phillwhitewasmad Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 1 hour ago, cowboy cookie returns? said: I think you're missing my point. Riders being employed by multiple clubs through the out of control doubling up rule is another reason the sport isn't taken seriously & lacks any form of credibility outside of the ever shrinking speedway bubble. No I fully understand the point and in fairness I despise the doubling up of riders . My point is Peterborough new a rider was already signed for another club it was there choice to use him so can be no complaints. Doubling up will continue as long as clubs carry on selecting the same riders Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 1 hour ago, cowboy cookie returns? said: I think you're missing my point. Riders being employed by multiple clubs through the out of control doubling up rule is another reason the sport isn't taken seriously & lacks any form of credibility outside of the ever shrinking speedway bubble. It's a chicken and egg situation though, if we had more riders we wouldn't need riders to double up but we need more fans/money in the sport to encourage guys to come into the sport (or come from abroad) to race for the clubs .... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IainB Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 (edited) 43 minutes ago, Trees said: It's a chicken and egg situation though, if we had more riders we wouldn't need riders to double up but we need more fans/money in the sport to encourage guys to come into the sport (or come from abroad) to race for the clubs .... We almost nearly kind of do have the riders though, it's just that they aren't given the chance. Look at Jason Edwards, binned from Eastbourne and binned from Plymouth in favour of a rider from the upper league. BV elect to go for NBJ instead of a home grown rider... and they operate a NDL "feeder" team!!!! Just 2 examples, there'll be loads of others from the last few years Edited September 1, 2021 by iainb 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frigbo Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 Don't kid yourself we have league speedway nowadays - we don't. What we have is a contrived circus where the same riders swap team suits and ride at different tracks that are thrown into 2 groups to give the illusion of 2 leagues... Many talk of the current situation being necessary due to lack of riders, another way to look at it is there are too many clubs. Let the weaker clubs close and create a proper, sustainable and credible single league to build up from. Of course, the poor little pampered, over-inflated rider egos will then complain they don't earn enough - because of course they couldn't get a real job to supplement speedway earnings, could they? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dog Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 A lot of clubs don't give the chance for riders to develop like they did years ago in the search for instant success but is that because promoters know that fans walk away from an unsuccessful team rather than just enjoying their speedway? I don't know. I'm in the minority in the respect that doubling up/down doesn't really bother me, I support the 7 riders who ride for my team irrespective of where else they might rider. We don't moan if they ride for another team abroad do we? It's a necessary evil that I accepted years ago, riders need as many meetings as possible to make it worthwhile or they quit, if they quit then you run out of riders anyway because youngsters don't aspire to being a speedway rider anymore. I also think that there's worse things about speedway than doubling up that tend to make the sport taken less seriously too... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dog Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 14 minutes ago, frigbo said: Don't kid yourself we have league speedway nowadays - we don't. What we have is a contrived circus where the same riders swap team suits and ride at different tracks that are thrown into 2 groups to give the illusion of 2 leagues... Many talk of the current situation being necessary due to lack of riders, another way to look at it is there are too many clubs. Let the weaker clubs close and create a proper, sustainable and credible single league to build up from. Of course, the poor little pampered, over-inflated rider egos will then complain they don't earn enough - because of course they couldn't get a real job to supplement speedway earnings, could they? The problem is now is that some of the stronger, well ran clubs are only a few poorly supported meetings away from going under. If we had less clubs, do you think supporters would travel long distances to see speedway? Maybe a start would be to tackle riders wages tho I know they will hate the idea. Would it work if riders were paid a standard rate across the board? ie: your highest averaged rider gets £60 per point (just for example before people shoot me down!), your number 2 gets £50 per point and so on down to the reserves. It might make riders think that every point really does count towards income and create competitiveness within a team. It might encourage riders to go out and get sponsors and look after them too for any extra income. The BSPL could offer bonuses to league winners and prize money for being the British Final winner. Try and create incentives rather than guarantees. Let's help track curators a little bit by having wet weather tyres instead of calling off a meeting because it looks like rain and go back to making bikes more user friendly so we can race in most weathers. Their must be a few things that can be tried to make it sustainable for clubs as a starting point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy cookie returns? Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 5 hours ago, Trees said: If you bought all the stadiums and all the promoters out you'd have a free hand to do exactly what you like to make British speedway a rich sport ..... You would be the "Barry Hearn" of speedway lol. So you don't think league racing is the way to go? Club days ala Aussie wouldn't work here, a few fun days ala IOW wouldn't work from March to October, every other country sticks to league racing so I'm at a loss. The only other thing would be your millions could get it on TV more, which could potentially Bering in big sponsorship and so on ...... Shame you haven't got those millions ..... Always makes me laugh how bring more money into the sport & have better/more TV coverage is always town up as the answer. Sky TV pumped millions into the sport over what a 15 year period at one stage it even go back page space in the sun newspaper. What did the BSPA do with sky's millions & all that exposure? Answer the square route of sod all appart from propping up a failing business model. The golden ticket to better times for British speedway was so sadly wasted. As for league speedway in this country it's nothing more than a traveling circus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 24 minutes ago, cowboy cookie returns? said: Always makes me laugh how bring more money into the sport & have better/more TV coverage is always town up as the answer. Sky TV pumped millions into the sport over what a 15 year period at one stage it even go back page space in the sun newspaper. What did the BSPA do with sky's millions & all that exposure? Answer the square route of sod all appart from propping up a failing business model. The golden ticket to better times for British speedway was so sadly wasted. As for league speedway in this country it's nothing more than a traveling circus. You could say that about ALL league speedway, league football, anything! It's only the club fans that are passionate and one or two riders who race for the clubs in the areas they belong to ..