Why speedway is failing

[cowboy cookie returns?]

Why is speedway failing? The video at the start of this thread is pretty spot on add that to views that have been aired on any number of threads on here then the answers are all here to see.

Too much doubling up, too many guests, poor racing, lack of value for money & a rule boom that is a complete farce.

Just a quick visit to the Ipswich thread and the arguments & disagreement between different fans on who can & can't guest for who & when. The arguments about what average is used or not used for team building when replacing a rider makes the whole thing a joke!

However in conclusion the issues the sport has today have been around for the last 20 years at least & the powers that be seem to do nothing. 

Do I have hope that they will start to address the issues now? No not really sadly the result will be an extinct sport by 2030.

[JamesHarris]

Just spent the last hour thinking how British speedway could re-attract the punters and provide value for money - sorry to waffle on...

1. Scrap doubling up once and for all. If there's not enough riders to fill both leagues then combine the two leagues into one. All we see now is the same riders racing each other all of the time just in different race jackets depending on what night of the week it is. If a football player turned out for Chelsea on Saturday and then Millwall on Wednesday it would be called a joke!

2. Bring back the aggregate bonus point. This current point system is stupid and confusing. The old bonus point gave a meeting something to race for even if a team was losing on the night and sometimes we even had a run-off. 

3. Revert to the old 13 heat format. Have a full 2nd half which includes junior league races and individual heats. How about also staging say 4 80cc races prior to the main meeting?

4. Employ a centre green announcer/ master of ceremonies that can actually entertain the crowds with a bit of humour and also one that knows what they are talking about. This was the one key area where most tracks fail. Most of them are boring dinosaurs from the 60's. Also do away with the boring rider interviews. Most of the time the riders don't want to talk and what they do say is boring and can easily cure a sleep disorder. 

5. Actually promote the sport. Local radio and other media is a great thing. Don't just open the gates and expect people to turn up. Those days are gone. 

 

[cowboy cookie returns?]

Ipswich my local track are one of the better on social media activity & also have a great tie up with the football club. An indicator of how much work is need last night match report on Facebook.

A big local Derby with king's Lynn the Facebook match report gets a total of 47 likes & 5 comments. 

[CountArthur]

I've been one of the biggest critics as to way the sport is run over the past few years but I feel that, this season, the promoters are getting a bit of criticism that is perhaps a bit harsh.

For a start, to have any sort of functioning league this season with the restrictions that they have had to endure is an achievement in itself. I didn't think that things would be as good as it is this year and the promoters seem to have pulled together to at least keep the sport going.

The doubling up system and the guest system has got out of hand and there needs to be a long term plan to reduce the numbers in both. 

However, I think a bit of leeway and understanding has got to be given this year and we have to be thankful we have got three leagues running, against the odds, and hope there is a plan beyond this year.

I've never known, in almost 50 years of watching speedway, so few team places filled by non British riders and that has got to be a good thing. However, this year has shown that we need the European riders to fill team places and once travel restrictions are lifted, hopefully we will see a few more riders back in the sport from overseas.

I've done a quick count and to my reckoning there are 8 Danes, 3 Americans, 2 Germans and one rider each from Austria, Italy, Finland and the Netherlands in UK league racing, and thanks to the resident Aussies, we have got some racing worth watching.

I don't know how many leagues are the answer but if we can keep supporting our tracks and keep them all going this year it would be an achievement.

If we can get Swindon, Bradford, Oxford and Isle of Wight back into league racing, possibly Buxton and Coventry longer term, things might look a bit brighter.

Matt - Speedway Researcher

Edited July 31, 2021 by CountArthur
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[Pinny]

In my opinion promoters in general are just as much to blame for the sport going on such a huge decline as anyone. Its their product to sell each week and very few do a good enough job. Admittedly I have never been a speedway promoter and never will be, but I wouldn't invest in a speedway club and expect handouts to keep the club going. What I have seen recently is a couple of Championship clubs having the begging bowl out for money to help them through the season as well as threatening to close down because the fans aren't packing into the stadiums. And those clubs are clubs with new promoters over the last couple of years who have never promoted before.

The value for money just isn't there. On average around two hours stood around watching 15 heats of speedway, overpriced food and drink, barely anything going on between the heats and more often than not being stood in freezing cold conditions listening to completely out dated music. Add that with poor stadiums that look older than the average pensioner and processional racing on track and its clear to see why there are no fans coming through the gate.

I absolutely love speedway, admittedly no where near as much as when I attended Newport regular before we shut down and I moved to Aus, so I am not one that wants to see the sport fail and cease to exist. But I really do think that the sport has been driven that far into the ground (in Britain) that it is beyond a state of repair. It would take a miracle of epic proportions to revive the sport in the UK, IMO.

