Why Did Riders Adopt Different Styles?

[steve roberts]

I've purposely placed this is the "Years Gone By" section as riders styles nowadays tend to look all the same but in the past they varied greatly and it has always intrigued me how that was so?

A rider's height obviously had a massive influence but when you study a riders particular style the position of the right forearm would vary. Some would place it over the right handlebar whereas others perpendicular to aid throttle control. Some would stand hign on the footrest and some remain seated when cornering. There were the "armchair" stylists (Anders Michanek) and the "tank slappers" (Gordon and David Kennett for example). In the Kennett's case the size of Arlington and its tight bends may have influenced them however the likes of Roger Johns and Malcolm Ballard (who had a style all of his own) had different approaches around Eastbourne.

The "Briggos" rode with their heads very much over the left handlebar and some riders tended to trail their leg before it came the norm (Richard Greer). Leigh Adams had an armchair, almost crab, style.

Of course there were the "harum-scarum" brigade (Kelly Moran and John Cook) who took what appeared impossible odds when on a bike...in fact John Cook once slid off and at the same time climbed back on his bike to continue the race in one swift movement. I guess that these riders had a natural ability that many others didn't poccess or the nerve to ride "on the edge"?

Some riders would sit high up on the tank and others well back on the seat obviously to get the maximum grip.

I sometimes wonder if I had passed thru' one of Olle Nygren Training Schools what style I would have adopted or come naturally to me?

Edited August 23, 2022 by steve roberts

[customhouseregular]

2 hours ago, steve roberts said:

I've purposely placed this is the "Years Gone By" section as riders styles nowadays tend to look all the same but in the past they varied greatly and it has always intrigued me how that was so?

A rider's height obviously had a massive influence but when you study a riders particular style the position of the right forearm would vary. Some would place it over the right handlebar whereas others perpendicular to aid throttle control. Some would stand hign on the footrest and some remain seated when cornering. There were the "armchair" stylists (Anders Michanek) and the "tank slappers" (Gordon and David Kennett for example). In the Kennett's case the size of Arlington and its tight bends may have influenced them however the likes of Roger Johns and Malcolm Ballard (who had a style all of his own) had different approaches around Eastbourne.

The "Briggos" rode with their heads very much over the left handlebar and some riders tended to trail their leg before it came the norm (Richard Greer). Leigh Adams had an armchair, almost crab, style.

Of course there were the "harum-scarum" brigade (Kelly Moran and John Cook) who took what appeared impossible odds when on a bike...in fact John Cook once slid off and at the same time climbed back on his bike to continue the race in one swift movement. I guess that these riders had a natural ability that many others didn't poccess or the nerve to ride "on the edge"?

Some riders would sit high up on the tank and others well back on the seat obviously to get the maximum grip.

I sometimes wonder if I had passed thru' one of Olle Nygren Training Schools what style I would have adopted or come naturally to me?

Very interesting post.

[steve roberts]

4 minutes ago, customhouseregular said:

Very interesting post.

I remember reading that Norman Parker (?) instructed a fresh Bob Kilby to have a peg fitted on the frame of the bike because he used to sit almost on the fuel tank rather than the seat!

I guess that different bikes ie J.A.P. and the Jawa (ESO) would require different techniques also?

[False dawn]

One aspect of racing styles that I guess I took for granted back in the day (70's) was a rider putting weight on the right footrest. Thinking about it, riding styles started from there and varied from there up, so-to-speak. Then someone came along and showed it was not necessary to put any pressure on the footrest. The one that springs to mind is Bobby Ott. I'm sure he wasn't the first, but the first time I saw him corner with his right leg pointing horizontal, his knee on the saddle and his foot miles off the peg, I just stood there with my mouth open wondering how the hell he could do that. In the modern era, riders seem to rest their right foot on the peg without applying any great pressure. Indeed you'll see riders flick their leg to right when trying to regain their balance. 

