Whats actually going on?

[Great Central]

3 hours ago, old bob at herne bay said:

Sorry " Ringitsneck", but history has shown that UK speedway administrators have repeatedly failed to change the sport to attract and entertain new spectators to the sport, failed to attract new investment into the sport and failed to provide a fair, transparent and democratic leadership structure.  Any attempts of new ideas brought in by "others" have  always been debunked. They are still marketing the same old 15 heat  4 laps a race clutch start  7 man team format for every meeting , all riders messing around endlessly before every heat. TIRED is one word that sums up the entertainment offer. 

They have sensibly made their group a Limited company, in anticipation of the day when they have to wind up.

You would have thought that the admin. would bend over backwards to ensure as many clubs line up to tapes every season ...... but we see a steady loss of venues and the remaining "clique"  of promoters just shrug their shoulders.  Will the Premier League complete the 2021 season ? We started with only 6 and might only have 5. 

 The lack of action on the top table to promote and market the sport in the UK is reprehensible. 

Speedway will survive IMO, but run by a disparate group of  promoters who will rent a venue on an occasional basis for individual invitation meetings, with token prize money offered (just like UK grasstrack).  This perhaps is not dissimilar to the ideas of the IoW promotion ....  but this is where the sport is heading, and what the public will pay to watch in numbers.

People want an afternoon/evening out, to be entertained, with plenty of track action, and not be be subjected to 15 drawn out heats of tyre warming , 2 minute warnings, separated every 3/4 heats by tractor racing.

 

 

Extremely well put and the first of the Objects for which BSPA is established is to "protect and represent the lawful interests of the Members" This is not me making it up but is from the Articles of Association produced when the BSPL was formed. You could say that they aren't doing a very good job but like us they have been battling with Covid keeping their own businesses going,  as well as trying to run the BSPL.

 This may come as a bit of a surprise but I do have some sympathy for the "Top Table", because trying to plan your way out of Covid restrictions has been difficult but in my view there was no better time to shake the tree and come up with something new. Barry came up with an idea to liven up the 2020 NT competition but it was rejected as being too difficult or something like that. We have ideas on how to change the look of speedway as we are also very conscious of the criticism of the "same old same old with tractor racing" and I think with our team challenges, Best Pairs, 3TT, Handicaps etc we were doing a pretty good job. Yes we sometimes did have problems with our track but we normally filled the interludes with news, interviews or action for the kids.

Nothing works 100% of the time but if you don't try, nothing will change.

Martin Widman

[barrybishop]

11 hours ago, Great Central said:

Extremely well put and the first of the Objects for which BSPA is established is to "protect and represent the lawful interests of the Members" This is not me making it up but is from the Articles of Association produced when the BSPL was formed. You could say that they aren't doing a very good job but like us they have been battling with Covid keeping their own businesses going,  as well as trying to run the BSPL.

 This may come as a bit of a surprise but I do have some sympathy for the "Top Table", because trying to plan your way out of Covid restrictions has been difficult but in my view there was no better time to shake the tree and come up with something new. Barry came up with an idea to liven up the 2020 NT competition but it was rejected as being too difficult or something like that. We have ideas on how to change the look of speedway as we are also very conscious of the criticism of the "same old same old with tractor racing" and I think with our team challenges, Best Pairs, 3TT, Handicaps etc we were doing a pretty good job. Yes we sometimes did have problems with our track but we normally filled the interludes with news, interviews or action for the kids.

Nothing works 100% of the time but if you don't try, nothing will change.

Martin Widman

Yes this is correct.... we wanted to introduce to the 2020 NT 2 new innovative rules.

1. The team manager of each side could choose two heats in which to select 1 rider from the oposing team to put on 15m in two heats which may not include heats 1, 2, 3, 4, 8, 13, 14 and 15 and it cannot include a previous heat selected for 15m handicap. The away team manager would chose the first heat, home TM 2nd, away 3rd and home 4th heats. A brilliant yet simple rule to inject more action to the racing and a rule which is already used (tapes rules) so confirmed as OK for safety and every UK track. This for sure will feature in our meetings this year should we find ourselves in a position to actually race. 

2. When 6 points behind the team manager can choose gate positions. Again a simple rule that could have a great affect on the match. 

Note - during the AGM it was AGREED to introduce both these rules by the NL only for it to then be stopped at a later date saying no clear rule could be written. !!!!!! Or was it a fear that this was the NL once again leading the way forward

However, even with these great enhancements to the show, along with all the other ideas we will implement, I also refer to Poland. They use the same thing (all be it with different rider positions) but 4 bikes, 4 laps, 15 heats. The greatest part of going to speedway in Poland is 100% the atmosphere - the crowds 100% back their team, chanting, applaudings, scalves, massively sponsored, rider interaction with fans and what does this all equate to....... a show, theatre, drama....... all what is missing in British Speedway save for the play offs.  Perhaps controversially, the Polish squad system works well in my view too, forcing rider to ride to the best of their ability or be dropped as opposed to virtually guaranteed a team spot regardless of performance due to lack of riders. I am not saying our riders do not really put their best efforts in, they do, but there is not consequences for behaviour, or poor performance. 

