cowboy cookie returns? Posted June 8, 2022 Report Share Posted June 8, 2022 Just been looking though the team line ups on the British speedway Facebook page. For the 18 meetings that have taken place since the first of June that they list lines up for, there have been 27 guests & 12 rider replacement facilities used. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
secsy1 Posted June 8, 2022 Report Share Posted June 8, 2022 It is not just the Guest and rider replacement facility that has killed the sport so far this season. Petrol prices and cost of living go part way, but the whole package as it stands is a bag of she ite. Even if the 15 races are brilliant, who wants to watch a tractor on a Monday night at Belle Vue race round 9 times and not even grade the track, every 4 races!!!!!!!! Fortunately I watched on Eurosport where it was just drivel from ill informed pundits and piss poor presentation. But wait a minute you say, racing was superb (Which it was) but 1 hour 45 minutes of clap trap is not worth the 15 minutes. Overhaul is not required, autopsy is 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OveFundinFan Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 With fuel costs rising as they are, just on that consideration, could be big loss of tracks at the end of year. Tracks will have to get into streaming quickly if the want to survive, couple with something new to them…… promoting an event well. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post mikebv Posted June 9, 2022 Popular Post Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 Uncomfortable truth, but a truth nevertheless, is that there are too many tracks running at an unsustainable level... And when I say unsustainable I also include impact to its credibility and reputation, as well as financial considerations.. You cannot run a team sport with 3 Divisions and all share each others competitors, therefore, if you decide to do so then it simply isnt a sustainable model to follow if you want fans to buy into it.. And if they dont buy into it, and it doesnt look like they do in many places, then the brand itself is damaged.. And with a damaged brand you will always suffer.. Poland, Sweden and Denmark have it right (not perfect, but right), in that they focus on their top league and everything else feeds off it... Some fans in the UK often complain about Poland and the GP's "ruining British Speedway", yet the ONLY nation wanting to run its Speedway operating model from Monday to Sunday is the UK... Not one other league does it and they seem to cope well enough with Poland and the GP's impact.. With Poland, dont forget, actually running the vast majority of their meetings at the weekends, (but AROUND the wide and various FIM calender)... Bottom line is trying to run two leagues using a huge % of the same riders cannot work if you want to have flexibility to attract the best crowds on the best nights for you, and if you want credibility for the sport.. We have so many guests for example because one injury often impacts two teams... With that rider possibly being due to ride all seven nights of the week, meaning seven replacements for him!! Less teams per league, with clear demarcation between them, with controlled DU's using only those not riding overseas as well, has to be a consideration.. Or one large league with controlled spread of HL talent, six man teams, with the number six slot being an "RS role" for each team, being another.. The current operating model will never deliver growth for the sport, and it has clearly shown that for the past couple of decades at least, therefore you can only presume to keep using it must mean what currently exists is all that will ever exist.. (In the UK).... 12 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ovalman Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 (edited) Not just rising fuel costs but some tracks want fans to book tickets in advance, should still be able to pay cash on gate, which would suit some older fans, plus weather considerations. A 6 team league is no good, the season is starting later and later. Poland has got it right. Edited June 9, 2022 by auntie doris 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lefty Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 Looking thru' last week's Speedway Star I saw that the list of top averages for Premiership and Championship. Top of Premiership: Steve Masters (Wolves) Top of Champoonship: Steve Masters (Edinburgh) Are they related???? Should the Leagues be renamed; Monday & Thursday League and the Rest Of the Week League??? Finally should Chris Harris represent every team at the League Riders Final??? Team sport has certainly been wrecked in Britain. 5 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HenryW Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 31 minutes ago, Lefty said: Looking thru' last week's Speedway Star I saw that the list of top averages for Premiership and Championship. Top of Premiership: Steve Masters (Wolves) Top of Champoonship: Steve Masters (Edinburgh) Are they related???? Team sport has certainly been wrecked in Britain. Impressive effort from Steve after not racing since 2005...Unless it was Sam you were meaning? (sorry, couldn't resist) I agree with your main point that the amount of riders in both leagues is a joke and along with the amount of guests used, totally devalues the "team" element 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lefty Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 15 minutes ago, HenryW said: Impressive effort from Steve after not racing since 2005...Unless it was Sam you were meaning? (sorry, couldn't resist) I agree with your main point that the amount of riders in both leagues is a joke and along with the amount of guests used, totally devalues the "team" element Whoops, can I blame predictive tewxting...... I will get my Biro out and correct it.. Nah, I will play at being a Promoter and not bother! