ch958 Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 8 minutes ago, gmuncie said: 4 out of the 77 riders in the Championship this year are new foreign imports hardly a worrying number I’d say. I would counter argue that the problem is that the top league is to weak rather than the championship to strong. There is a reason that many teams that could move up don’t or that those that move down stick around. The Championship imo is the best product in the UK each team has a mix of experience and youth. Geographically it’s mixed, race nights it’s mixed and the majority of innovation seems to come at championship level also. as for a ‘stepping stone’ if you include the no8’s then out of the 47 named riders so far in the Premiership 43 rode in the Championship before moving up / doubling up including Doyle, Fricke so I’d say the Championship does a pretty good job of finding and developing talent. that is quite correct but there isn't the cash to strengthen it. No cash needed to reign in the strength of the second division with the bonus of NL prospects getting a chance. Also IOW and Mildy might be tempted to rejoin a cheaper division. The knock on should be 2 more members of the top div to 8 so more rides in the division and a severe curb on DU/DD and eventual ridding of it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 (edited) The whole premise of the RS scheme was to have a steady flow of GB riders so reliance on overseas imports isnt required.. And this would also invariably improve the chances of long term GB success as no longer would we be training up riders from other countries, but instead providing track time to GB lads... Without the stepping stones to the top however it simply wont work.. And the middle tier of Speedway in the UK should play the absolute pivotal role within the overall system.. That is. Taking on those from the NDL ready to have a go at the next level, and also preparing riders to organically move up to the league above, as they out grow the level they are at... In any 3 tier system ran by any business or entity, which promotes development, the middle tier is vital, both to provide opportunities for those who excel at the lower level, and also provide opportunities for those who get out of their depth and need to drop back from the higher tier to regain confidence.. UK Speedway though has a better idea now after just one year..... Edited March 23, 2022 by mikebv 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreverblue Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 When will the last rider be announced. Monday? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilTheAce Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 (edited) 3 minutes ago, foreverblue said: When will the last rider be announced. Monday? First person to enter stsdoum gets the place Edited March 23, 2022 by PhilTheAce 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmuncie Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 15 minutes ago, mikebv said: The whole premise of the RS scheme was to have a steady flow of GB riders so reliance on overseas imports isnt required.. And this would also invariably improve the chances of long term GB success as no longer would we be training up riders from other countries, but instead providing track time to GB lads... Without the stepping stones to the top however it simply wont work.. And the middle tier of Speedway in the UK should play the absolute pivotal role within the overall system.. That is. Taking on those from the NDL ready to have a go at the next level, and also preparing riders to organically move up to the league above, as they out grow the level they are at... In any 3 tier system ran by any business or entity, which promotes development, the middle tier is vital, both to provide opportunities for those who excel at the lower level, and also provide opportunities for those who get out of their depth and need to drop back from the higher tier to regain confidence.. UK Speedway though has a better idea now after just one year..... If you are good enough you will organically get your shot at championship level though as proven by the fact that people have been able to come up with 1 name only for a young British rider who potentially should be in the championship. Getting young British riders into the championship has and never will be an issue, getting them into the Prem and abroad is where the problem has been in the past and hopefully with rising star still in the prem, no8’s and the premiership junior league as well as the work being done by team GB on the international front then these pathways should be opening. it is not the clubs at championship level to care about teams in the premiership or team gb individually that is the job for the bspl / team gb set up so why should their clubs be damaged by having to water down the league by putting in guys that aren’t ready / not good enough just to fill a quota as happened in places last year. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagpuss Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 I think the point is though that it probably needs more than one year, I think a quota system will generally produce more talent than not as in Poland even if there are a few sinkers. It also needs to not be about individual leagues, the sport needs to work together and unfortunately that hasn't been the case for some time. I suspect covid has contributed to less foreign rubbish nding up at the bottom of Champ sides and to be fair there needs to be more coming through from the development leagues to provide the CL with a flow of reserves. There is a lull now which might be natural after a decent crop of U21s like we have now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmuncie Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 6 minutes ago, Bagpuss said: I think the point is though that it probably needs more than one year, I think a quota system will generally produce more talent than not as in Poland even if there are a few sinkers. It also needs to not be about individual leagues, the sport needs to work together and unfortunately that hasn't been the case for some time. I suspect covid has contributed to less foreign rubbish nding up at the bottom of Champ sides and to be fair there needs to be more coming through from the development leagues to provide the CL with a flow of reserves. There is a lull now which might be natural after a decent crop of U21s like we have now. Would totally agree on the last point, these things tend to be cyclical and the next real crop is a couple of years away as witnessed by the lack of riders at 500cc in the youth championships last year. The 250cc and 125cc classes were bursting with talent that should hit the NDL in the next couple of years 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sings4Speedway Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 22 minutes ago, gmuncie said: Would totally agree on the last point, these things tend to be cyclical and the next real crop is a couple of years away as witnessed by the lack of riders at 500cc in the youth championships last year. The 250cc and 125cc classes were bursting with talent that should hit the NDL in the next couple of years Which is why as a whole the RS system was always farcical and destined to failure. It was hailed an initial "success" because there was a crop of riders ready to make the step up (and by fortune the