Finally another huge difference is ethos.... In poland is club, club, club - one for all and all for one... yet in UK is about the rider who rides for a club... If a team makes a change (which none take lightly and for Martin and I we would do anything to avoid it because of the fan / rider relationship) the club get totally hammered online and the rider complete sympathy - but I can assure you there have been occassion when riders behaviour would disgust you all but to protect the club and to a degree the rider it is hushed up and the club in general takes the negative PR on the chin. Then sponsorship... in Poland it the club and brand where most sponsorship is directed where as UK its, in general, rider related. Even when clubs get sponsors, riders do their very best to get in there with them which in turn reduces the club sponsorship money available. As a club that relies heavily on our brand and sponsorship this is something that really hurts us both in the bank account and credibilty when it goes pearshaped.

We did introduce something else at that AGM too, we asked to have a promoters end of season dinner (yes that is right little old IOW) to celebrate all the great in speedway much like the WSRA dinners. Of course it was immediately shot down until we offered to organise it, Mark Lemon seconded it.... then the BSPL agreed to stage and organise the dinner and it was a HUGE success.

Anyways... Now I am off to study Mr. Godfrey's statement in the speedway star and I am sure we will be responding with some clarity #truths

As I always write support your club they need you. These are troubled times and stay positive / constructive and we will all come through this.

Stay safe and all the best,

 

Edited June 11, 2021 by barrybishop
update

[*JJ]

One problem with British speedway is that it is NOT organised as clubs, as in Poland. I was once told by a promoter - and this is when it was in the National League - that "*** Speedway is a commercial organisation ... it does not do training". Which, of course, explains the attitude of most promoters, who comprise the membership of the BSPL.

[barrybishop]

Sorry this is a long one everyone, but the big chief Martin and I had to respond to Mr. Godfrey from this week's speedway star. I hope you will read it thoroughly and make up your own mind as to what is going on.....

All the best

Barry (and Martin)

I have read with interest the statement by the BSPL’s Chairman Rob Godfrey in this week’s Speedway Star, which to me reads as an attack on me as opposed to any constructive debate about why the Warriors left the BSPL. From how I read it, it seems that Mr. Godfrey wants you the reader to think I made all these decisions, that I threw the rattle out of the cot because I didn’t get my own way.  Martin and I find this personalisation of myself very surprising, hurtful, and factually wrong and very disrespectful to Martin and me. 

Firstly, every decision, including this response, with regards to the Wightlink Warriors is jointly taken by Martin and me. Not once has a single decision been made without the approval of the other. This is because, put very simply, we are a team and have been since we embarked on bringing speedway back to the Isle of Wight: equal investors who live and die by our joint decisions. It is the only way we want to work and can work.

Secondly, it is the case that, except for one or two email requests for the date on the NL AGM sent by me when Martin was ill, that every single piece of correspondence between the BSPL Office and the Warriors was sent by Martin. Of course, we had worked on every email together and reached every decision together, but each email was sent by Martin and in many cases replied directly to Martin and omitting me, and in some cases using a personal email address which is hardly used.

Now to the contents, Mr. Godfrey states that it was a directive of every club to make these changes. Our response to this is.

1.      We have an email from the BSPL stating these were a Board decision and the email was sent the day following a Board meeting.

2.      If every promoter stated it, please prove it. We already know this is not the case from our discussions with promoters but of course they could have been giving us sympathetic flannel, but we think not.

3.      If it was the case – let’s say the statement is true. Does anyone truly believe that it is right for clubs who have no interest in the league or our business to state how the National League should be run, or that clubs who do have an interest in the National League should be allowed to contribute to decisions made when 2 clubs (Mildenhall and IOW) could not. Any club intending to participate in the National League should not have been permitted to participate in any rule making whatsoever unless they were part of the 2019 NL, as is the usual way during the NL AGM.

4.      Why didn’t Mr. Len Silver attend or be invited to attend any of these meetings as the NL representative to relay information to standalone clubs?

Note - Clause 3 of the Articles of Constitution states the BSPL was established to protect all its members. Clearly only some.

