enotian Posted March 27, 2021 Report Share Posted March 27, 2021 With there having been a season hiatus I was thinking about which riders might make a massive improvement in average in 2021. Then got wondering about historically which rider has improved their starting average by the most by the end of the season. [excluding assessed starting averages] I recall Mark Thorpe almost doubling his average in c1991. He'd had two average seasons in admittedly average Diamonds teams, averaging about five and had even been dropped for one match iirc. By all accounts he was only handed a team place in 1991 because his average fit. Starting at reserve with Scott Lamb, I think, he was lightening out of the starts and never looked back, ending the season close to a ten average. Anyone else turned from reserve to #1 in the course of a season? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve roberts Posted March 28, 2021 Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 7 hours ago, enotian said: With there having been a season hiatus I was thinking about which riders might make a massive improvement in average in 2021. Then got wondering about historically which rider has improved their starting average by the most by the end of the season. [excluding assessed starting averages] I recall Mark Thorpe almost doubling his average in c1991. He'd had two average seasons in admittedly average Diamonds teams, averaging about five and had even been dropped for one match iirc. By all accounts he was only handed a team place in 1991 because his average fit. Starting at reserve with Scott Lamb, I think, he was lightening out of the starts and never looked back, ending the season close to a ten average. Anyone else turned from reserve to #1 in the course of a season? Wayne Brown averaged 3.94 in 1978 increasing his average to 9.00 in 1979 although Steve McDermott pipped him at Number One with an average of 9.12 however injury cut McDermott's season short and he rode in only a handful of matches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.D Posted March 28, 2021 Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 A 16 year old Martin Dugard went from 5.69 up to 9.75 in 1986 winning a league and cup double in the process. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagpuss Posted March 28, 2021 Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 Darcy Ward in 2009. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skydog Posted March 28, 2021 Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 Todd Wiltshire in 1990 must be up there, started on 5.5 and finished over 8.7 and World no.3... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E I Addio Posted March 28, 2021 Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 9 hours ago, enotian said: With there having been a season hiatus I was thinking about which riders might make a massive improvement in average in 2021. Then got wondering about historically which rider has improved their starting average by the most by the end of the season. [excluding assessed starting averages] I recall Mark Thorpe almost doubling his average in c1991. He'd had two average seasons in admittedly average Diamonds teams, averaging about five and had even been dropped for one match iirc. By all accounts he was only handed a team place in 1991 because his average fit. Starting at reserve with Scott Lamb, I think, he was lightening out of the starts and never looked back, ending the season close to a ten average. Anyone else turned from reserve to #1 in the course of a season? I don’t have the figures in front of me but I think Rob Mear went from reserve to No1 at Rye House in the course of a season. No doubt someone will correct me if I’m wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enotian Posted March 28, 2021 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 2 hours ago, steve roberts said: Wayne Brown averaged 3.94 in 1978 increasing his average to 9.00 in 1979 although Steve McDermott pipped him at Number One with an average of 9.12 however injury cut McDermott's season short and he rode in only a handful of matches. Wow, they must have really watered own the product in 1978!! Couldn't resist. That's some improvement. He'd had a few seasons as a three pointer hadn't he before the sudden improvement? Was he an Australian? Although I think my first ever meeting was around that time its just a little bit before I started to take interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve roberts Posted March 28, 2021 Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 5 minutes ago, enotian said: Wow, they must have really watered own the product in 1978!! Couldn't resist. That's some improvement. He'd had a few seasons as a three pointer hadn't he before the sudden improvement? Was he an Australian? Although I think my first ever meeting was around that time its just a little bit before I started to take interest. If I recall he had a few mediocre seasons prior to 1979. He was a Kiwi who eventually moved to Sheffield in the British League but was tragically killed in an industrial accident. Steve Boxall (Rye House) another potential candidate? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enotian Posted March 28, 2021 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 1 hour ago, M.D said: A 16 year old Martin Dugard went from 5.69 up to 9.75 in 1986 winning a league and cup double in the process. ah yes I recall Dugard, Havelock and Silver emerging at the same time. He was on a steep upward curve. World Finalist by 1990!!! 58 minutes ago, Bagpuss said: Darcy Ward in 2009. 2nd season?? Remember seeing him at Brough in his first season. Scary but quick. Was always going to be a massive talent. 45 minutes ago, skydog said: Todd Wiltshire in 1990 must be up there, started on 5.5 and finished over 8.7 and World no.3... yes. What about that group of Aussies. Wiltshire, Adams and Boyce all around the same time after a lean spell. All massive talents 33 minutes ago, E I Addio said: I don’t have the figures in front of me but I think Rob Mear went from reserve to No1 at Rye House in the course of a season. No doubt someone will correct me if I’m wrong. For some reason I don't ever recall seeing Mear ride live. Was he mostly top flight at Essex? Didn't he attempt a comeback at one point? Could he have gone on to have been international class? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve roberts Posted March 28, 2021 Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 5 minutes ago, enotian said: ah yes I recall Dugard, Havelock and Silver emerging at the same time. He was on a steep upward curve. World Finalist by 1990!!! 2nd season?? Remember seeing him at Brough in his first season. Scary but quick. Was always going to be a massive talent. yes. What about that group of Aussies. Wiltshire, Adams and Boyce all around the same time after a lean spell. All massive talents For some reason I don't ever recall seeing Mear ride live. Was he mostly top flight at Essex? Didn't he attempt a comeback at one point? Could he have gone on to have been international class? If I recall the three Aussies were all allocated very low assessed averages when they started their British careers? