28.03. Aces v Tigers - Northern League Cup

[foreverblue]

25 minutes ago, Najjer said:

Is Lemon still the team manager?

Can’t you tell!

[bringbackHalifax]

Once Zagar gets himself sorted he will be at Belle Vue and they will then be stronger, but need more from Max and Brady at home.

[Roger Jacobs]

28 minutes ago, bringbackHalifax said:

Once Zagar gets himself sorted he will be at Belle Vue and they will then be stronger, but need more from Max and Brady at home.

How would Zagar fit average-wise?

[Col]

So the Tigers head over the Pennines with a deserved win from the NSS, despite being not tracking two of their top 4 riders.

R/R yielded 5+1, would have expected more from Cook, Worrall scored 7+1 (ignoring his R/R) more than could have been expected from Musielak.

Didn't think the track was as good as it can be, but some decent racing.  Gate 4 was a handicap as it was last week, especially early in the meeting.

For the Aces.

Fricke - poor showing from a GP rider, failed to beat Holder and couldn't find a way past Worrall on two occasions.
Etheridge - poor until heat 10 when he joined Fricke for the only Aces 5-1 of the night.
Allen - poor, ponderously slow, looked overweight.  Overtaken by Neilsen in heat 12.
Wright - did what could have been expected of him, had the beating of the Sheffield middle order, going from 3rd to 1st in his first race.
Kurtz - a little hit & miss, only rider to beat Holder with what looked the quickest rider of the night in heat 11 certainly the only time any rider ventured near the air fence.  Plugged away on the slower inside in heat 13 keeping Holder honest but never really looked like overhauling the Tigers #1.
Blodorn - showed potential in his first ride amongst the Tigers reserves, overtook Howarth in heat 14 to make the home side favourites in the last heat decider.
Brennan - won heat 2 by a country mile, poor second ride - way off the pace, good win over Ellis in heat 8 then ran a last behind Allen & Neilsen in heat 12 but was never far behind.

For the Tigers.

Holder - best rider on show by a distance without ever really getting into top gear.
Worrall - somewhat hit & miss, two defeats of Fricke.
Howarth - largely anonymous, never looked likely to win a heat.
Ellis - much better than last week, ran a last in heat 13 other than that will be happy with his night.
Neilsen - was the better of the two visiting reserves, crucial pass of Allen to join Worrall for a 1-5 in heat 12.
Mountain - picked up 2 points beating each home reserve once is all that can be expected from a visiting reserve.

IMO stupid decision in heat 15 from Lemon, Wright hadn't looked anywhere near quick enough to beat either of the visiting top 2 so why use him rather than Fricke and having done that why give him gate 1 rather than Kurtz?  Aces only needed a 3-3 to win the meeting.

If Aces are going to make a change and it's one of Etheridge or Allen to make way... Etheridge 1, Allen 0 after tonight.  But neither really impressed.

Edited March 28, 2022 by Col

[Col]

12 minutes ago, Roger Jacobs said:

How would Zagar fit average-wise?

Quite easily!  Last averaged 7.54 I think, for Belle Vue in 2016(?)  Aces have more to play with than that nearer the 8.1 mark I think
39.0 has been quoted on here as the points limit ignoring the RS but Sheffield are 39.37 so it must be 39.5

[Arch Stanton]

1 hour ago, Col said:

39.0 has been quoted on here as the points limit ignoring the RS but Sheffield are 39.37 so it must be 39.5

It’s definitely 39 for the top 6 Col, Sheffield are 38.85 for their 6

Edited March 28, 2022 by Arch Stanton

[Najjer]

9 hours ago, foreverblue said:

Can’t you tell!

It certainly explains the heat 15 picks along with the choice to give Allen 4 rides and Brennan only 4 rides after winning 2 races

[Rob B]

8 hours ago, Col said:

So the Tigers head over the Pennines with a deserved win from the NSS, despite being not tracking two of their top 4 riders.

R/R yielded 5+1, would have expected more from Cook, Worrall scored 7+1 (ignoring his R/R) more than could have been expected from Musielak.

Nothing could be predicted from sick note Cook, he is very inconsistent, last time round NSS for Ipswich in 2021 he scored 5. Musielak wouldn't have scored more then 7, has never done in his previous visits and was lot worst last week. 

8 hours ago, Col said:

For the Aces.

Fricke - poor showing from a GP rider, failed to beat Holder and couldn't find a way past Worrall on two occasions.
Etheridge - poor until heat 10 when he joined Fricke for the only Aces 5-1 of the night.

Ignoring heat 14 5-1 then

8 hours ago, Col said:

 

IMO stupid decision in heat 15 from Lemon, Wright hadn't looked anywhere near quick enough to beat either of the visiting top 2 so why use him rather than Fricke and having done that why give him gate 1 rather than Kurtz?  Aces only needed a 3-3 to win the meeting.

Why stupid, Wright was top scorer and was very fast in heat 14, you have already stated above that Fricke was poor. Gate 1 was one of the worst gates, only 1 win all meeting, gate 3 was the better gate.