Mr. Godfrey says that we had fair warning of the NL “returning to its roots” which is a true – he did say the National League will “return to its roots” during the AGM, but just what does this statement actually mean? Does it mean the BSPL can impose rules upon the league members? Does it mean the BSPL can choose which clubs have an input to the rules it makes? No, it doesn’t. It actually means as he said during that meeting it was seen as a way to “reduce costs of riders moving up to the Championship” (which by the way we have never disagreed with, clubs must cut their cloth accordingly in our view.).  And to make the league more amateur than it already was.

There was an addition to that statement about returning the sport to its roots, and that was that all standalone clubs would be invited to attend a Pre or Final Championship AGM to see if it was possible to step up to the Championship – that invitation was never received by us or to the best of our knowledge, by the other then standalone clubs.

In the article Mr. Godfrey continues, the BSPL fully support that Isle of Wight run amateur meetings and this is true, here is a paragraph of the email.

“The BSP fully support you running amateur and practice events with Nora 92.  However, if you intend to expand your events outside of the amateur status the BSP will be forced to instruct BSP Registered Riders that they will not be permitted to participate.”

What the BSPL omitted to tell us in the email was that even though the National League was always referred to as amateur, always development (how they love this word) the BSPL view the National League riders as professional riders, yet we know by any definition of the word “professional”, they are not so and do not receive all the benefits other league's riders have as part of their contracts – for example different insurance cover.  So, how does this statement now affect the Isle of Wight? It means that any rider who has a contract in the BSPL would be instructed that they cannot participate in Isle of Wight meetings, and if they do they risk sanctions – as many clubs have told the riders we have approached to ride.

Mr Godfrey quotes Rule 6 of SCB regulations which actually have no bearing over non SCB events (ie the Isle of Wight) so participating on the Isle of Wight is like doing road racing, grass track, trials, banger racing and other motorsport. We are outside of the SCB and therefore no sanctions can be applied against the riders or officials for taking part and the BSPL know this but in the current circumstances we can understand the rider's apprehension about taking part.

He goes on to say I (we) left at my (our) our own request – again this is true, but he omits to say why. The fact is, we asked if in future years the BSPL Board continue to impose rules without a voting system on clubs and the response from the BSPL Office Administrator was “this could not be guaranteed” or even no, direct reply at all. Had we received this statement to say AGMs will start in 2021 again, that’s clubs can vote on changes to rule books and averages, we may well have put our license on hold for the year and return to the BSPL in 2022.

Furthermore, he says, “no one wanted Barry (and Martin) to leave”. I put this to you reader… if you didn’t want a club to leave your organisation which if they did it would have a financial impact on your company, and you knew the club expressed a wish to leave, would you at least call them, request a meeting/zoom call, email them personally, send a personal text message, because I can tell you, even to today we have received no communication directly from ANY board member of the BSPL and indeed the only time we were referred to speak to Mr. Godfrey if we wanted to, was if we would like to sell the BSPL/Mr. Godfrey the promotional rights for speedway on the Isle of Wight. This is how much the BSPL did not want the Isle of Wight to leave the NL, BSPL and SCB. (Mr. Godfrey sits on both BSPL and SCB so one assumes both bodies were aware of the situation).

Of course, we never say never to a conversation with Mr. Godfrey and a recent offer to the SCB to meet up with them and the SCB has currently met with no response however we do realise that circumstances are not the best when the likes of Somerset close, Birmingham is put on hold and Wolverhampton has pushed out a warning about their future operation. What we will say is that before any meeting about us returning to the BSPL, the BSPL need to clearly understand why we left, why we believe we are vital to the future of the sport and why we also believe we can help take all that is great about the sport to the next generation.

Regrettably, we are again forced to clarify what statements are made by the BSPL when in truth, we just want to put on a show for the fans, sponsors, riders and volunteers at Smallbrook Stadium. This is not nor ever has been a personal competition between the Warriors V Mr. Godfrey/BSPL – we don’t view it like this and we never want to portray speedway negatively, we promote the sport at every possibility, especially now the sport is in crisis, one fact there is no escaping from.

We did have a significant programme of various events planned to start at the end of June, which included a 3 round Individual Championship with quite a large prize fund to be distributed at the end for riders completing in all three rounds, but that will have to go on hold now due to riders not coming forward to participate. As this issue will not be solved quickly in the current climate, we are now working very hastily on an alternative shortened programme of events which we hope to disclose shortly. 

[mikebv]

Barry and Chris...

i have a very simple outlook on "feedback" based on decades of being in the retail business, and it's this...

If you ever get criticised by anyone who has a track record of success in your field, then listen to them and respect their opinion...

If they don't have a record of success in your field then their opinion of you is utterly worthless...

[Halifaxtiger]

Based upon opinions here and elsewhere, it looks to me that everyone wants Isle of Wight to stage their planned meetings - all except a few members of the BSPL, that is (I am far from convinced that it applies to all of them). 

