Newcastle Diamonds 2021

[ruffdiamond]

5 minutes ago, iainb said:

Gaz, fair play to you, but maybe you're flogging a dead horse in the current climate. On a positive note there are many clubs that have taken time out (for whatever reason) and come back successfully, my own team Leicester to name one. It doesn't help you get your Speedway fix in the short term though I'll agree

1 step forward and 2 steps back?,,, excellent theory, doesn't sound like it would work, but you'd be surprised. 

[TotallyHonestJohn]

35 minutes ago, Gaz said:

If enough people contribute it may be enough to get through the future seasons and look for a piece of land also.

If it closes that could be it forever as it will be tough and take time to find somewhere new (if that ever happened).

Problem is... there is a great deal of good intention at present but when it comes down to putting in your cold hard earned cash that good intention tends to evaporate into thin air... There is an awful lot to do to take this on as a "consortium" of a fan based set up... We need to be speaking to a good solicitor who can advise on articles of association and possibly running as a Community Interest Company ( CIC )… A CIC is a special type of limited company which exists to benefit the community rather than private shareholders... and a good architect who can draw up provisional plans (cheap or better still FOC) to get proposals underway for the Seaton Burn site... also maybe a reverse approach to our multi million pound company landlords to see if they would sponsor the club maybe in the top flight  on a Monday night and give them TV exposure and brand the full team and stadium for ARC dog and horse racing... you never know they may wish to take on some Corporate Social Responsibility and support the team... but the clock is running...

Regards
THJ

[andys]

24 minutes ago, TotallyHonestJohn said:

Problem is... there is a great deal of good intention at present but when it comes down to putting in your cold hard earned cash that good intention tends to evaporate into thin air... There is an awful lot to do to take this on as a "consortium" of a fan based set up... We need to be speaking to a good solicitor who can advise on articles of association and possibly running as a Community Interest Company ( CIC )… A CIC is a special type of limited company which exists to benefit the community rather than private shareholders... and a good architect who can draw up provisional plans (cheap or better still FOC) to get proposals underway for the Seaton Burn site... also maybe a reverse approach to our multi million pound company landlords to see if they would sponsor the club maybe in the top flight  on a Monday night and give them TV exposure and brand the full team and stadium for ARC dog and horse racing... you never know they may wish to take on some Corporate Social Responsibility and support the team... but the clock is running...

Regards
THJ

Have any meetings been held with ARC regarding the speedway situation. 

[Gaz]

25 minutes ago, TotallyHonestJohn said:

Problem is... there is a great deal of good intention at present but when it comes down to putting in your cold hard earned cash that good intention tends to evaporate into thin air... There is an awful lot to do to take this on as a "consortium" of a fan based set up... We need to be speaking to a good solicitor who can advise on articles of association and possibly running as a Community Interest Company ( CIC )… A CIC is a special type of limited company which exists to benefit the community rather than private shareholders... and a good architect who can draw up provisional plans (cheap or better still FOC) to get proposals underway for the Seaton Burn site... also maybe a reverse approach to our multi million pound company landlords to see if they would sponsor the club maybe in the top flight  on a Monday night and give them TV exposure and brand the full team and stadium for ARC dog and horse racing... you never know they may wish to take on some Corporate Social Responsibility and support the team... but the clock is running...

Regards
THJ

May Rob be interested in spearheading this and being involved or had enough? 

[erniew]

Although I think the fans consortium is a good idea, and I'm sorry to pour cold water on it, the crowdfunding effort was supported by approximately 130 people, many of whom are not Diamonds fans/supporters so the chances of getting enough Diamonds fans to come onboard is very remote. Shame, but that's the reality.

Edited September 16, 2021 by erniew
spelling mistake

[mac101]

would it be viable to run a NL team just to keep speedway at Newcastle for the time being surely with the likes of Freeman Smith Embelton  Douglas all being local would be good for local advertising what would they need through the door to break even at that level put a decent competitive  team together that could win home matches pretty sure Eastbourne and Birmingham both did it to keep the gates open 

[Gaz]

1 minute ago, mac101 said:

would it be viable to run a NL team just to keep speedway at Newcastle for the time being surely with the likes of Freeman Smith Embelton  Douglas all being local would be good for local advertising what would they need through the door to break even at that level put a decent competitive  team together that could win home matches pretty sure Eastbourne and Birmingham both did it to keep the gates open 

The rent is still to high regardless of what league we are in unfortunately.

