happy to co-operate with updating facilities, so long as the promoter is able to assist with the costs, which he/she would be prepared to, if the crowds were good. Even when speedway has had promoters who own stadiums, things haven't always worked out, for one reason or another, Cradley, Coventry, Arena Essex (successful stock cars), Weymouth, Newport, possibly Stoke?, possibly Somerset?. The Duggan family own Eastbourne, but that doesn't seem to be helping speedway to run there. 

Agreed, but, most importantly, few sports suit social media as well as speedway could. Sometimes the simplest ideas can be the most effective when executed well...

 

Edit

Picked up wrong post to quote, should have been your latest one on here.

Edited January 21, 2023 by JC!

[Ray Stadia]

7 hours ago, JC! said:

Agreed, but, most importantly, few sports suit social media as well as speedway could. Sometimes the simplest ideas can be the most effective when executed well...

 

Edit

Picked up wrong post to quote, should have been your latest one on here.

That is true, but with social media, people have to be looking for speedway to see what is going on in speedway. Unless you mean advertising on something like Facebook, which then costs a lot of money and would be national, perhaps international. A local track should, in my opinion, keep it simple (their track advertising) and make it something that people can see for real and not over the net. I live in Ipswich and I hear nothing locally about the Witches. Very occasionally a tiny snipet on local radio.  

[steve roberts]

10 minutes ago, Ray Stadia said:

That is true, but with social media, people have to be looking for speedway to see what is going on in speedway. Unless you mean advertising on something like Facebook, which then costs a lot of money and would be national, perhaps international. A local track should, in my opinion, keep it simple (their track advertising) and make it something that people can see for real and not over the net. I live in Ipswich and I hear nothing locally about the Witches. Very occasionally a tiny snipet on local radio.  

We were fortunate at Oxford that Track Presenter, Peter York, also had a regular programme on Radio Oxford so the speedway got lots of air time and interviews with riders and  with Promoter Bernard Crappper in particular. The Oxford Mail, with John Gaisford, also gave the sport a high profile in the city and beyond.

[Ray Stadia]

36 minutes ago, steve roberts said:

We were fortunate at Oxford that Track Presenter, Peter York, also had a regular programme on Radio Oxford so the speedway got lots of air time and interviews with riders and  with Promoter Bernard Crappper in particular. The Oxford Mail, with John Gaisford, also gave the sport a high profile in the city and beyond.

Assuming Radio Oxford are still in operation, I hope they are giving the same support for the new venture! 

[topaz325]

Agree with much has been said, social media and van and bike display pre season, rider competitions and raffles to win kit such as team shirts , race jackets, make sponsorship simple even small amounts to help club/riders to be part of the whole team ethic.

[steve roberts]

2 hours ago, topaz325 said:

Agree with much has been said, social media and van and bike display pre season, rider competitions and raffles to win kit such as team shirts , race jackets, make sponsorship simple even small amounts to help club/riders to be part of the whole team ethic.

...I did some school talks pre-season and was promised a bike to take along but nothing materialised!