British Speedway

[mikebv]

16 hours ago, Trees said:

British speedway and it's clubs are in such precarious positions that it's impossible to have long term plans, promoters have to plan season to season?  Of course they'd all love to have long term, big TV deals, long term, big money sponsorship deals etc etc but they don't exist for them?

And never will whilst their operating model allows any rider to ride for any team at any given time...

Unsurprisingly. Zero credibility brings Zero interest from major sponsors...

When even winning a title means so little, it will always be a hand to mouth, constantly changing, year on year existence...

[phillwhitewasmad]

16 minutes ago, enotian said:

Is SGP4 the answer?

"The Fédération Internationale de Motocyclisme (FIM) and Discovery Sports Events have revealed their vision for the future of Speedway over the next decade. By bringing international Speedway together under one global promoter for the first time, the new vision will build a stronger and more connected international pyramid for the sport – from the grassroots all the way to the pinnacle of Speedway. Important part of this pyramid will be a new international entry-level category SGP4. The new SGP4 category will be introduced in 2023 and is planned to be cost effective with 4-stroke easy to handle engine that will be universal and equal everywhere. The Ambassador Tony Rickardsson is on the mission to develop the SGP4 category."

You'd at least hope that the promoters are arranging to meet with Tony Rickardsson. 

It's not clear what the level of SGP4 "grassroots" is. You'd naturally feel that it's lower than SGP3 which wouldn't be a suitable product for the paying public but if you interpret it as being standard 500cc machinery then it's probably about a National League standard. A stepping stone from youth classes into the professional leagues. 

A sustainable pyramid is what is required.   

It is my understanding that Sgp 4 will be 125/150 class Sgp 3 will be 250 class

[Stanleyman]

I am sure the "powers that be" will get around that table at the AGM and sort everything out. Make it better for the fans, better for the riders and a better T.V aspect. I think perhaps the answer could be to bring back the green helmet colour and change the points given out for a win - maybe 10 points for a win if the track is wet and it would definitely make it more exciting if the riders had to use a bigger pit mat!!! Unfortunately that is about the only level of thinking the BSPL have - Charge the riders, sod the fans.

[enotian]

12 minutes ago, phillwhitewasmad said:

It is my understanding that Sgp 4 will be 125/150 class Sgp 3 will be 250 class

Yes that would make sense. So probably not a solution to the "paid for" product (other than as an add on to the main event) but hopefully a potential solution to the rider supply and demand issue. 

Although I imagine that transition from youth racing to professional league racing is expensive so it would be interesting to see if DSE have any plans to facilitate that. If they're serious about developing the sport internationally they need to create opportunities for those SGP4 and SGP3 riders to progress.  Maybe that's the leverage for UK promoters to get more access to SGP riders or access to have some of these developing riders subsidised if the domestic leagues provide opportunities for them to develop. A career path. Afterall it is the SGP right holders who ultimately benefit from having access to higher standard riders from a wider geographical area.

Sounds like DSE want to have more say over the riding talent and not let the Polish authorities rule the roost. So it could be a good time to get in bed with them. 

[*JJ]

On 11/7/2021 at 10:01 AM, phillwhitewasmad said:

Your experience is different to ours training with Wayne Carter ,Amsa and numerous practice sessions at a track 15 minutes from home don't disagree about the mileage but it's a decision made when starting in the sport we all know which tracks can and will run and offer training and practice.

Yes indeed, Wayne Carter was excellent, but he seemed to be one of the few. Andrew Silver was helpful, as well, but generally speaking, the rider stood in a queue until it was time to go out on track and find out how to ride by himself. We live in Birmingham:  Scunthorpe, Kings Lynn and Rye House are about 120 miles away ... Leicester is only about 60, but it was annoying that the Birmingham promotion had no interest in training whatever.

[ch958]

A former 1st division rider pulled me in at Felton and asked me what i did for a living. It was an office job and he gave up on me thereafter even though i was 19 and proficient in several physical sports (i was fitter than him thats for sure, and stronger). Ken Marshall on the other hand was very encouraging. 

[HackneyHawk]

On 11/6/2021 at 8:41 PM, f-s-p said:

Stop complaining on what other people do. Contact your local track and start organising practise sessions for youngsters between 14-20 on 500cc bikes. If the club wont finance it, find the money yourself and DO IT.

Lack of domestic riders in the UK is the very basic problem of speedway, been that way for 30 years. 

So if there were more 'domestic' riders  then this would save speedway?

Isn't the fact that no-one comes anymore and/or most stadiums are under threat of closure the most pressing problem???????????

[Fortythirtyeight]

18 minutes ago, HackneyHawk said:

So if there were more 'domestic' riders  then this would save speedway?