[ruffdiamond]

12 minutes ago, mac101 said:

would it be viable to run a NL team just to keep speedway at Newcastle for the time being surely with the likes of Freeman Smith Embelton  Douglas all being local would be good for local advertising what would they need through the door to break even at that level put a decent competitive  team together that could win home matches pretty sure Eastbourne and Birmingham both did it to keep the gates open 

Thing is tho, you mention Eastbourne and Birmingham. NL might be they're level, would Newcastle fans accept that?,,, Eastbourne and Birmingham wouldn't be good form to go off.

[Justgotmecpc]

2 hours ago, ruffdiamond said:

I sort of get what you say, but as THJ was saying, its about leaving Brough and finding a new venue. IMHO, racing from Brough will never move forward or be sustainable, worrying each season as to whether you go on the next, also track/stadium access/availability probably loses, or involves costing in it's own way.

Bit a bit if a silly idea, but would a temporary track share work, with say Redcar, whilst a new home could be found?

Don't think you'd get many Newcastle fans wanting to go to Redcar even tho we could possibly start running transport ( coaches ) again.. but could we get enough interest running if only it could happen

[mac101]

29 minutes ago, ruffdiamond said:

Thing is tho, you mention Eastbourne and Birmingham. NL might be they're level, would Newcastle fans accept that?,,, Eastbourne and Birmingham wouldn't be good form to go off.

would they rather it be gone for good even though the rents the same the wages would be a awful lot less better something rather than the end of the diamonds 

[TotallyHonestJohn]

1 hour ago, andys said:

Have any meetings been held with ARC regarding the speedway situation. 

Yes...

1 hour ago, Gaz said:

May Rob be interested in spearheading this and being involved or had enough? 

No... He's had enough...

40 minutes ago, erniew said:

Although I think the fans consortium is a good idea, and I'm sorry to pour cold water on it, the crowdfunding effort was supported by approximately 130 people, many of whom are not Diamonds fans/supporters so the chances of getting enough Diamonds fans to come onboard is very remote. Shame, but that's the reality.

Correct...

38 minutes ago, mac101 said:

would it be viable to run a NL team just to keep speedway at Newcastle for the time being surely with the likes of Freeman Smith Embelton  Douglas all being local would be good for local advertising what would they need through the door to break even at that level put a decent competitive  team together that could win home matches pretty sure Eastbourne and Birmingham both did it to keep the gates open 

No... Unfortunately due to stadium and other costs it isn't viable 

36 minutes ago, Gaz said:

The rent is still to high regardless of what league we are in unfortunately.

Yep £1300 + VAT (don't forget the VAT even though it is an Input as it can be claimed against Outputs it still has to be paid) then medical cover £600 + VAT and a Referee circa £160:00 and a trackman £250/£300 quid, meeting insurance; tyres and other sundry items you are well over £2.5k just to get a meeting on at home then in the NDL who could you guarantee would come and watch as there was barely 200 people stayed to watch the Gems this season; however giving benefit of the doubt lets say you got your 350 hard core and you would have to reduce the entry fee so £15/12/10 quid a head it will leave you around £2.5k to pay for your home and away meetings points money and at an average of 20 quid a point for 100 points leaving around £500 for travel costs and insurance and tyres for the away meeting... even this doesn't stack up...

Honestly whatever is tried will need an awful lot of volunteers; commitment and a benefactor with deep pockets...

Regards
THJ

[ruffdiamond]

7 minutes ago, mac101 said:

would they rather it be gone for good even though the rents the same the wages would be a awful lot less better something rather than the end of the diamonds 

Dunno what the difference would be in the wage bill,,, would the same amount of fans paying less cover it, or would you get less fans paying less, or more fans paying less?

[Gaz]

So… what happens next? could the Supporters club put it up on Facebook and get a proper vote and see who is interested on there? 

