Flemming Graversen and GM dispute

[racers and royals]

Google translation of Speedweek article.

What is the difference between a GM and an FGM? That is the question. The Italian plant GM claims that the Dane Flemming Graversen copied their Speedway engine.
Flemming Graversen is a sought-after tuner in the Speedway GP scene. The Dane from Varde on the west coast of Jutland in southwest Denmark had his greatest success with Australian Jason Doyle in 2017 when he became Speedway World Champion in Melbourne. With the cylinder head developed by Graversen on a GM engine.

In the meantime, Graversen has developed its own motor with the FGM, which recently openly aroused the discontent of the Italian manufacturer and thus competitor GM (Giuseppe Marzotto). At the end of last year, GM wrote a letter to all tuners and drivers in the Speedway GP series, demanding that their cooperation with Flemming Graversen be terminated. It is alleged that the Dane illegally copied their technology and then made perfect copies of their GM engines themselves.

GM representatives complained about unfair practices on the part of Graversen and postulated a 100 percent reproduction of their product without their consent. According to their account, the Italians had acquired one of the engines that Flemming Graversen had built from scratch and subjected it to a thorough examination in their factory.

In their opinion, the FGM is a complete copy of your own GM. As supposed evidence, they posted photos of parts of the GM and FGM for comparison. According to the Italians, there was only one difference between the two engines, namely the lack of embossed symbols of the GM brand.

"Our patience is over," said Vittorio Emanuele Marzotto in a Polish sports magazine. In addition, it was made clear to the GP pilots that if they continued to work with Graversen they would never get original parts from GM again.

SPEEDWEEK.com has asked Flemming Graversen to comment on these allegations. However, he has not yet replied.

 

[foamfence]

I thought FGM involved rusty razor blades and a good deal of screaming.

[dontforgetthefueltapsbruv]

I may be naive given I have almost zero mechanical knowledge but is there any great difference between any basic speedway engine if you take the brand stamps off?

[topaz325]

1 hour ago, foamfence said:

I thought FGM involved rusty razor blades and a good deal of screaming.

Not good

[dontforgetthefueltapsbruv]

1 hour ago, foamfence said:

I thought FGM involved rusty razor blades and a good deal of screaming.

 

1 minute ago, topaz325 said:

Not good

Humour has always been fair game as a way to deal with even the darkest of subjects

The 'world' is currently trying to suppress that right for even the most innocent of situations let alone the more serious such as this one. Now that is certainly 'not good' or healthy

[Daniel Smith]

3 hours ago, racers and royals said:

Google translation of Speedweek article.

What is the difference between a GM and an FGM? That is the question. The Italian plant GM claims that the Dane Flemming Graversen copied their Speedway engine.
Flemming Graversen is a sought-after tuner in the Speedway GP scene. The Dane from Varde on the west coast of Jutland in southwest Denmark had his greatest success with Australian Jason Doyle in 2017 when he became Speedway World Champion in Melbourne. With the cylinder head developed by Graversen on a GM engine.

In the meantime, Graversen has developed its own motor with the FGM, which recently openly aroused the discontent of the Italian manufacturer and thus competitor GM (Giuseppe Marzotto). At the end of last year, GM wrote a letter to all tuners and drivers in the Speedway GP series, demanding that their cooperation with Flemming Graversen be terminated. It is alleged that the Dane illegally copied their technology and then made perfect copies of their GM engines themselves.

GM representatives complained about unfair practices on the part of Graversen and postulated a 100 percent reproduction of their product without their consent. According to their account, the Italians had acquired one of the engines that Flemming Graversen had built from scratch and subjected it to a thorough examination in their factory.

In their opinion, the FGM is a complete copy of your own GM. As supposed evidence, they posted photos of parts of the GM and FGM for comparison. According to the Italians, there was only one difference between the two engines, namely the lack of embossed symbols of the GM brand.

"Our patience is over," said Vittorio Emanuele Marzotto in a Polish sports magazine. In addition, it was made clear to the GP pilots that if they continued to work with Graversen they would never get original parts from GM again.

SPEEDWEEK.com has asked Flemming Graversen to comment on these allegations. However, he has not yet replied.

 

If the FGM is absolutely identical to a GM, it's a bit of a stupid threat to not sell GM parts to rider's isn't it? They'd just buy FGM parts instead 

I'd say it's an empty threat as they can't afford a court case. 

[PHILIPRISING]

ASKED Kelvin Tatum ... his reply

Proper fight going on between the two. Gravesen fell out with GM several seasons ago. GM guilty of not developing the engine enough. Gravesen lost patience. Has produced his own engine. Be interesting to see how it plays out. 

[iris123]

16 minutes ago, PHILIPRISING said:

ASKED Kelvin Tatum ... his reply

Proper fight going on between the two. Gravesen fell out with GM several seasons ago. GM guilty of not developing the engine enough. Gravesen lost patience. Has produced his own engine. Be interesting to see how it plays out. 