[PhilTheAce]

My pennies worth

 

With what I seen tonight, I can't wait for the league campaign to start. We will have 3 genuine heat leaders, 1 excellent second string and 2 very good reserves.

 

Yes we lost but there were some positives to take from it. Jake Allen wasn't one. He was awful tonight. Not seen him that bad for a long time  so jye is 1-0 over allen for who gets replaced. 

 

Regarding heat 15, it was definitely thr right 2 riders, but wrong gates, gate 1 had 1 win all night. 

 

All in all, wasn't the best meeting racing wise, infact it was pretty dire after the 1st lap. Well done Sheffield, deserved win

[Col]

7 hours ago, Arch Stanton said:

It’s definitely 39 for the top 6 Col, Sheffield are 38.85 for their 6

I though t I must have an average wrong when I totted them up (Cook combined KL/Ip average maybe), but they were listed on the Belle Vue website in the match preview yesterday.
Holder    8.87
Cook    6.98
Musielak    6.21
Howarth    6.19
Ellis    8.12
Nielsen    3.00
    39.37

[Col]

30 minutes ago, Rob B said:

Ignoring heat 14 5-1 then

Forgot that one.

Quote

Why stupid, Wright was top scorer and was very fast in heat 14, you have already stated above that Fricke was poor. Gate 1 was one of the worst gates, only 1 win all meeting, gate 3 was the better gate.

Because Fricke had beaten Ellis twice, once from the back, Wright had not looked like beating either Holder or Ellis all night.  If gate 1 was the poorest why did Aces choose gates 1 & 3?

[Bagpuss]

I know people love putting the boot in on Lemon but do folk really think the heat 15 choices would have been made without a chat between he and the three riders concerned? I don't believe team managers ever name nominated riders without discussions with who might be in heat 15.

[PhilTheAce]

11 minutes ago, Bagpuss said:

I know people love putting the boot in on Lemon but do folk really think the heat 15 choices would have been made without a chat between he and the three riders concerned? I don't believe team managers ever name nominated riders without discussions with who might be in heat 15.

Exactly, the riders pick the gates. They wanted 1&3. 

 

Although Mark should have questioned them wanting gate 1 as it had been atrocious all night 

[keepturningleft]

What was the approx attendance?

[arnieg]

41 minutes ago, Col said:

I though t I must have an average wrong when I totted them up (Cook combined KL/Ip average maybe), but they were listed on the Belle Vue website in the match preview yesterday.
Holder    8.87
Cook    6.98
Musielak    6.21
Howarth    6.19
Ellis    8.12
Nielsen    3.00
    39.37

Team building Aves include 2.5% British discount for Ellis, Howarth and Cook 

[BuxtonTiger]

1 hour ago, Rob B said:

Nothing could be predicted from sick note Cook, he is very inconsistent, last time round NSS for Ipswich in 2021 he scored 5. Musielak wouldn't have scored more then 7, has never done in his previous visits and was lot worst last week. 

Ignoring heat 14 5-1 then

Why stupid, Wright was top scorer and was very fast in heat 14, you have already stated above that Fricke was poor. Gate 1 was one of the worst gates, only 1 win all meeting, gate 3 was the better gate.

But the Aces picked 1 & 3.

[Col]

1 hour ago, Najjer said:

It certainly explains the heat 15 picks along with the choice to give Allen 4 rides and Brennan only 4 rides after winning 2 races

I'm sure had Brennan not been programmed to partner Allen in heat 12 he would have replaced him, but Etheridge had not looked like doing anything until his final ride either.  Likewise Blodorn only came good in his final ride, which he had to take as his mandatory 3rd programmed ride having been replaced by TS Fricke earlier in the meeting.

28 minutes ago, keepturningleft said:

What was the approx attendance?

The back straight looked quite busy as did the pits end of the grand stand but the other end where I prefer to sit was pretty empty, probably a little less than half that were there last week.

27 minutes ago, arnieg said:

Team building Aves include 2.5% British discount for Ellis, Howarth and Cook 

Thought that reduction was old news, but fair enough that takes Tigers total down to 38.84.

In answer to the original question using the averages poste don the Belle Vue site yesterday and removing Allen, Aces have 7.93 to play with.

[Pinny]

So who is Allens replacement????? Is it Zagar?

[PhilTheAce]

26 minutes ago, Pinny said:

So who is Allens replacement????? Is it Zagar?

Apparently so. But we've had this all winter, so untill I see it announced I'll be cautious although zagar hinted loads at the PCMT that he was back. As did the interviewer 

[Col]

2 hours ago, Pinny said:

So who is Allens replacement????? Is it Zagar?

That's the hope!  Looks like he's riding for Bydgoszcz Liga 1 this year rather than Ekstraliga, so no limits on other leagues, not that he appears to be riding in Elitserien or is not at least listed on the line-ups on the Svemo site.  Don't know about Danish league - wouldn't know where to look.

Edited March 29, 2022 by Col