I remember the beginning of the end being when Rickardsson quit Poole after a few meetings one season, I think it was the season they brought the grading system into the Elite League. Ever since, the quality has got weaker and weaker, prices have gone up and up and ultimately, crowds have gone down and down.

 

[CountArthur]

It is difficult to see what the answer is and I don't think there is a simple solution to the sport's problems.

On a good night, live speedway is as good as any other sport in the world but it shoots itself in the foot far too often.

The rules should be simple but they aren't. Guests and doubling up has turned into a monster that only benefits the riders currently racing but constantly squeezes out others and has made the fans feel like the riders aren't 'theirs'. And the stadiums are poor, there is no getting away from that.

Racing wise, I've been going for 45 years and we all remember the classics. However, there were duff meetings in the 70s, 80s and 90s and not all meetings are going to be brilliant. I've been to 8 meetings at four tracks this season and would say that 2 were very good, 1 was poor and 5 were in the middle and still enjoyable. I watch Sheffield Wednesday quite regularly as well and would say that the ratio of good, poor and average games was about the same.

[Pinny]

Another thing that struck me as lunacy is that some people reckon that 12 quid was a good price for a middle tier live stream. I find that baffling when you compare that to what you pay for streaming services such as Netflix, I pay I think $14 a month for Netflix which is about 7-8 pounds sterling. That is what you call good value.

As people have been stating on various threads I have been viewing, two adults to attend a Premiership meeting with a couple of drinks each and some food is in excess of 50 quid. You cannot be demanding these prices when none of the worlds top riders ride here anymore.

[Vince]

Ask Barry Bishop and Martin Widman to be in charge of bringing Speedway into the 21st century. They not only understand that these days you need to provide more than 15 heats of Speedway to make a night out but will listen to the ideas and thoughts of others. In fact they are so forward thinking that they were forced out of league Speedway in the UK!

[Pinny]

35 minutes ago, Vince said:

Ask Barry Bishop and Martin Widman to be in charge of bringing Speedway into the 21st century. They not only understand that these days you need to provide more than 15 heats of Speedway to make a night out but will listen to the ideas and thoughts of others. In fact they are so forward thinking that they were forced out of league Speedway in the UK!

The thing is even a lot of the current speedway fans can't accept the world is moving forward to. Mainly the older fans refuse to use social media (and love to make a point of stating it) and therefore demand that club websites should be the first place exclusive news appears. Social media is the place to be these days and youngsters are glued to it and this is why clubs announce a lot of news on social media rather than websites first.

The whole product needs dragging into the 21st century there is no doubt about it.

 

[barrybishop]

3 hours ago, Pinny said:

The thing is even a lot of the current speedway fans can't accept the world is moving forward to. Mainly the older fans refuse to use social media (and love to make a point of stating it) and therefore demand that club websites should be the first place exclusive news appears. Social media is the place to be these days and youngsters are glued to it and this is why clubs announce a lot of news on social media rather than websites first.

The whole product needs dragging into the 21st century there is no doubt about it.

 

from our perspective we even have staff that do not use a telephone... its true... so our main marketing it online (free) social media, website, and so on, then papers local and national, local activity magazines, we advertise with both ferry companies with video action, we have leaflets, posters, and banners, we do community shows, speedway related podcasts, the only thing we havent done this year is the radio stations although of course locally our results get out there in the sports news and we have been on TV each week since we reopened.  But it is a real challenge to get the right message on the right media for our fanbase demographic. We are always realdy to hear new ways to advertise the club and do more.. 

[chunky]

6 hours ago, Pinny said:

The thing is even a lot of the current speedway fans can't accept the world is moving forward to. Mainly the older fans refuse to use social media (and love to make a point of stating it) and therefore demand that club websites should be the first place exclusive news appears. Social media is the place to be these days and youngsters are glued to it and this is why clubs announce a lot of news on social media rather than websites first.

The whole product needs dragging into the 21st century there is no doubt about it.

 

Truest post yet...

[Chadster]

On 7/30/2021 at 8:30 PM, JamesHarris said:

Just spent the last hour thinking how British speedway could re-attract the punters and provide value for money - sorry to waffle on...

1. Scrap doubling up once and for all. If there's not enough riders to fill both leagues then combine the two leagues into one. All we see now is the same riders racing each other all of the time just in different race jackets depending on what night of the week it is. If a football player turned out for Chelsea on Saturday and then Millwall on Wednesday it would be called a joke!