If it is an exact copy, how has he developed it further then ?

[screm]

If Gravesen has taken a GM engine, then enhanced it its still basically a GM engine so GM have every right to be unhappy. If as Kelvin Tatum suggests Gravesen has produced his own engine then I`m not to sure GM have much to complain about.

[PHILIPRISING]

1 hour ago, iris123 said:

If it is an exact copy, how has he developed it further then ?

PROBABLY that the basic engine is a copy ... all tuners have their own ideas about what they do with that.

[Technik]

I think for the first time in many years the Italian GM has a real threat to it's power unit. After seeing off Weslake Godden Jawa & GRM in recent years GM has had a monopoly over the engines used in most track racing disciplines.

Flemming Graversen has as mentioned previously grown frustrated that GM have largely rested on their laurels & made little attempt to progress with any development programme. He has taken the GM motor & made many improvments to the internals. I believe it is still in essence a GM motor but because of the wholesale changes he has rebranded it FGM.

We have seen many tuners put their brand onto a unit they have worked on but it would still carry the GM logo.

[HGould]

Don't see the problem, in terms of engineering isn't this what Japanese, Chinese; Koreans and others have done for decades.

Take a Car / Engine / Engineering over to their people, strip it down, re-component and re-build pretty much identically.

GM seems to have become complacent.

 

 

 

 

[tyretrax]

4 hours ago, HGould said:

Don't see the problem, in terms of engineering isn't this what Japanese, Chinese; Koreans and others have done for decades.

Take a Car / Engine / Engineering over to their people, strip it down, re-component and re-build pretty much identically.

GM seems to have become complacent.

 

 

 

 

That was my thought, how could you make an internal combustion different?

[ONTWOMINUTES]

From pictures I've seen , fgm are using the gm bottom end ( from the barrel down ) and have engineered a completely new type of cylinder head . 

[racers and royals]

9 minutes ago, ONTWOMINUTES said:

From pictures I've seen , fgm are using the gm bottom end ( from the barrel down ) and have engineered a completely new type of cylinder head . 

Probably  they have copied the GM bottom end nearly exactly- as they are unlikely to be able to source GM bottom ends.

[ONTWOMINUTES]

Google , fgm engine images and you'll see. 

[Grand Central]

If GM had a winnable case that they would not be sending out pointless letters or issuing unenforceable threats.

Pretty pathetic.

[Humphrey Appleby]

On 3/13/2021 at 11:50 AM, racers and royals said:

Google translation of Speedweek article.

What is the difference between a GM and an FGM? That is the question. The Italian plant GM claims that the Dane Flemming Graversen copied their Speedway engine.
Flemming Graversen is a sought-after tuner in the Speedway GP scene. The Dane from Varde on the west coast of Jutland in southwest Denmark had his greatest success with Australian Jason Doyle in 2017 when he became Speedway World Champion in Melbourne. With the cylinder head developed by Graversen on a GM engine.

In the meantime, Graversen has developed its own motor with the FGM, which recently openly aroused the discontent of the Italian manufacturer and thus competitor GM (Giuseppe Marzotto). At the end of last year, GM wrote a letter to all tuners and drivers in the Speedway GP series, demanding that their cooperation with Flemming Graversen be terminated. It is alleged that the Dane illegally copied their technology and then made perfect copies of their GM engines themselves.

GM representatives complained about unfair practices on the part of Graversen and postulated a 100 percent reproduction of their product without their consent. According to their account, the Italians had acquired one of the engines that Flemming Graversen had built from scratch and subjected it to a thorough examination in their factory.

In their opinion, the FGM is a complete copy of your own GM. As supposed evidence, they posted photos of parts of the GM and FGM for comparison. According to the Italians, there was only one difference between the two engines, namely the lack of embossed symbols of the GM brand.

"Our patience is over," said Vittorio Emanuele Marzotto in a Polish sports magazine. In addition, it was made clear to the GP pilots that if they continued to work with Graversen they would never get original parts from GM again.

SPEEDWEEK.com has asked Flemming Graversen to comment on these allegations. However, he has not yet replied.

 

From the article, they don’t seem to be threatening legal action, and only issuing empty threats. So presumably the GM design is no longer patented (or never was) or the FGM one is sufficiently different.

[hrhbig]

On 3/14/2021 at 10:23 PM, ONTWOMINUTES said:

Google , fgm engine images and you'll see. 

tried that , am not interested in female genital mutilation !!!!!

[uk_martin]

On 3/15/2021 at 10:30 AM, Grand Central said:

If GM had a winnable case that they would not be sending out pointless letters or issuing unenforceable threats.

Pretty pathetic.

Exactly this. If there is a patent infringement, let the patent lawyers sort it out. If there is no patent on the GM designs and products, then more fool GM. OK so patents cost money, but if you don't have one you can be copied. Look at the computer mouse...nobody bothered patenting these, and now anyone can produce them. The price you pay for not paying the price.