Edited September 16, 2021 by Gaz

[diamonds7]

10 minutes ago, Gaz said:

So… what happens next? could the Supporters club put it up on Facebook and get a proper vote and see who is interested on there? 

Good idea but you will get the same old same old not everybody does facebook,twitter and instagram   having said that not everything goes on our website.

[scampispeedway]

More information for everybody, Monmore Green home to the Wolverhampton Wolves Speedway was originally an exact copy of the layout of the Brough Park

track, watching it now live on BT Sport they have changed it from the old days I remembered and set up as all the vast majority of tracks built now are for the modern

laydown engined bikes and so if you make the gate and go as fast as you can, nobody will pass you.

Ivan Mauger said many years ago, if you could ride Brough Park, you could ride anywhere but after watching only a few heats of modern G.P. and League speedway

I change channel and watch something else with more entertainment.

 

[Gaz]

4 minutes ago, diamonds7 said:

Good idea but you will get the same old same old not everybody does facebook,twitter and instagram   having said that not everything goes on our website.

I totally agree, although more people go on Facebook than come on here.. the website would be best option with a link to the vote maybe on Facebook. 
If the supporters club are on here maybe they could do this.. who knows.

[TotallyHonestJohn]

22 minutes ago, ruffdiamond said:

Dunno what the difference would be in the wage bill,,, would the same amount of fans paying less cover it, or would you get less fans paying less, or more fans paying less?

See previous; the costs remain the same for putting a meeting on between 2.5k and 3k a meeting but remember that home meeting needs to cover the away meeting cost and this is what blew Worky out of the water 328 turning up to the home meeting with Scunny and the team scoring near 60 points in this match and then going to Scunny and scoring over 50 down their where they usually got 35... Worky vs Newcastle 480 in and Worky get over 50 both home and away meetings when they very rarely broke 40 at Brough; Ipswich 428 crowd at DP then you win down their and the travel costs are double and you pay out for 47 points instead of the usual 30/35 ish and I could give many more examples... it is not sustainable even at 20 quid a head that gives you around 10k of income off that Newcastle meeting with an outlay of 2.5k for the stadium rental and putting the home meeting on then 70 quid a point average for your riders wages and 500 quid on travel; but you also have other costs that need paid for throughout the season.

Rob Grant wasn't daft and he knew that 550 was his break even figure and that isn't an ambitious figure to be fair but we haven't got anywhere near that with the exception of the the first meeting of the season against Edinburgh when the Covid restrictions were on; the Redcar meeting and Double Header with Poole and Plymouth and for whatever the reasons we got 1088 in through the doors for that meeting which could have been the Poole effect with a good side and/or the Bjarne and Crump farewell tour effect with Plymouth... who knows...  Would these meetings as separate meeting have brought in the same figures for two separate meetings? again who knows....

It is a definite juggling act when you are working on such tight margins; and you have to put out a competitive team; the bottom line is we can just about guarantee now around 350 fans which doesn't sustain "Jack" at the minute; however that figure would potentially keep an NDL team running if we could halve or better still get rid of the rental cost but we cant so you need 550/600/650 in to maintain a Championship team 200 to 300 more fans more than we have now... they all ain't sitting on a wall outside unfortunately and its not for the want of trying s the promotion have done a lot of work in this respect to try and encourage more people to come... and if we got just over a 1000 for every meeting we wouldn't be having this conversation whatsoever...

Regards
THJ 

[ruffdiamond]

1 hour ago, TotallyHonestJohn said:

See previous;

Regards

THJ 

Yeah, think I posted just at the same time then had to rush out.

[ruffdiamond]

2 minutes ago, ruffdiamond said:

Yeah, think I posted just at the same time then had to rush out.

Not that it matters a jot now, but in general the crowds look smaller, but I wonder how many of the missing crowd payed or didn't pay for entrance?

[noaksey]

Problem is as THJ referred to in his original post is how would any losses incurred as the season progresses be covered?

There has to be a vehicle to run the club and the shareholders/directors/trustees are going to be on the hook for any losses that wouldn't be covered by funds raised to date.

You might get people to stick in a sum of money at the start or a regular payment but what would happen when a cash call came in the middle of the season....

Tricky