2. Bring back the aggregate bonus point. This current point system is stupid and confusing. The old bonus point gave a meeting something to race for even if a team was losing on the night and sometimes we even had a run-off. 

3. Revert to the old 13 heat format. Have a full 2nd half which includes junior league races and individual heats. How about also staging say 4 80cc races prior to the main meeting?

4. Employ a centre green announcer/ master of ceremonies that can actually entertain the crowds with a bit of humour and also one that knows what they are talking about. This was the one key area where most tracks fail. Most of them are boring dinosaurs from the 60's. Also do away with the boring rider interviews. Most of the time the riders don't want to talk and what they do say is boring and can easily cure a sleep disorder. 

5. Actually promote the sport. Local radio and other media is a great thing. Don't just open the gates and expect people to turn up. Those days are gone. 

 

Some interesting ideas, James, thanks for posting them.

 

I'd agree with point 1. It will be difficult to achieve but if needs be we should go down to 5 man teams at first but with a determination over 4 or 5 years to bring enough riders through to get back to 7 man teams.

With point 2, I don't see the existing point system as confusing; 3 points for a win, 1 for a draw and a bonus for an away draw or win by more than 6 points, or an away loss by 6 or less. Seems quite simple to me, more so than the bonus point systems in cricket and rugby. The present system keeps both matches live. Take Belle Vue v Wolves as an example. Having lost by 10 points at home the Aces had little chance of winning an aggregate bonus point at Monmore Green, but every chance of keeping the match tight and getting a bonus point for a narrow loss, which they did.

The 13 heat formula was a poor one in my view, with number 1s meeting once only, and that in heat 1. Second halves were scrapped for a good reason; the riders weren't taking them seriously and the fans were leaving the stadium in droves after heat 13. The only point of second halves in my view would be for a 6 heat junior match, perhaps as part of the policy stated in point 1 of bringing through more riders to get back up to 7 man teams. I read a piece of market research that the ECB commissioned about the new Hundred cricket tournament in which respondents expressed a strong preference for being able to be on their way home by 9 o'clock. Sticking to 15 heats, run sharply should enable that to happen and might encourage more parents to come as their children could be home at a reasonable hour.

Centre green presenters are a group cursed to be remembered only when they've annoyed people. If you've just watched a great meeting, you're unlikely to give any thought to the presenter, a bad one and you're left cursing them and the wretched music etc. I was fortunate enough at Wimbledon to watch two of the best centre-green presenters, Mike Bennett and Dave Lanning and they certainly added something to the meeting, but they were masters of the wind-up, and I suspect that would be frowned on in these snowflake times. I do think that the whole idea of a show, lights, music etc but most importantly snappily presented is really important and an area for much improvement. Mascots could be better used. They don't do anything for me, but when I was watching Brentford they had two mascots working the crowd before kick-off and the kids loved them up, queuing up for selfies etc.

Agree with everything in point 5.

[steve roberts]

48 minutes ago, Chadster said:

Some interesting ideas, James, thanks for posting them.

 

I'd agree with point 1. It will be difficult to achieve but if needs be we should go down to 5 man teams at first but with a determination over 4 or 5 years to bring enough riders through to get back to 7 man teams.

With point 2, I don't see the existing point system as confusing; 3 points for a win, 1 for a draw and a bonus for an away draw or win by more than 6 points, or an away loss by 6 or less. Seems quite simple to me, more so than the bonus point systems in cricket and rugby. The present system keeps both matches live. Take Belle Vue v Wolves as an example. Having lost by 10 points at home the Aces had little chance of winning an aggregate bonus point at Monmore Green, but every chance of keeping the match tight and getting a bonus point for a narrow loss, which they did.

The 13 heat formula was a poor one in my view, with number 1s meeting once only, and that in heat 1. Second halves were scrapped for a good reason; the riders weren't taking them seriously and the fans were leaving the stadium in droves after heat 13. The only point of second halves in my view would be for a 6 heat junior match, perhaps as part of the policy stated in point 1 of bringing through more riders to get back up to 7 man teams. I read a piece of market research that the ECB commissioned about the new Hundred cricket tournament in which respondents expressed a strong preference for being able to be on their way home by 9 o'clock. Sticking to 15 heats, run sharply should enable that to happen and might encourage more parents to come as their children could be home at a reasonable hour.

Centre green presenters are a group cursed to be remembered only when they've annoyed people. If you've just watched a great meeting, you're unlikely to give any thought to the presenter, a bad one and you're left cursing them and the wretched music etc. I was fortunate enough at Wimbledon to watch two of the best centre-green presenters, Mike Bennett and Dave Lanning and they certainly added something to the meeting, but they were masters of the wind-up, and I suspect that would be frowned on in these snowflake times. I do think that the whole idea of a show, lights, music etc but most importantly snappily presented is really important and an area for much improvement. Mascots could be better used. They don't do anything for me, but when I was watching Brentford they had two mascots working the crowd before kick-off and the kids loved them up, queuing up for selfies etc.