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 4 hours ago, frigbo said: Don't kid yourself we have league speedway nowadays - we don't. What we have is a contrived circus where the same riders swap team suits and ride at different tracks that are thrown into 2 groups to give the illusion of 2 leagues... Many talk of the current situation being necessary due to lack of riders, another way to look at it is there are too many clubs. Let the weaker clubs close and create a proper, sustainable and credible single league to build up from. Of course, the poor little pampered, over-inflated rider egos will then complain they don't earn enough - because of course they couldn't get a real job to supplement speedway earnings, could they? We've had that for years, if it's not in this country, it's Sweden, Denmark and Poland! Never worried me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frigbo Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Trees said: We've had that for years, if it's not in this country, it's Sweden, Denmark and Poland! Never worried me! Big difference between riders racing in other competitions for clubs and representing more than one team in what is essentially the same league... Ideally, it would be one rider, one club Europe-wide to enable inter-league European competition, but realistically that will never happen. Edited September 1, 2021 by frigbo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 Just now, frigbo said: Big difference between riders racing in other competitions for clubs and representing more than one team in what is essentially the same league... Not at all .... imo. They're all different teams wherever they are??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frigbo Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 2 minutes ago, Trees said: Not at all .... imo. They're all different teams wherever they are??? Do you not see the issues having 2 'leagues' with basically the same riders brings? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deano Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, frigbo said: Do you not see the issues having 2 'leagues' with basically the same riders brings? It was the original reason I walked away a few years ago. I got fed up with our riders getting injured riding for someone else, either guesting or doubling up. It effected my teams league position and cup qualification one year. I've come back this season and well... what can I say it's worse!!! Sticking with this sport means you don't notice the changes, walk away for a few years and you really notice them, not one of them is an improvement, but just weakens the sport. Same old promoter comments "use it or lose it". Edited September 1, 2021 by Deano Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy cookie returns? Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 2 hours ago, Trees said: You could say that about ALL league speedway, league football, anything! It's only the club fans that are passionate and one or two riders who race for the clubs in the areas they belong to ..... No you couldn't in any other professional team sport a rider/player signs a contract to ride for one team for x amount of seasons. Yes they might leave for your rivals at the end of their contract or transferred loaned out part way though but they never appear for another team the day after appearing for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy cookie returns? Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 2 hours ago, Trees said: Not at all .... imo. They're all different teams wherever they are??? Take Chris Harris as an example 23rd August rides for Peterborough, 25th August rides for Birmingham & finally 26th August rides for Ipswich. Anyone who can't see the issue with that or defends it are part of the reason this sport in the UK is finished it's utterly crazy & provides no credibility end of!! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy cookie returns? Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 2 hours ago, frigbo said: Do you not see the issues having 2 'leagues' with basically the same riders brings? I don't think trees does Frigbo Take Chris Harris as an example 23rd August rides for Peterborough, 25th August rides for Birmingham & finally 26th August rides for Ipswich. And to cap it all off rides in a Peterborough team tomorrow night that includes 2 guests & rider replacement to cover injuries that their riders picked up riding in the championship against Ipswich, who he rode for last week! Anyone who can't see the issue with that or defends it are part of the reason this sport in the UK is finished it's utterly crazy & provides no credibility end of!! Sadly Trees is deluded! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deano Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 16 minutes ago, cowboy cookie returns? said: Sadly Trees is deluded! Nooo, having spent time in Poland watching Speedway with Trees. I can categorically say she is really nice person. Not deluded just loves speedway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, frigbo said: Do you not see the issues having 2 'leagues' with basically the same riders brings? All the leagues in the world have similar riders racing in them. In a perfect world of course I'd like a group of 7 riders to race for one team only in the whole world with daily practice and earning thousands every meeting, unfortunately we don't live in the perfect world! Instead my team race on our race night for my team, all I ask is 100% to my team on that night....... I like to see how they get on for other teams but all I really care about is what they do for Lynn Edited September 1, 2021 by Trees Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OveFundinFan Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 Absolutely ridiculous have a rider riding for multi teams. At this moment in time it is clear that there are a) too many teams or b) not enough riders. It’s a complete farce to have a rider riding for multiple teams in the same week. For sure there may be instances when an injury means a rider stands in for another, but it should be very short term, and certainly not one particular riding for multiple times in a week. Doesn’t look like it will be sorted this side of the total collapse of British speedway. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted September 1, 2021 Report Share Posted September 1, 2021 3 hours ago, OveFundinFan said: Absolutely ridiculous have a rider riding for multi teams. At this moment in time it is clear that there are a) too many teams or b) not enough riders. It’s a complete farce to have a rider riding for multiple teams in the same week. For sure there may be instances when an injury means a rider stands in for another, but it should be very short term, and certainly not one particular riding for multiple times in a week. Doesn’t look like it will be sorted this side of the total collapse of British speedway. What team do you support OveFundinFan? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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