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 22 minutes ago, Lefty said: Whoops, can I blame predictive tewxting...... I will get my Biro out and correct it.. Nah, I will play at being a Promoter and not bother! Polands fault this... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWC Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 I’ve watched meetings in Sweden with their teams of GP riders in some and the atmosphere in the stadium seemed non existent! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fromafar Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 17 hours ago, cowboy cookie returns? said: Just been looking though the team line ups on the British speedway Facebook page. For the 18 meetings that have taken place since the first of June that they list lines up for, there have been 27 guests & 12 rider replacement facilities used. It’s been dead as credible Sport for years,but it really just getting ridiculous now.Every Team working the rules to their advantage at every opportunity.Young riders coming into sport have been stifled from moving forward now that Team can even get guests for reserves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 (edited) 55 minutes ago, GWC said: I’ve watched meetings in Sweden with their teams of GP riders in some and the atmosphere in the stadium seemed non existent! But, in fairness, they do have a large company sponsoring the league and dont share riders via a guest system so the team that wins has genuinely only won it by themselves, and not an adhoc amalgam of "willing paid helpers"... (Maybe the sponsorship level and credibility level is linked. Who knows? But I would suggest it definitley is linked in Poland.. I am surprised though at how many are published attending some meetings with it often looking like watching a TV meeting over here on screen... Some tracks are getting over 2000 according to the attendance figures..... Which certainly doesnt always look like that on camera.. The UK, Sweden and Denmark do seem to have a similar demographic of follower, and also similarly, seem to struggle to attract different demographics to go along and watch.. You would imagine if Sweden lost their main sponsor that their league would be under considerable pressure.. Edited June 9, 2022 by mikebv 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moxey63 Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 The problem started 20 years ago when clubs were allowed to operate double up and down riders, who had no link with the other club. It has got to the point now where riders are getting more out of the sport than the fans by having a team at every port. The supporter needs to feel the rider is part of them, their team, not some fly-by-night who is clock watching or afraid of being injured because he has another race date later on. It has got to the point now where riders choose the track based on its race day and not the club. It is no way for a team sport to exist. Speedway has reached fourth division short -termism. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWC Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 50 years ago nearly every rider had a full time job somewhere so a bike in the boot a set of leathers and a box of spanner’s was their major outlay. Nowadays riders have huge outlays so riding in one league doesn’t pay the bills. Promotions limited income plus a rider shortage and you have the scenario we have now. Sadly I don’t see things getting any better so enjoy it while it’s still here! 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hackett Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 19 hours ago, secsy1 said: Even if the 15 races are brilliant, who wants to watch a tractor on a Monday night at Belle Vue race round 9 times and not even grade the track, every 4 races!!!!!!!! Don't worry if fuel prices keep rising most Speedway clubs won't be able to afford to fuel a tractor so should speed the meetings up. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wee Eck Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 1 hour ago, GWC said: 50 years ago nearly every rider had a full time job somewhere so a bike in the boot a set of leathers and a box of spanner’s was their major outlay. Nowadays riders have huge outlays so riding in one league doesn’t pay the bills. Promotions limited income plus a rider shortage and you have the scenario we have now. Sadly I don’t see things getting any better so enjoy it while it’s still here! So, what is the solution? Promoters get the blame, and some of them are certainly part of the problem, but none of them has been able to find a solution to reinvigorating the sport. Everyone knows that the Polish business model of town/city and even national subsidies will never happen here, so what’s to be done? Elsewhere, others have commented on the shocking crowd levels at Danish and Swedish meetings, so it’s a problem that goes beyond UK. UK promoters are an easy and constant target on here, but even the professional ones like Glasgow, Redcar, Poole and Wolves are struggling to make a decent return for their efforts. