Edinburgh v Glasgow - Friday/Saturday - 15/16 October

[Weeyin]

Hopefully tonight the Tigers will be in a better frame of mind and put up a better fight, unfortunately won't make the meeting as have a prearranged dinner, so updates it is, surely we can't be as bad as last night.

[Endeavour]

28 minutes ago, GS550 said:

Not pointless at all.  It's got you talking..  In the interests of the sport, maybe it is time to ban postage stamp tracks.  Maybe not.  An open question.

As someone else mentioned, engines these days are such that they suit big racetracks and that, paraphrasing, the deficiencies of certain tracks don't enable current day speedway racing (was the gist of what they said anyway).

Maybe start a different thread re track sizes and modern engines.

 

[Endeavour]

56 minutes ago, Gazc said:

Lots of variables can change the outcome off a meeting , if we go into the P/O Semi Final with the mindset we did last night then we will suffer the same heavy defeat we did last night.

Tom will be a miss and we are a man down at the Dale with Marcin I just cant see us keeping it close enough and Thursday will be a dead rubber, hope i am wrong but I cant see anything other than a convincing Monarchs win tonight.

I think we would need to take a minimum of 16 points to Ashfield. 

[Fromafar]

1 minute ago, Endeavour said:

I think we would need to take a minimum of 16 points to Ashfield. 

Though you were a bit unlucky last week think 10 would do.Pickering had a bad night can’t see that happening again.

[spt82]

37 minutes ago, GS550 said:

Not pointless at all.  It's got you talking..  In the interests of the sport, maybe it is time to ban postage stamp tracks.  Maybe not.  An open question.

As someone else mentioned, engines these days are such that they suit big racetracks and that, paraphrasing, the deficiencies of certain tracks don't enable current day speedway racing (was the gist of what they said anyway).

I do probably tend to agree to a certain extent on the bikes these days not necessarily suiting smaller tracks, however good riders with the required skill can produce good racing on small tracks, Cookies pass on Josh in heat 5 last night for example. So no it's definitely not time to ban small tracks.

[Fromafar]

40 minutes ago, GS550 said:

Not pointless at all.  It's got you talking..  In the interests of the sport, maybe it is time to ban postage stamp tracks.  Maybe not.  An open question.

As someone else mentioned, engines these days are such that they suit big racetracks and that, paraphrasing, the deficiencies of certain tracks don't enable current day speedway racing (was the gist of what they said anyway).

The riders have set -ups to suit the smaller tracks.Just some riders are unable to get it right.Armadale is no different to speedway in GB where mainly “ gate and go”.Skill and technical ability is what is required there.The best race tracks in GB are not “big” tracks.

eg

Redcar,Scunthorpe ,Glasgow and Somerset ( before closure).

Bigger tracks like NSS and Peterborough certainly also produce decent racing when prepared right.

[Stuntdouble]

Moan about small tracks , moan about big tracks. Big track at Berwick but moan then about being not wide enough. All the new machinery is the same for all riders. Adapt or fail. Simple as. Preparing is everything. 

[King Jamie]

4 hours ago, GS550 said:

The question arises, how different would it have been if the match had been ridden on an actual speedway track rather than a postage stamp 'Mickey Mouse' track.  And should there be a minimum size of track to be permitted to stage official speedway meetings.  'Racing' at Armadale never seems to look like 'speedway' as most people know it, the riders seem to stall and almost come to a complete halt on the bends.  That an experienced Polish rider couldn't even turn the bike on it probably says more about the deficiencies of the track than it does the rider.

I have to admit, my initial reaction to your post was to chuckle. However, I'll attempt a reply.

I would disagree that track size is the important factor. Variety is the spice of life after all.

A quick scan of some Championship venues (and I hope these measurements are up to date!) shows:

Edinburgh 260m

Redcar 266m

Now, you obviously don't enjoy sunny Armadale but do you not enjoy Redcar meetings? I've always thought the racing there was pretty decent.

Then consider:

Glasgow 302m

Newcastle 300m

I think it was Jaizer who said Newcastle has suffered due to modern engines, and yet it's only 2m smaller than Ashfield!

And, just to show size isn't the important bit, Berwick is 368m. Nowak scored 0 there if I'm not mistaken?

Over the years, I've witnessed some fantastic racing at the likes of sunny Armadale, Mildenhall, Trelawny, even Arena Essex on occasion. All small tracks. As I said at the beginning, variety is the spice of life. Sheffield is my favourite track in the UK and I enjoy my trips to Poland with its big tracks aplenty.

So it's a no from me on the question of minimum size. Indeed, on the basis of the above, I think the argument should be centered more around track shape.

All hail sunny Armadale 

[Jaizer]

1 minute ago, King Jamie said:

I have to admit, my initial reaction to your post was to chuckle. However, I'll attempt a reply.

I would disagree that track size is the important factor. Variety is the spice of life after all.

A quick scan of some Championship venues (and I hope these measurements are up to date!) shows:

Edinburgh 260m

Redcar 266m

Now, you obviously don't enjoy sunny Armadale but do you not enjoy Redcar meetings? I've always thought the racing there was pretty decent.