Agree with everything in point 5.

I don't particularly go along with that one. Many Number One's (based on average) rode further down the team order...the likes of Collins, Lovaas, Gundersen, Jessup, T.Jansson, Wilson, Boulger, Simmons, Lee, Crump, Sanders etc etc and would meet the opposite Number One twice. Even Mauger would ride at Number Four or even Number Two on occasions for tactical reasons.

Not sure about the second half analogy either...the competition would often be quite fierce amongst team mates and Betts, Cole and Simmons, for example, always wanted to get one over resulting on one occasion Terry receiveing an injury in one second half event. I liked the Second Halves...gave an opportunity for youngsters/prospective team members gaining a team place and experience. I've said it often enough we were lucky at Cowley what with the Promotional tie up with Eastbourne and Peterborough we got the likes of Balllard, Kennet, Davis, Greer, Geer etc plying their trade before eventually makin the move into the main team. Phil Crump was reported as considering his postion in British Speedway due to the loss of the Second Halves and lost earnings. I did put the question to Martin Rogers some time back and he did give an interesting insight in an edition of "Backtrack" citing Bert Harkins as one example who loved the second halves and who also went into print citing same.

Edited August 2, 2021 by steve roberts

[Pieman72]

I'd be happy to pop down the road and watch some British riders and not breaking the bank in the process. Oh and a cheap pint and something to eat not dripping with fat.

Edited August 3, 2021 by Pieman72

[cowboy cookie returns?]

1 hour ago, steve roberts said:

I don't particularly go along with that one. Many Number One's (based on average) rode further down the team order...the likes of Collins, Lovaas, Gundersen, Jessup, T.Jansson, Wilson, Boulger, Simmons, Lee, Crump, Sanders etc etc and would meet the opposite Number One twice. Even Mauger would ride at Number Four or even Number Two on occasions for tactical reasons.

Not sure about the second half analogy either...the competition would often be quite fierce amongst team mates and Betts, Cole and Simmons, for example, always wanted to get one over resulting on one occasion Terry receiveing an injury in one second half event. I liked the Second Halves...gave an opportunity for youngsters/prospective team members gaining a team place and experience. I've said it often enough we were lucky at Cowley what with the Promotional tie up with Eastbourne and Peterborough we got the likes of Balllard, Kennet, Davis, Greer, Geer etc plying their trade before eventually makin the move into the main team. Phil Crump was reported as considering his postion in British Speedway due to the loss of the Second Halves and lost earnings. I did put the question to Martin Rogers some time back and he did give an interesting insight in an edition of "Backtrack" citing Bert Harkins as one example who loved the second halves and who also went into print citing same.

That's when team management involved tactical decisions, the rules of today don't allow for it. Your number 1 must ride at 1 what a crap rule that was to bring in

[Topcat]

We can't live in the past,but the 13 heat format with a second half was pretty good. Clubs are failing at all levels and unless there are radical changes and one league we are on a downhill spiral. Times are tough and realistically are going to be so for some time into the future.

[OGT]

A lot of the ideas being suggested on here are really akin to re-arranging the deckchairs on the Titanic. For speedway to continue/survive on any level, it has to attract new fans, young fans at that. I honestly cannot see how this can be achieved in this country. 

Old duffers like me waffling on that football/cricket/rugby, bike racing etc is crap and speedway is the greatest sport on earth really need to emigrate to Poland for this opinion to be anywhere near correct.

I honestly hope that by some miracle a master plan can be evolved for speedway to rebuild and bounce back better, but without youngsters coming through the turnstiles, it ain't gonna happen. 

Edited August 2, 2021 by OGT
Spelling

[Pinny]

Bring back the 4TT qualifiers and the Golden/Silver/Bronze helmet races too. Another thing gone that has aligned with a major decline. 

[chunky]

19 minutes ago, Pinny said:

Bring back the 4TT qualifiers and the Golden/Silver/Bronze helmet races too. Another thing gone that has aligned with a major decline. 

I always said that it was the variety of formats that kept us happy! Three or four league matches, then a cup tie. Then an individual meeting.  A couple more league matches, followed by a Test Match. Then a couple more league, then a 4TT...

[Pinny]

Plus , the 4tt qualifiers brought in three sets of away fans to a home venue instead of just one. Always good crowds.