Points limits in the old days

[AndyO]

Just been looking at some old Canterbury programmes from 1968 and whilst I attended the meetings, as a ten year old i didn't pay too much attention to the rules regarding team strengths (if there were any?) It seemed that the Crusaders could bring in new riders as and when they wanted regardless of how good they were .. also the best riders could be riding at number 1 and then number 2 followed by being at reserve all in the space of a few weeks? Can anyone enlighten me as to any rules regarding team building in place in the new second division in 1968?

Cheers

[Chadster]

There were no points limits in those days. 2nd division teams could bring in new riders when they wanted, as Canterbury did when they brought in Wimbledon no. 8, Peter Murray, who helped them win the KO Cup. Although it was supposedly frowned on, Reading brought in Vic White from first division Leicester and Berwick Bill McMillan from Glasgow. Mike Cake and Mick Handley doubled up for their first and second division teams more or ess throughout the season. The following season did see controversy when Romford signed Des Lukehurst from Hackney as iy was argued that he was too good to step down.

As for team positions, they seem to have been decided by an average of scores over the previous 6 meetings so a couple of poor meetings could see riders change position and even drop down into the reserve position. I don't think there were hard and fast rules about heatleaders having to ride in positions 1, 3 and 5. I remember seeing Ivan Mauger line up for Newcastle at number 6 the previous season.

[lucifer sam]

No 6 wasn't a reserve position until 1969.  There was only one reserve - at No 7.

[ch958]

interesting this, I have tried to find out. There were no conversion averages obviously, old hands were restricted by gentleman's agreement. Riders were plentiful despite the warnings. When Teesside lost Greame Edmonds, Allan Brown turned up from Kings Lynn 2nd halves and became no1.

If you consult Speedway Researcher and look at the results for 1967, 1966, lots of names crop up as reserves for BL1 teams who subsequently rode Div2. Of course BV with their training school had loads of decent riders who couldn't get into the first team and they could reasonably have used Chris Pusey. Other teams were 'sister' tracks. Teesside's was Leicester and we benefiited from that with Plant, Leadbitter, Reading, etc.

In 68, no 7s had 2 rides only programmed. 

I loved those days, watching the progress of some of the young talent was great.

Edited May 14, 2021 by ch958

[AndyO]

Thanks everyone, as you say really interesting...

 

[Chadster]

7 hours ago, lucifer sam said:

No 6 wasn't a reserve position until 1969.  There was only one reserve - at No 7.

True, but the point I was making was that heat leaders didn't have to ride in positions 1, 3 and 5.

[Chadster]

7 hours ago, ch958 said:

interesting this, I have tried to find out. There were no conversion averages obviously, old hands were restricted by gentleman's agreement. Riders were plentiful despite the warnings. When Teesside lost Greame Edmonds, Allan Brown turned up from Kings Lynn 2nd halves and became no1.

If you consult Speedway Researcher and look at the results for 1967, 1966, lots of names crop up as reserves for BL1 teams who subsequently rode Div2. Of course BV with their training school had loads of decent riders who couldn't get into the first team and they could reasonably have used Chris Pusey. Other teams were 'sister' tracks. Teesside's was Leicester and we benefiited from that with Plant, Leadbitter, Reading, etc.

In 68, no 7s had 2 rides only programmed. 

I loved those days, watching the progress of some of the young talent was great.

Belle Vue did want to use Chris Pusey in the Colts but were denied the chance to do so. I guess it was because he was also in the Aces side and blatant doubling up was frowned on. It certainly couldn't be that he was too experienced as he'd only had a few meetings for the Aces in 1967.

[brianbuck]

Going some way further back (to the 1940's and early 1950's) any rider who had scored less that 50% of possible points over the previous six matches could be named as reserve, and most clubs used that rule to best advantage, especially for away matches. There was never any kind of restriction on how the top six of a team could be listed, so there was consequently, a lot more scope for the more astute team managers in those days. 

[AndyO]

16 hours ago, brianbuck said:

Going some way further back (to the 1940's and early 1950's) any rider who had scored less that 50% of possible points over the previous six matches could be named as reserve, and most clubs used that rule to best advantage, especially for away matches. There was never any kind of restriction on how the top six of a team could be listed, so there was consequently, a lot more scope for the more astute team managers in those days. 

Well as everyone is saying that the main priority for this season is to just get speedway going again, and who wins is probably less important than ever before, it would be interesting if this arrangement was tried in a few meetings, and while we are at it also go back to 13 heats with a second half... and also nudging the tapes allowed!!

[steve roberts]

On 5/16/2021 at 12:39 PM, AndyO said:

Well as everyone is saying that the main priority for this season is to just get speedway going again, and who wins is probably less important than ever before, it would be interesting if this arrangement was tried in a few meetings, and while we are at it also go back to 13 heats with a second half... and also nudging the tapes allowed!!

...I'll second that!