Ipswich v Belle Vue 8 July

[Baldyman]

Is the weather going to win this one? 

[Rob B]

3 hours ago, Baldyman said:

Is the weather going to win this one? 

What forecast you looking at, looks fine to me. 

[one of clubs]

21 hours ago, Arch Stanton said:

You mean you wished Ipswich had a half fit struggling Crump riding so your team had a better chance of winning? At least be honest rather than chucking a sly barb in. 

No. We are asking is Jason fit or isn't he?. It's not rocket science. He rode friday so he is fit.End of story. No team wants to see a hollow victory.

Edited July 7, 2021 by one of clubs
additions.

[Steve0]

20 minutes ago, one of clubs said:

No. We are asking is Jason fit or isn't he?. It's not rocket science. He rode friday so he is fit.End of story. No team wants to see a hollow victory.

He didn’t ride on Friday as it was rained off! 

[JamesB]

1 hour ago, one of clubs said:

No. We are asking is Jason fit or isn't he?. It's not rocket science. He rode friday so he is fit.End of story. No team wants to see a hollow victory.

 

46 minutes ago, Steve0 said:

He didn’t ride on Friday as it was rained off! 

He rode at Ipswich on the 28th June but he wasn’t fit to ride.

He was in so much pain that he couldn’t turn the bike!

[one of clubs]

1 hour ago, Steve0 said:

He didn’t ride on Friday as it was rained off! 

That was my mistake, i forgot it was rained off. The point is that he was declared as being in the team, as far as i can see.

[cuckootoyou]

Do injured or sick riders have to have a medical certificate? Surely they have to have some sort proof.

[SPEEDY69]

I don't think so. He was in hospital so people know he was injured. A doctor never refuses to sign you off if you want to be anyway, ooh oww yeah just there. 

Edited July 8, 2021 by SPEEDY69

[Arch Stanton]

16 hours ago, one of clubs said:

The point is that he was declared as being in the team, as far as i can see.

By Plymouth, not Ipswich. Look, we know how it is, you Belle Vue fans would much rather see a half fit Crump struggle to a few points to give your team a much better chance to grab 3 or even 4 points (you might still get them anyway!), we get it. 
 

As I’ve already said, if Plymouth were prepared to take the hit and still include him without him being 100% fit, then that’s their prerogative. What’s that got to do with Ipswich?

Their stance, is they’re going to wait until he’s 100% and will do the team justice, which surely they’re more than entitled to do? I’ve even seen Ipswich fans question Ipswich here which to be honest, has totally baffled me. 
 

Why should Ipswich give their opponents an advantage before the tapes rise in the first heat by fielding a 45 year old bloke who only a few weeks ago broke 8 ribs and isn’t yet totally fit? Are you THAT desperate for success???

Ipswich have a business to run, have little to no chance of making the play offs, and up until Monday had lost 7 matches on the spin. They need supporters through the gate as much as everyone else so they’re quite right not to gamble on the fitness of their number 1 until he’s back to full fitness. To me it’s very simple!

[BartoszZmarzlikFan]

Ipswich still trying to cheat. Come on the Aces.

[Bagpuss]

48 minutes ago, Arch Stanton said:

By Plymouth, not Ipswich. Look, we know how it is, you Belle Vue fans would much rather see a half fit Crump struggle to a few points to give your team a much better chance to grab 3 or even 4 points (you might still get them anyway!), we get it. 
 

As I’ve already said, if Plymouth were prepared to take the hit and still include him without him being 100% fit, then that’s their prerogative. What’s that got to do with Ipswich?

Their stance, is they’re going to wait until he’s 100% and will do the team justice, which surely they’re more than entitled to do? I’ve even seen Ipswich fans question Ipswich here which to be honest, has totally baffled me. 
 

Why should Ipswich give their opponents an advantage before the tapes rise in the first heat by fielding a 45 year old bloke who only a few weeks ago broke 8 ribs and isn’t yet totally fit? Are you THAT desperate for success???

Ipswich have a business to run, have little to no chance of making the play offs, and up until Monday had lost 7 matches on the spin. They need supporters through the gate as much as everyone else so they’re quite right not to gamble on the fitness of their number 1 until he’s back to full fitness. To me it’s very simple!

I don't think Aces fans are that bothered, they are going to qualify for the Play Offs at a canter anyway. Its more to do with integrity, you have to admit that it really doesn't look very good for a rider to be fit to ride for one team but not another. If it was a Polish team and not Plymouth there would be absolute uproar!

[Arch Stanton]

9 minutes ago, Bagpuss said:

I don't think Aces fans are that bothered, they are going to qualify for the Play Offs at a canter anyway. Its more to do with integrity, you have to admit that it really doesn't look very good for a rider to be fit to ride for one team but not another. If it was a Polish team and not Plymouth there would be absolute uproar!

Sorry disagree. Plymouth and Ipswich are not one entity. One club is prepared to let an unfit rider ride, another isn’t. So you’re saying because Plymouth are prepared to let him ride through the pain barrier and ride whilst not 100% fit, then for the “integrity” Ipswich should do likewise? 
 

Nah not having that sorry. Ipswich are entitled to make their own private decision regardless of what Plymouth decide. They will have spoken to Crump at length no doubt about it. They’ll know more than any of us if he was going to do himself justice. They’ve decided against it. Their prerogative to do so. Bugger all to do with anyone else. Hardly cheating is it?

Oh and disagree about Belle Vue fans not being bothered either. They’ll want to top the table, no doubt about it. 