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWC Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 1 hour ago, Wee Eck said: So, what is the solution? Promoters get the blame, and some of them are certainly part of the problem, but none of them has been able to find a solution to reinvigorating the sport. Everyone knows that the Polish business model of town/city and even national subsidies will never happen here, so what’s to be done? Elsewhere, others have commented on the shocking crowd levels at Danish and Swedish meetings, so it’s a problem that goes beyond UK. UK promoters are an easy and constant target on here, but even the professional ones like Glasgow, Redcar, Poole and Wolves are struggling to make a decent return for their efforts. Sweden boomed when Tony Rickardson appeared and started winning everything Denmark built speedway centres after Ole Olsen won the world title in 1971 by 1979 they were a world power. I don’t know how we can have another revival like 1965 did after the slow decline at the end of the 1950’s. Its a totally different world now and people want different things standing watching 4 blokes go round a track doesn’t seem to excite the young. The atmosphere when I first went in the early 70’s has never been repeated sadly and now the south east is lost to the sport it only makes it worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, Wee Eck said: So, what is the solution? Promoters get the blame, and some of them are certainly part of the problem, but none of them has been able to find a solution to reinvigorating the sport. Everyone knows that the Polish business model of town/city and even national subsidies will never happen here, so what’s to be done? Elsewhere, others have commented on the shocking crowd levels at Danish and Swedish meetings, so it’s a problem that goes beyond UK. UK promoters are an easy and constant target on here, but even the professional ones like Glasgow, Redcar, Poole and Wolves are struggling to make a decent return for their efforts. For me, the lack of credibility is THE key issue and one that, if fixed, would at least start to encourage and engender that vital emotional attachment to a team that any fan of a team sport must have for it to have any purpose or merit.. When you can pick and choose what league you want to race in as "it suits you better" then all it sends out is a message that the leagues have no real worth in winning and should be treated accordingly.. Without aspiration to grow, any entity will stagnate then ultimately regress.. There is no doubt that within the sport there are clubs who are clearly at a certain level, yet choose to ply their trade in leagues either above or below their "natural position", which ultimately then renders the leagues uncompetitive as some teams are too strong for the league they compete in, or wildy out of their depth, and it also then means the supposed "flagship league" is nothing of the sort... Therefore. What should be seen as the aspirational pinnacle of the sport becomes almost an irrelevance given there isnt the will for many to want to compete for it... And when the "top league's" reputation carries such llittle kudos it then permeates down into the other leagues who subsequently then have even less kudos... The current set of Promoters are not responsible for all Speedways ills obviously, but their lack of innovation and desire for radical change to try and do something different, is definitely down to them.. Covid being a huge opportunity for a reset and relaunch that they chose to not take... What's that definition of insanity? UK Speedway is unfortunatley on rinse and repeat to do the same thing ad Infinitum... Yet. Frustratingly, the 'raw product' can still attract very decent crowds when the infrastructure around it is fit for purpose.. Something we often see, as an example, regularly, whenever an FIM meeting is held over here.... Proving that there is definitely many who still have an appetite for Speedway in the UK, and will willingly pay "top dollar" to attend it.. It's just not an appetite for domestic UK Speedway... As to why that is, is what the Promoters should be finding out, fixing the reasons why, and then hopefully reaping the reward of their enquiries by having fuller stadiums, and wider media coverage of their competitions due to their renewed level of kudos in winning.. Edited June 9, 2022 by mikebv 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post THE DEAN MACHINE Posted June 9, 2022 Popular Post Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 Been banging this drum for a few years now, British speedway is run by the riders for the riders and until someone somewhere within the sport realises the fans are the be all and end all the sport will continue to die 20 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted June 10, 2022 Report Share Posted June 10, 2022 5 hours ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said: Been banging this drum for a few years now, British speedway is run by the riders for the riders and until someone somewhere within the sport realises the fans are the be all and end all the sport will continue to die 100%... And you can also add that the ego of some Promoters impacts far too much on how the sport is ran... eg. If you want to use Div One HL's, then put your team into Div One.. Or. if you cannot put on a show strong enough to compete in Div 2 then drop down to Div 3... You should ride at the level you are "organically" at, and not the one you decide gives you the most chance of (misguided use of the term that it is), "success".... The sport in the UK does come across as nothing more than a whimsical plaything for those who run it, and a way of allowing many of the riders to make as much money as they can so as to not need to work for six months of the year... Regardless of the impact to the overall credibility of the brand, and its competitions, that this clearly has... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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