promotions managed to get these riders at a cheap rate rather than let them haggle out their own deals). Now the CL doesn't need/fancy the next crop coming through they have closed the doors leaving instead the RS at PL level by name only but in reality its a place for a home grown star which the Continental major leagues have been doing for years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Col Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 (edited) On 3/22/2022 at 12:19 PM, Diamonds85 said: Surely it's only a matter of time before one of the Russian rider effected teams sign him up? But he's got a contract with Falubaz Zielona Góra (same as Fricke). I haven't looked what Ekstraliga have done about the team spots for the Laguta's & Sayfutdinov recently, but when I last looked it seemed as though they would use guests. Shouldn't affect either riding on Mondays or Thursdays in GB as almost all Polish league fixtures are on a weekend. If Zagar has ridden in Elitserien recently it has gone under my radar. Edited March 23, 2022 by Col Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noodles Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 4 minutes ago, Col said: But he's got a contract with Falubaz Zielona Góra (same as Fricke). I haven't looked what Ekstraliga have done about the team spots for the Laguta's & Sayfutdinov recently, but when I last looked it seemed as though they would use guests. Shouldn't affect either riding on Mondays or Thursdays in GB as almost all Polish league fixtures are on a weekend. If Zagar has ridden in Elitserien recently it has gone under my radar. They're using rider replacement only Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Col Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 I see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 1 hour ago, gmuncie said: If you are good enough you will organically get your shot at championship level though as proven by the fact that people have been able to come up with 1 name only for a young British rider who potentially should be in the championship. Getting young British riders into the championship has and never will be an issue, getting them into the Prem and abroad is where the problem has been in the past and hopefully with rising star still in the prem, no8’s and the premiership junior league as well as the work being done by team GB on the international front then these pathways should be opening. it is not the clubs at championship level to care about teams in the premiership or team gb individually that is the job for the bspl / team gb set up so why should their clubs be damaged by having to water down the league by putting in guys that aren’t ready / not good enough just to fill a quota as happened in places last year. Because having a strong middle tier of British Speedway will make thousands more attend every track, and attract millions more to watch on TV wont it? I remember when Speedway in the UK was in its pomp, hardly anyone tuned in to watch PC, DJ, John Louis, Malc Simmons etc etc blasting the rest of the world sideways as they lifted more world championships. Instead millions tuned in to the TV in the hope that there would be some highlights from the previous weeks' Crayford v Ellesmere Port match..... Thank goodness the middle tier of UK Speedway is doing so well... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmuncie Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 11 minutes ago, mikebv said: Because having a strong middle tier of British Speedway will make thousands more attend every track, and attract millions more to watch on TV wont it? I remember when Speedway in the UK was in its pomp, hardly anyone tuned in to watch PC, DJ, John Louis, Malc Simmons etc etc blasting the rest of the world sideways as they lifted more world championships. Instead millions tuned in to the TV in the hope that there would be some highlights from the previous weeks' Crayford v Ellesmere Port match..... Thank goodness the middle tier of UK Speedway is doing so well... No no your right we’ll devalue and weaken the second tier in the off chance that in 3-5 years time the almighty Premiership clubs who are all doing so fantastically well at the moment will deem someone who would have gotten their chance anyway good enough Tbf I guess the way it going it’s probably the only way your team would manage to field a 1-7 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreverblue Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 In my opinion the Premiership is too small, it offers too little variety of teams. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
customhouseregular Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 10 minutes ago, foreverblue said: In my opinion the Premiership is too small, it offers too little variety of teams. Lack of variety of teams, riders, competitions etc. No Test Matches, local derbies, star-studded open meetings. What is there to whet the appetite week after week?. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris116 Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 The easiest way of encouraging British riders is to have a minimum number of British riders in each team. I would suggest three or possibly four would be a good idea. Then you make team building rules that make a non British rider have one point added to their average which will encourage teams to use more than the minimum number of British riders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagpuss Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 1 hour ago, foreverblue said: In my opinion the Premiership is too small, it offers too little variety of teams. I don't think anybody world disagree with that, but at present there appears to be little to encourage new teams up to the Prem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy cookie returns? Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 2 hours ago, mikebv said: Because having a strong middle tier of British Speedway will make thousands more attend every track, and attract millions more to watch on TV wont it? I remember when Speedway in the UK was in its pomp, hardly anyone tuned in to watch PC, DJ, John Louis, Malc Simmons etc etc blasting the rest of the world sideways as they lifted more world championships. Instead millions tuned in to the TV in the hope that there would be some highlights from the previous weeks' Crayford v Ellesmere Port match..... Thank goodness the middle tier of UK Speedway is doing so well... The second tier has been the cannon fodder trying to keep the top tier alive for at least 30 years. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreverblue Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 17 minutes ago, Bagpuss said: I don't think anybody world disagree with that, but at present there appears to be little to encourage new teams up to the Prem. No that is true, the only alternative would seem to be one big league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuxtonTiger Posted March 23, 2022 Report Share Posted March 23, 2022 12 minutes ago, foreverblue said: No that is true, the only alternative would seem to be one big league. Where do all the riders come from for one big league? Unless all riders ride for two teams, riding for the home team when they meet with the away team using R/R for the same rider. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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