Edited July 8, 2021 by Arch Stanton

[Bagpuss]

I certainly wouldn't call it cheating, I never used that word. Ultimately it comes down to the governing body and their strength/weakness, if he's not fit enough to ride then he needs signing off for X number of days/weeks so that he can't ride anywhere, or if he is declared fit (I suspect he very much isn't) then he must crack on for both of his teams. As I said having him fit for one team and not the other looks awful and really shouldn't be allowed to happen.

[Arch Stanton]

7 minutes ago, Bagpuss said:

 then he must crack on for both of his teams. 

But that’s not his decision, and shouldn’t be his decision. He declared himself “fit” to ride against Wolves, and after the first bend, put his bike in reverse before pulling on to the centre green wincing in pain. 
 

So if Ipswich put him in tonight because “he was going to ride for Plymouth” and he does exactly the same, other than the Belle Vue fans on the back straight pi$$ing themselves laughing, what have Ipswich achieved by doing that? Another likely home defeat which in turn hurts their business. If they want to be cautious and make sure he’s 100% before they include him, good for them. If their intention is to pull a fast one by getting a guest in as was alluded to be Rob in his original post, then they’ll be doing that for the rest of the season and he’ll never return.  There’s been no inclination that that is going to happen to my knowledge. 
 

We won’t agree here, so we’ll agree to disagree and I’ll bow out on this particular subject. 
 

On the meeting itself, I can see it being another close one, could go either way. I’ll go for a draw. 

[ouch]

Aces fans absolutely do not want to see a half fit Crump limping round, we love him, he’s an Ace. 

We wanted to see the 2021 Crump ride with his 6.09 average but instead we have maximum man Masters on his 8.00 average.

 

“Are you ok to ride Jason, sure am I’m riding for Plymouth tonight. Is it ok if we leave you out as we can get a much better rider than you even if fully fit? Er ok, won’t that look bad. 

Don’t care!”

[dontforgetthefueltapsbruv]

1 hour ago, Bagpuss said:

I certainly wouldn't call it cheating, I never used that word. Ultimately it comes down to the governing body and their strength/weakness, if he's not fit enough to ride then he needs signing off for X number of days/weeks so that he can't ride anywhere, or if he is declared fit (I suspect he very much isn't) then he must crack on for both of his teams. As I said having him fit for one team and not the other looks awful and really shouldn't be allowed to happen.

100% - he rides for both or neither and it should be the SCB enficing that not the clubs choosing 

If Ipswich are providing a medical certificate then I don't see how he can be insured to ride for Plymouth inbetween missing Ipswich meetings

[Technik]

Jason Crump was named in the Plymouth line up for their match at Glasgow 0n the 2nd of July.

The important fact is that meeting never took place so other than his all to early come back at Ipswich he has not ridden for any club in British speedway. It is my opinion that we return to his initial medical certificate from the incident at Wolves on May 31st.

Maybe Crump/Ipswich should provide an updated certificate but we all know he broke 8 ribs & was very knocked about. We all know that injured speedway riders bravery/stupidity levels are questionable & we have seen riders carried to their bikes in championship events Collins, Carter & Tatum to name just 3 but this is British league & as much as it's our life blood it is not for a world championship.

[Charlieboy]

2 hours ago, ouch said:

Aces fans absolutely do not want to see a half fit Crump limping round, we love him, he’s an Ace. 

We wanted to see the 2021 Crump ride with his 6.09 average but instead we have maximum man Masters on his 8.00 average.

 

“Are you ok to ride Jason, sure am I’m riding for Plymouth tonight. Is it ok if we leave you out as we can get a much better rider than you even if fully fit? Er ok, won’t that look bad. 

Don’t care!”

So what your saying is Masters average is 2 points more than Jason crump and it’s ok for Ipswich to have a guest with an higher average ? Yet only last week the Ipswich fans were in uproar when we had guests for Josh Bates. Something doesn’t seem right there does it ? No wonder fans arnt bothering to turn up nowadays then. 

[mikebv]

Similar to the situation last week with Anders Rowe riding for Sheffield..

Why he was there last week was "debatable", but there was no debate that his presence would improve the spectacle of the meeting, and so it proved..

Tonight Sam Masters will hopefully add to the entertainment value for all those in attendance.. 

Integrity had been mentioned but let's be honest, UK Speedway is "flexible" at best when it comes to running their meetings under that umbrella..

As had been said, if Crumpy was riding overseas and giving the UK a miss at the same time, then there would be questions asked about how this could be allowed to happen, however, given it "doesn't really matter who wins" over here, just let him ride for Plymouth, get fit, and in the interim replace him with a "currently better" rider..

I am sure many there tonight will be pleased just to see close exciting racing with the result being whatever it will be...

[Charlieboy]

39 minutes ago, mikebv said:

Similar to the situation last week with Anders Rowe riding for Sheffield..

Why he was there last week was "debatable", but there was no debate that his presence would improve the spectacle of the meeting, and so it proved..

Tonight Sam Masters will hopefully add to the entertainment value for all those in attendance.. 

Integrity had been mentioned but let's be honest, UK Speedway is "flexible" at best when it comes to running their meetings under that umbrella..

As had been said, if Crumpy was riding overseas and giving the UK a miss at the same time, then there would be questions asked about how this could be allowed to happen, however, given it "doesn't really matter who wins" over here, just let him ride for Plymouth, get fit, and in the interim replace him with a "currently better" rider..

I am sure many there tonight will be pleased just to see close exciting racing with the result being whatever it will be...

Exactly but at the end of the day we needed a guest and took him from the list   We could have had someone else and had same result   Who knows ? It’s a chance you take and it’s the same for every team needing a guest.