Then consider:

Glasgow 302m

Newcastle 300m

I think it was Jaizer who said Newcastle has suffered due to modern engines, and yet it's only 2m smaller than Ashfield!

And, just to show size isn't the important bit, Berwick is 368m. Nowak scored 0 there if I'm not mistaken?

Over the years, I've witnessed some fantastic racing at the likes of sunny Armadale, Mildenhall, Trelawny, even Arena Essex on occasion. All small tracks. As I said at the beginning, variety is the spice of life. Sheffield is my favourite track in the UK and I enjoy my trips to Poland with its big tracks aplenty.

So it's a no from me on the question of minimum size. Indeed, on the basis of the above, I think the argument should be centered more around track shape.

All hail sunny Armadale 

Comparing ashfield to Newcastle is comparing apples to oranges. Size isn't everything, it's the space and ability to go fast out and attack different lines. Newcastle is a one line track due to narrow bends, same with armadale, and oddly same with Berwick due to again tight bends. Shape is far more important than size hence Redcar us far more entertaining than armadale

[Normski]

21 minutes ago, Jaizer said:

Comparing ashfield to Newcastle is comparing apples to oranges. Size isn't everything, it's the space and ability to go fast out and attack different lines. Newcastle is a one line track due to narrow bends, same with armadale, and oddly same with Berwick due to again tight bends. Shape is far more important than size hence Redcar us far more entertaining than armadale

Berwick track was widened ready for the 2020 season which sadly never happened

[Jaizer]

Just now, Normski said:

Berwick track was widened ready for the 2020 season which sadly never happened

Yeah I know. Obviously not enough given still one line lol

[Normski]

1 minute ago, Jaizer said:

Yeah I know. Obviously not enough given still one line lol

Like a number of tracks one line nowadays. Suited the away teams though lol

[JanAndersen]

5 hours ago, GS550 said:

The question arises, how different would it have been if the match had been ridden on an actual speedway track rather than a postage stamp 'Mickey Mouse' track.  And should there be a minimum size of track to be permitted to stage official speedway meetings.  'Racing' at Armadale never seems to look like 'speedway' as most people know it, the riders seem to stall and almost come to a complete halt on the bends.  That an experienced Polish rider couldn't even turn the bike on it probably says more about the deficiencies of the track than it does the rider.

Other 'what ifs' such as if Ostergaard had been fit, although unlikely to have done better than Brennan, and Sedgmen would probably have done better than Nowak at Armadale although probably less well at Ashfield so again probably cancels out.

Hook this to my veins 

[Endeavour]

1 hour ago, JanAndersen said:

Hook this to my veins 

Wonder if we would be discussing tracks if Glasgow had gone through. They have won a lot of matches at the Dale since Cookie started riding for Tigers.

[Jaizer]

2 minutes ago, Endeavour said:

Wonder if we would be discussing tracks if Glasgow had gone through. They have won a lot of matches at the Dale since Cookie started riding for Tigers.

Won them before when Shane was in the team. Listen it's probably down to preference I've never enjoyed lakeside, Ipswich, Wolverhampton either. I just don't find that kind of racing as entertaining as Somerset, Redcar, Scunthorpe, Glasgow, BV. 

 

I know for a fact they were looking away from armadale as a friend of my dad's offered Campbell land to build their own track a few years ago but think start up was too expensive.

 

I would never say should be banned as need all tracks we can get, it just comes down to preference for me, I don't find it entertaining

[Endeavour]

3 minutes ago, Jaizer said:

Won them before when Shane was in the team. Listen it's probably down to preference I've never enjoyed lakeside, Ipswich, Wolverhampton either. I just don't find that kind of racing as entertaining as Somerset, Redcar, Scunthorpe, Glasgow, BV. 

 

I know for a fact they were looking away from armadale as a friend of my dad's offered Campbell land to build their own track a few years ago but think start up was too expensive.

 

I would never say should be banned as need all tracks we can get, it just comes down to preference for me, I don't find it entertaining

Agree to a certain extent Jaiser. Mauger always said if you turned left it was a speedway track. Many tracks limited to what they can do because of dog tracks.

Scott Nicholls a joy to watch at the Dale.

Cookie in his pomp too.

[Jaizer]

Just now, Endeavour said:

Agree to a certain extent Jaiser. Mauger always said if you turned left it was a speedway track. Many tracks limited to what they can do because of dog tracks.

Scott Nicholls a joy to watch at the Dale.

Cookie in his pomp too.

Of course that's the case, can only work with what you have. 

 

Peter Carr late 90s take some beating in terms of what could do on the track. 

[Noelinho]

44 minutes ago, Jaizer said:

I would never say should be banned as need all tracks we can get, it just comes down to preference for me, I don't find it entertaining

Banning them would definitely not help given the number of clubs that have been lost already. But there’s a question about the product. My experience of the product last night made me think £18.50 was bad value for money, so I’m not planning to go back. But then again, home support is more important for speedway teams, so I guess as long as the home fans are happy with the product, that’s what matters most.

The track did seem well suited to the Wildcats meeting afterwards though, which was an interesting watch.

[Endeavour]

Sitting in car park at the Dale. Raining .

[Endeavour]

Match should have been in afternoon.