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enotian Posted March 28, 2021 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 7 minutes ago, steve roberts said: If I recall he had a few mediocre seasons prior to 1979. He was a Kiwi who eventually moved to Sheffield in the British League but was tragically killed in an industrial accident. Steve Boxall (Rye House) another potential candidate? I was aware that he'd lost his life but was never sure if it was speedway related. I remember seeing Boxall against the Gems and he looked like a huge talent. I think he ended up signing for the Diamonds as #1 which I think is where it all started to go wrong. Plenty of example around that time of talented kids who didn't get any guidance or have the resources to progress. Let's hope there's some assistance for the current crop. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enotian Posted March 28, 2021 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 2 minutes ago, steve roberts said: If I recall the three Aussies were all allocated very low assessed averages when they started their British careers? yes two pointers I guess. Then ending the season as eight pointers. That Poole era in the 2nd division was a convey belt for Australasians. plenty of examples of two point Aussies in the Diamonds ranks during the National League era. No need to develop local talent back then. Plenty went from assessed two to second string in their first season then heat leader in their third. Hunter and Bargh (and others) were just before my time and missed out on seeing Shane Bowes progress when the Diamonds closed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shippy22 Posted March 28, 2021 Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 Dean Standing increased his average from 1.21 in 1985 to 7.06 in 1986. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E I Addio Posted March 28, 2021 Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 30 minutes ago, enotian said: For some reason I don't ever recall seeing Mear ride live. Was he mostly top flight at Essex? Didn't he attempt a comeback at one point? Could he have gone on to have been international class? Its difficult to tell how far a rider can go. Rob was a useful reserve at Lakeside butfor some reason suffered a loss of form / confidence so gave speedway a miss for a while, and concentrated on continental grass tracks. Jon Cook then got him back to Lakeside as a British 3-pointer which seemed to be a steal because his average was down due to previous loss of form. However the comeback never really worked, he never really got back in the groove and retired for good. I think he could have dropped down to the lower league and done ok but last time I spoke to him he was doing happy enough doing continental grass tracks and apparently making it pay so had no real desire to return to speedway. The thing is Rob was never a full time speedway rider and always had another job laying gas pipes or something and its always hard to combine two jobs and still do well. I suppose on grass tracks he can do his day job then focus on his racing at weekends. If he was full time speedway I guess he could have been a useful top league second string or lower league heatleader but I wouldn't have thought international class, but who knows. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enotian Posted March 28, 2021 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 12 minutes ago, shippy22 said: Dean Standing increased his average from 1.21 in 1985 to 7.06 in 1986. if I recall staying at reserve all season despite averaging seven in that amazing Eagles team. Probably only getting three rides per meeting in the old thirteen heat format. The start of a great conveyor belt. Dugard, Standing, Barker, Norris. I think Dean went to Ipswich but can't recall if he ever made an impact in the top flight. I recall Darren Standing going straight through the first bend at Brough just as he was starting to progress with Stoke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve roberts Posted March 28, 2021 Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 6 minutes ago, enotian said: if I recall staying at reserve all season despite averaging seven in that amazing Eagles team. Probably only getting three rides per meeting in the old thirteen heat format. The start of a great conveyor belt. Dugard, Standing, Barker, Norris. I think Dean went to Ipswich but can't recall if he ever made an impact in the top flight. I recall Darren Standing going straight through the first bend at Brough just as he was starting to progress with Stoke. I saw a lot of Eastbourne during the seventies (when they were Oxford's 'sister' team) and early eighties and the English talent that came thru' Arlington was second to none in my opinion. It must have irked Bob Dugard when foreigners began to prolificate the scene and hence the situation that now exists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagpuss Posted March 28, 2021 Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, enotian said: 2nd season?? Remember seeing him at Brough in his first season. Scary but quick. Was always going to be a massive talent. He did a few meetings at the tail end if 2008 in the NL and some individuals presumably when he turned 16 but his first full season was for Lynn in 2009 when he roughly doubled his average from 5 to 10. Edited March 28, 2021 by Bagpuss 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enotian Posted March 28, 2021 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 1 minute ago, steve roberts said: I saw a lot of Eastbourne during the seventies (when they were Oxford's 'sister' team) and early eighties and the English talent that came thru' Arlington was second to none in my opinion. It must have irked Bob Dugard when foreigners began to prolificate the scene and hence the situation that now exists. I think there has to be a correlation. Wasn't it around that time, mid 80's, when there was controversy about allowing British riders to drop down into the National League? That's drop down not double down! So the likes of Gordon Kennett, Dave Jessup and Les Collins could all join NL teams despite having been world finalists (podiums) not much earlier. Imagine that. Going off thread, but it's why I've always said foreign riders should never drop below their assessed average for team building. And that assessed average shouldn't ever be as low as four as it is now. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enotian Posted March 28, 2021 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 3 minutes ago, Bagpuss said: He did a few meetings at the tail end if 2008 in the NL and sone individuals presumably when he turned 16 but his first full season was for Lynn in 2009 when he roughly doubled his average from 5 to 10. Assessed five??? That's just a technical improvement He was probably a ten the first time he got on a bike, such a natural talent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagpuss Posted March 28, 2021 Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 2 minutes ago, enotian said: Assessed five??? That's just a technical improvement He was probably a ten the first time he got on a bike, such a natural talent. I think it’s no coincidence that we did the treble that year 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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