And then there is the left leg forward, "supporting" the bike aspect of all this. - Discuss

A simplistic analysis, as I'm sure some will tell me. Just a personal observation.

[steve roberts]

12 minutes ago, False dawn said:

One aspect of racing styles that I guess I took for granted back in the day (70's) was a rider putting weight on the right footrest. Thinking about it, riding styles started from there and varied from there up, so-to-speak. Then someone came along and showed it was not necessary to put any pressure on the footrest. The one that springs to mind is Bobby Ott. I'm sure he wasn't the first, but the first time I saw him corner with his right leg pointing horizontal, his knee on the saddle and his foot miles off the peg, I just stood there with my mouth open wondering how the hell he could do that. In the modern era, riders seem to rest their right foot on the peg without applying any great pressure. Indeed you'll see riders flick their leg to right when trying to regain their balance. 

And then there is the left leg forward, "supporting" the bike aspect of all this. - Discuss

A simplistic analysis, as I'm sure some will tell me. Just a personal observation.

When I "rode" at one of Olle's Schools this was emphasised but we are talking the early eighties. In fact the idea was to place the left foot in line with the front wheel to help steer the bike thru' the bend. Not sure when the modern "leg trailing" kicked in but you wouldn't have got away with that on the J.A.P.

[False dawn]

2 hours ago, steve roberts said:

When I "rode" at one of Olle's Schools this was emphasised but we are talking the early eighties. In fact the idea was to place the left foot in line with the front wheel to help steer the bike thru' the bend. Not sure when the modern "leg trailing" kicked in but you wouldn't have got away with that on the J.A.P.

Yes, I've heard that before. Odd though, since leg trailing also preceded the JAP era.

[steve roberts]

5 minutes ago, False dawn said:

Yes, I've heard that before. Odd though, since leg trailing also preceded the JAP era.

Yes I guess that cinders and the deeper tracks made it possible?

I remember a rider saying (Briggo?) that all the J.A.P. wanted to do was to take you to the fence and therefore required more brute force to keep it in check. Some riders obviously preferred to continue using the J.A.P. long after it became less popular. Ken McKinlay and Dag Lovaas (was he the last to ride a J.A.P. at a World Final?) spring to mind.

[Split]

8 hours ago, steve roberts said:

I've purposely placed this is the "Years Gone By" section as riders styles nowadays tend to look all the same but in the past they varied greatly and it has always intrigued me how that was so? 

Yes, riders these days do indeed tend to all look the same. The distinctive styles of riders like Mike Broadbank(s) and Les McGillivray made them instantly recognisable in action photos in days gone by. Ove Fundin's stiff left leg entering a bend was also very distinctive and obviously very effective when you look at his impressive record. Of course, supreme stylists such as Ronnie Moore and Björn Knutson were simply a pleasure to watch.

Edited August 23, 2022 by Split

[Chadster]

I never saw Peter Craven ride, but pictures of him suggest a pretty modern style, he certainly looks differnet in pictures from most of his contemporaries. Soren Sjosten had a similar style. I see to recall him being referred to as a 'balance rider'. Maybe it was because they were both of small stature and bigger riders would find it hard to adopt such a style?

[False dawn]

The wizard of balance

[jrs]

15 hours ago, steve roberts said:

I sometimes wonder if I had passed thru' one of Olle Nygren Training Schools what style I would have adopted or come naturally to me?

I would put you down as a comfortable armchair ride, maybe with a little tot of cognac in a cup holder on the bars now that you’re re a country gentleman   
 

I never knew anyone who rode , that deliberately tried to copy anyones style . If you’re going to make it from junior to fully fledged rider I think you’ll just develop your own style. I wish you luck Steve in your future career . 

[BOBBATH]

Armchair stylists -look no further than Geoff Penniket-anyone see Geoff ride- he partnered Gote Nordin at Poole in 1967 I think, plus rode at Newport from 1964-66. Famously managed to cut the top of one finger off while working on his bike. Where are all these characters today??

