BL65 Posted August 27, 2021 Report Share Posted August 27, 2021 The calculated match average became embedded in British speedway statistics in the mid-1960s thanks to Bryan Seery. Immediately prior to that for the purposes of deciding which riders should be reserve and supplementary reserve the average points per ride were used, based on figures from the last 6 official matches for each rider. The CMA was not a new idea, however. In 1950 the Leicester programmes regularly showed the averages of the team's riders, including number or matches, starts, points, team points (bonus points) and match average. There was an explanatory note on the method of scoring: "To obtain the match average the number of points (including 'Team Points') which a rider has scored is divided by the number of starts which he has made. This gives the number of points per ride. This figure is then multiplied by four to give an average for a full match. By this means, reserves, who as a rule do not get the same opportunity for a full quota of starts, are not penalised, but are brought into line with the other riders for the purpose of calculation." I don't recall seeing any reference to the CMA prior to 1950, has anyone else? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOBBATH Posted August 28, 2021 Report Share Posted August 28, 2021 I think the CMA is the most accurate measure of riders' averages- good for Bryan for developing it. When did he pass away and at what age?? BTW has any body e.g. speedway researchers gone back into speedway history and calculated CMA's for riders who rode in the 40's and 50's to enable comparisons to be made. Was good at maths was our Bryan!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sidney the robin Posted August 28, 2021 Report Share Posted August 28, 2021 5 hours ago, BOBBATH said: I think the CMA is the most accurate measure of riders' averages- good for Bryan for developing it. When did he pass away and at what age?? BTW has any body e.g. speedway researchers gone back into speedway history and calculated CMA's for riders who rode in the 40's and 50's to enable comparisons to be made. Was good at maths was our Bryan!! He died in 2017 BOBBATH aged 81, he was one of the reasons i bought the speedway star his articles and stats terrific. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arnieg Posted August 28, 2021 Report Share Posted August 28, 2021 5 hours ago, BOBBATH said: I think the CMA is the most accurate measure of riders' averages- good for Bryan for developing it. When did he pass away and at what age?? BTW has any body e.g. speedway researchers gone back into speedway history and calculated CMA's for riders who rode in the 40's and 50's to enable comparisons to be made. Was good at maths was our Bryan!! Jackson and Vass use CMA in their rider biographies for pre 1965 performances. The major challenge they had was confirming all the fourth places as these weren't published at the time and hence getting the correct number of rides proved tricky. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norbold Posted August 28, 2021 Report Share Posted August 28, 2021 6 hours ago, BOBBATH said: I think the CMA is the most accurate measure of riders' averages- good for Bryan for developing it. When did he pass away and at what age?? BTW has any body e.g. speedway researchers gone back into speedway history and calculated CMA's for riders who rode in the 40's and 50's to enable comparisons to be made. Was good at maths was our Bryan!! Yes, there is a whole series of books by Peter Jackson, which give full statistics for the years 1933 - 1957, including all riders' averages (home, away and total), based on conversion to cma. They are a goldmine of information! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve roberts Posted August 28, 2021 Report Share Posted August 28, 2021 The two publications by Alan Robertson ("British Speedway Leagues 1991-2014" & The History of British League Speedway 1946-64") contain a wealth of statistice and information...fully recommended! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS50 Posted August 28, 2021 Report Share Posted August 28, 2021 Just going slightly off topic, but the original post mentioned supplementary reserve. I vaguely remember this term, from when I started going to speedway, at a very young age, but was never sure what it was ( and was soon replaced by two reserves). Could someone enlighten me as to what exactly the supplementary reserve was, and how their position differed from the number 7 reserve. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BL65 Posted August 28, 2021 Author Report Share Posted August 28, 2021 The supplementary reserve was the rider with the second lowest points per race average over the previous six official matches. This was each rider's previous six matches, not necessarily the team's previous six matches if a rider had missed one or more of those meetings. The designated reserve in the seven rider team was scheduled for two rides in league meetings, but if ruled out by injury during the course of a meeting his place could be taken by the supplementary reserve. The supplementary reserve was still limited to the maximum number of permitted rides, which up until the introduction of the rider replacement facility was five. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arnieg Posted August 28, 2021 Report Share Posted August 28, 2021 1 hour ago, BL65 said: The supplementary reserve was the rider with the second lowest points per race average over the previous six official matches. This was each rider's previous six matches, not necessarily the team's previous six matches if a rider had missed one or more of those meetings. The designated reserve in the seven rider team was scheduled for two rides in league meetings, but if ruled out by injury during the course of a meeting his place could be taken by the supplementary reserve. The supplementary reserve was still limited to the maximum number of permitted rides, which up until the introduction of the rider replacement facility was five. Last used in 1997 I think Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chunky Posted August 30, 2021 Report Share Posted August 30, 2021 On 8/28/2021 at 4:16 AM, steve roberts said: The two publications by Alan Robertson ("British Speedway Leagues 1991-2014" & The History of British League Speedway 1946-64") contain a wealth of statistice and information...fully recommended! I love "The History of British League Speedway 1946-1964", but I really wish it had averages as well as just the points scored... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chunky Posted August 30, 2021 Report Share Posted August 30, 2021 On 8/28/2021 at 8:01 AM, arnieg said: Last used in 1997 I think I don't actually remember it being used (or at least designated) much past the early '70's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve roberts Posted August 30, 2021 Report Share Posted August 30, 2021 9 minutes ago, chunky said: I love "The History of British League Speedway 1946-1964", but I really wish it had averages as well as just the points scored... Are we discussing the same publication? My copy contains averages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arnieg Posted August 30, 2021 Report Share Posted August 30, 2021 1 minute ago, steve roberts said: Are we discussing the same publication? My copy contains averages. There are two separate publications being discussed here. One a book by Peter Morrish, and the second by Alan Robertson. Both have league tables and results. The former just lists point scorers by team, but also has some narrative. The latter has full stats for each season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve roberts Posted August 30, 2021 Report Share Posted August 30, 2021 6 minutes ago, arnieg said: There are two separate publications being discussed here. One a book by Peter Morrish, and the second by Alan Robertson. Both have league tables and results. The former just lists point scorers by team, but also has some narrative. The latter has full stats for each season. I have the Alan Robertson version...a great publication with many anecdotal references as does his follow up publication. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BL65 Posted August 30, 2021 Author Report Share Posted August 30, 2021 20 minutes ago, chunky said: I don't actually remember it being used (or at least designated) much past the early '70's. The British League race formula was changed for 1969, with teams then having two reserves instead of one reserve and a supplementary reserve in the seven-man teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arnieg Posted August 30, 2021 Report Share Posted August 30, 2021 25 minutes ago, chunky said: I don't actually remember it being used (or at least designated) much past the early '70's. Have checked in a 1997 prog. Supp. reserves are clearly marked. It was a one off season with six man teams that had only one reserve, so an SR was designated for those occasions when the reserve needed replacing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chunky Posted August 30, 2021 Report Share Posted August 30, 2021 19 minutes ago, steve roberts said: I have the Alan Robertson version...a great publication with many anecdotal references as does his follow up publication. Ah, I have the Morrish edition... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chunky Posted August 30, 2021 Report Share Posted August 30, 2021 13 minutes ago, BL65 said: The British League race formula was changed for 1969, with teams then having two reserves instead of one reserve and a supplementary reserve in the seven-man teams. Thanks for that. I said early '70's, but I was thinking 1969! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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