Isn't the fact that no-one comes anymore and/or most stadiums are under threat of closure the most pressing problem???????????

F-S-P obviously hasn't got a clue how speedway is run. An individual cannot just contact his local club and say “ I want to run a training session “. The promoter is the only person who can run events on his track, he has to be present, it has to be insured , qualified medical personal in attendance and will need a track curator. Anybody conducting ‘ training ‘ is supposed to vetted and competent ( insurance companies insistence ) and that’s just the basics.

Then we can discuss smaller crowds !

Edited November 8, 2021 by Fortythirtyeight

[martinmauger]

On 11/7/2021 at 10:01 AM, phillwhitewasmad said:

Your experience is different to ours training with Wayne Carter ,Amsa and numerous practice sessions at a track 15 minutes from home don't disagree about the mileage but it's a decision made when starting in the sport we all know which tracks can and will run and offer training and practice.

I too have ridden with Wayne Carter, on Scunny's mini track and the main circuit (gulp !) and found him friendly, helpful, very knowledgable as you would expect and has a good sense of humour without being at all condescending or insulting, which helps if (when) progress doesn't go as planned or the ground keeps coming up to meet you (!).  He has plenty of time for everyone and equally importantly he asks what riders are hoping to achieve; from just having fun, riding round the track without the ground hitting you (!), getting a full slide on (yay!) to taking on the likes of Laguta, Tai, Smazlik, etc.  He then helps each rider make steady & safe progress at their own pace.  Speaking as I find, I can highly reccomend a day 'skidding with Wayne' and promised to myself one day hope to do so again.  One day....

Edited November 8, 2021 by martinmauger
added skid info

[f-s-p]

1 hour ago, HackneyHawk said:

So if there were more 'domestic' riders  then this would save speedway?

Isn't the fact that no-one comes anymore and/or most stadiums are under threat of closure the most pressing problem???????????

It would seriously alter the cost stucture of the teams and I dare say it would be cheaper to run a team of 5-2 in favour of own riders than the other way around. Also in my theory locals would come see local riders.

The way things are currently heading with covid, travel, speedway on the continent and brexit, IMO there is no return to how things were five years ago. With this I mean the supply of foreign riders to ride and/or base themselves in the UK is not increasing.

So more domestic/british riders, more locals, cheaper teams, bigger crowds.

 

 

 

[f-s-p]

1 hour ago, Fortythirtyeight said:

F-S-P obviously hasn't got a clue how speedway is run. An individual cannot just contact his local club and say “ I want to run a training session “. The promoter is the only person who can run events on his track, he has to be present, it has to be insured , qualified medical personal in attendance and will need a track curator. Anybody conducting ‘ training ‘ is supposed to vetted and competent ( insurance companies insistence ) and that’s just the basics.

Then we can discuss smaller crowds !

So had I written ”contact the local promoter” instead of club it would have been ok? It makes me smile reading that I just cant ring a promoter in the UK and tell him I want to organise a training day. Why the heck not? If I had the money I’d call Lemon tomorrow

I dont know everything about how speedway is run in the UK, but I know enough. Think my first post mentioned also finding the money that is necessary to run the said training session.

I know how speedway is run and how it operates over here, and contacting the local club would be the first step in order to organise a training day or school or whatever…

[dontforgetthefueltapsbruv]

5 hours ago, f-s-p said:

So had I written ”contact the local promoter” instead of club it would have been ok? It makes me smile reading that I just cant ring a promoter in the UK and tell him I want to organise a training day. Why the heck not? If I had the money I’d call Lemon tomorrow

I dont know everything about how speedway is run in the UK, but I know enough. Think my first post mentioned also finding the money that is necessary to run the said training session.

I know how speedway is run and how it operates over here, and contacting the local club would be the first step in order to organise a training day or school or whatever…

For most tracks in the UK regular practice sessions and or coaching events are nigh on impossible

Only a handful have few if any restrictions of use

My local track for example (Ipswich) are limited not only by landlord expectations but also local authority restrictions 

The stadium is only allowed to hold a maximum number of events each year *can't recall the exact number but it may well be less than 1 a week on average

There is then a restriction of no more than 2 events in any 8 day period as well as limitations as to what times and for how long the event takes place

Get over any of that and you then have the fact that the landlord would want in excess of £3000 to open the doors

[Fromafar]

7 hours ago, f-s-p said:

So had I written ”contact the local promoter” instead of club it would have been ok? It makes me smile reading that I just cant ring a promoter in the UK and tell him I want to organise a training day. Why the heck not? If I had the money I’d call Lemon tomorrow

I dont know everything about how speedway is run in the UK, but I know enough. Think my first post mentioned also finding the money that is necessary to run the said training session.