[jenga]

And when he was a promoter  , famously put diesel in the worky water  truck  when it was a petrol engine ! . ahh , the good old days .

[steve roberts]

On 8/23/2022 at 9:57 PM, jrs said:

I would put you down as a comfortable armchair ride, maybe with a little tot of cognac in a cup holder on the bars now that you’re re a country gentleman   
 

I never knew anyone who rode , that deliberately tried to copy anyones style . If you’re going to make it from junior to fully fledged rider I think you’ll just develop your own style. I wish you luck Steve in your future career . 

Reminds me of the story that "Simmo" quoted when in Norden (1975) he and Peter Collins were riding long-track style only for Martin Ashby to pass them both riding bolt upright cool as you would wish...wouldn't have looked amiss with a pipe in his mouth!

[jrs]

32 minutes ago, steve roberts said:

Reminds me of the story that "Simmo" quoted when in Norden (1975) he and Peter Collins were riding long-track style only for Martin Ashby to pass them both riding bolt upright cool as you would wish...wouldn't have looked amiss with a pipe in his mouth!

And a good book to read tucked into his leathers to pass the time before a race is rerun or any other delays  

For me I suppose the prime example of a relaxed armchair rider was Ron How, calmness on the track personified.

[FAST GATER]

IMO a lot has to do with a rider's height after all most s/way riders are on the whole short in stature , the taller you are the more upright and in some cases awkward your style .Briggo had a less stylish look than say Ivan  ,Doyle has an awkward style to me compared to Zmarzlik  and the likes of Hancock and PK just looked at one with the bike  making it look almost too easy

Edited August 25, 2022 by FAST GATER

[steve roberts]

2 hours ago, jrs said:

And a good book to read tucked into his leathers to pass the time before a race is rerun or any other delays  

For me I suppose the prime example of a relaxed armchair rider was Ron How, calmness on the track personified.

Unfortunately I never saw Ron ride...often a forgotten rider but certainly up there with the best in my view based upon statistics and was part of the successful "Cheetahs" side of '64.

Edited August 25, 2022 by steve roberts

[iris123]

All good reading, but all post war. Why were there different styles pre war ?

Looking at the Ogden speedway cards is interesting

Probably the greatest of all the Dirt-Track riders, “Cyclone Billy Lamont” was born in Newcastle, New South Wales. He started racing in 1924 at Maitland, the first track built in Australia, and since that time has broken nearly every record in Australia, besides winning many of the most valuable trophies. Since coming to England to ride for International Speedways, he has broken several of our track records including that of Stamford Bridge. When in action his is without exception the most thrilling rider to watch as he invariably goes into the bends on full throttle.

Jim Kempster for one seems to be a foot forward rider, whereas most are the leg trailer style

Edited September 1, 2022 by iris123

[fatface]

On 8/23/2022 at 9:57 PM, jrs said:

I never knew anyone who rode , that deliberately tried to copy anyones style . If you’re going to make it from junior to fully fledged rider I think you’ll just develop your own style.

I think its doable assuming a similar stature. I know Chris Morton was influenced by Soren Sjosten for example....and whilst he adapted it, it wasn't a bad starter point for the similar stature he was. On the flip side, I'd say guys like Andrew Silver and Simon Stead were unduly influenced by trying to copy an American-style Kelly Moran/John Cook approach and I think it held them both back.

Both were unafraid of going full throttle, but at top level, they over slid around the corners, lost speed and couldn't step up. Kelly in particular could get away with it because he was a real natural and could carry the speed using incredible balance....but its not a style that just anyone should copy. Not everyone is Kelly Moran.

Edited September 1, 2022 by falcace

[iris123]

Hougaard was the first modern rider i noticed that had gone retro into a leg trailer sort of style. Maybe that was because of his long legs and the laydown giving him the possibility ?

See here with Jonas Davidson and Risager, who is hidden somewhat