I know how speedway is run and how it operates over here, and contacting the local club would be the first step in order to organise a training day or school or whatever…

Very different in UK though.

[Fortythirtyeight]

18 hours ago, f-s-p said:

So had I written ”contact the local promoter” instead of club it would have been ok? It makes me smile reading that I just cant ring a promoter in the UK and tell him I want to organise a training day. Why the heck not? If I had the money I’d call Lemon tomorrow

I dont know everything about how speedway is run in the UK, but I know enough. Think my first post mentioned also finding the money that is necessary to run the said training session.

I know how speedway is run and how it operates over here, and contacting the local club would be the first step in order to organise a training day or school or whatever…

No, because of unlimited restrictions on UK tracks with stadium use, days they can operate and how many times etc. Life in UK speedway just isn’t that simple.

[Pieman72]

On 11/6/2021 at 8:51 PM, JanAndersen said:

Is that directed at me? Odd take. 

Well done Jan it's great to see a rider who has such an interest and committent to British Speedway. Speedway supporters tend to be a bit inward and hit out because you are touching on the realities related to the difficult position British speedway finds itself in. British Speedway promoters have always been  remote and aloof and personally rather slippery that's why we are in the position. What you are saying is so right everyone needs to pull together else we will loose what is a wonderful spectacle and sport.

Edited November 9, 2021 by Pieman72

[Baldyman]

Don't think that's the speedway rider,,, otherwise he would know how to spell his name correctly

[JanAndersen]

11 hours ago, Baldyman said:

Don't think that's the speedway rider,,, otherwise he would know how to spell his name correctly

Was always spelled that way in the programme in my day. 

[AFCB Wildcat]

On 11/7/2021 at 9:28 AM, *JJ said:

Not actually true. I spent 5 years driving a would-be speedway rider around. We had to go half way across the country to get a few rides - there was no or very little coaching - which was very annoying when there was a speedway track only two miles down the road!  Too many tracks are in greyhound stadiums which allow speedway only once a week.

I had the same experience as you.

When my son took an interest in riding we contacted our local track (Poole) to enquire how he could get started and where he could receive training and they couldn't offer any advice except that they thought Reading had training sessions (at the time) but you would need all your own equipment. That's a big investment to make to find out it's not for you after a couple of outings.

I only later found out through a work colleague who did amateur speedway about Sittingbourne (Iwade) where we could hire equipment and get training initially. After that I spent a lot of time driving lots of miles to amateur events or practice days where you just queue up for track time.

I was disappointed that a major club couldn't even point us in the right direction. 

On 11/8/2021 at 1:13 PM, HackneyHawk said:

So if there were more 'domestic' riders  then this would save speedway?

Isn't the fact that no-one comes anymore and/or most stadiums are under threat of closure the most pressing problem???????????

I think if there were more domestic riders who were a major force on the world stage like in the past it would possibly generate more interest.

[iris123]

57 minutes ago, AFCB Wildcat said:

I had the same experience as you.

When my son took an interest in riding we contacted our local track (Poole) to enquire how he could get started and where he could receive training and they couldn't offer any advice except that they thought Reading had training sessions (at the time) but you would need all your own equipment. That's a big investment to make to find out it's not for you after a couple of outings.

I only later found out through a work colleague who did amateur speedway about Sittingbourne (Iwade) where we could hire equipment and get training initially. After that I spent a lot of time driving lots of miles to amateur events or practice days where you just queue up for track time.

I was disappointed that a major club couldn't even point us in the right direction. 

I think if there were more domestic riders who were a major force on the world stage like in the past it would possibly generate more interest.

Guess by then the famous Lew Coffin school had closed ?

 But I would guess some did approach the promoter to run training schools

Ivan Mauger and Olle Nygren spring to mind

[AFCB Wildcat]

3 hours ago, iris123 said:

Guess by then the famous Lew Coffin school had closed ?

 But I would guess some did approach the promoter to run training schools

Ivan Mauger and Olle Nygren spring to mind

Yes Lew used to run training schools at Weymouth but as you say not at the time my lad started. We did get a couple of practice days in at Weymouth though before it closed down completely but little in the way of tuition. It was just pay your money and queue at the pit gate. Interestingly though, my lads first 500 was a Jawa 898 which had been converted to a laydown by Lew Coffin.

The Iwade set up is a great facility and I always wondered why the bigger clubs didn't support it more.

I understand that the big clubs don't always have access to their own stadiums except for on race nights but If amateur clubs can hire training tracks to run meetings then why couldn't  the bigger clubs hire them to run junior leagues etc with riders on hand for tuition etc?  

I keep hearing how expensive it is to get into speedway but really it isn't at grassroots level. You don't have to spend a fortune to find out if you're good enough to pursue it seriously.