With one track suspending fixtures, another reporting heavy losses and a very real possibility that the 21 June deadline will be extended, you would think they would have more important matters to consider and being doing everything possible to ensure as much Speedway as possible takes place.

Edited June 12, 2021 by Halifaxtiger

[iris123]

7 minutes ago, Halifaxtiger said:

Based upon opinions here and elsewhere, it looks to me that everyone wants Isle of Wight to stage their planned meetings - all except a few members of the BSPL, that is (I am far from convinced that it applies to all of them). 

With one track suspending fixtures, another reporting heavy losses and a very real possibility that the 21 June deadline will be extended, you would think they would have more important matters to consider and being doing everything possible to ensure as much Speedway as possible takes place.

I have always been an advocate of a more flexible speedway season. I have stated for over a decade here that it should be possible for tracks to run outside, but alongside a league system. Some in power are totally against that 

[cityrebel]

3 hours ago, iris123 said:

I have always been an advocate of a more flexible speedway season. I have stated for over a decade here that it should be possible for tracks to run outside, but alongside a league system. Some in power are totally against that 

Open licence tracks were commonplace when i started going to speedway.

[SSL84]

Why not let IOW do what they want to do, and have someone independent there to see how it all goes and if anything new could be tried in any of the leagues? Let's be honest speedway needs something new, and also tracks to be better prepared. 

[gazzac]

As the exit from the NL looks to have started, hopefully only one, but think there could be more to go, makes the IOW decision even more stupid really.

[Sings4Speedway]

14 minutes ago, gazzac said:

As the exit from the NL looks to have started, hopefully only one, but think there could be more to go, makes the IOW decision even more stupid really.

Want to expand on that a little more? Newcastle are cost cutting because they have a non attractive CL team on display, sadly despite reduced costs via double headers there still isn't that much backing for the NL side either. Surely this justifies IOW's decision to step out because they weren't able to have a say on what makes a saleable product and brings into question those who had a say on things and whether they really know what they are talking about.

[Barry The Cat]

Newcastle Gems withdrawn

[gazzac]

35 minutes ago, Sings4Speedway said:

Want to expand on that a little more? Newcastle are cost cutting because they have a non attractive CL team on display, sadly despite reduced costs via double headers there still isn't that much backing for the NL side either. Surely this justifies IOW's decision to step out because they weren't able to have a say on what makes a saleable product and brings into question those who had a say on things and whether they really know what they are talking about.

Badly worded on my part, what I meant was the stupid decision to stop the IOW running independently this season is even more stupid now, although the delaying of the last covid lifting may have even caused a problem for Barry and co.

[Sings4Speedway]

8 minutes ago, gazzac said:

Badly worded on my part, what I meant was the stupid decision to stop the IOW running independently this season is even more stupid now, although the delaying of the last covid lifting may have even caused a problem for Barry and co.

See where you are coming from now, probably should have re-read it before getting my back up. 1000% agree though. I think Barry, Martin & co would have proved that without shackles you can still run consistently good nights of Speedway in front of happy crowds. It could even pave the way forward for all clubs, offering the chances to run formats that suit the home track and the support rather than the one size fits all approach that is currently forced upon all and is seeing tracks close year on year.

[Halifaxtiger]

Less than 200 tickets sold for Leicester v Mildenhall. Always a major risk running with a low points limit that people simply won't go to the stand alone NL meetings.

[gazzac]

8 minutes ago, Halifaxtiger said:

Less than 200 tickets sold for Leicester v Mildenhall. Always a major risk running with a low points limit that people simply won't go to the stand alone NL meetings.

Be interesting to see the up take of the Eastbourne vs Kent local derby NL match at the weekend as Saturday looks dry after a wet Friday which makes for an ideal track, I genuinely can't go but would have, as think there will be some really good races with Knight , Abblit,  Gilkes, Kinsley and the rest, if it's a poor crowd, not much hope for the NL clubs attached to a Championship one. Not sure Easties break even point, but imagine it must be around 400/500.

Edited June 16, 2021 by gazzac

[Halifaxtiger]

4 minutes ago, gazzac said:

Be interesting to see the up take of the Eastbourne vs Kent local derby NL match at the weekend as Saturday looks dry after a wet Friday which makes for an ideal track, I genuinely can't go but would have, as think there will be some really good races with Knight , Abblit,  Gilkes, Kinsley and the rest, if it's a poor crowd, not much hope for the NL clubs attached to a Championship one. Not sure Easties break even point, but imagine it must be around 400/500.

As I have said before. its s matter of perception rather than reality. The Speedway will be just as good but lower points limits almost always mean lower attendances.....and the NL clubs without a Championship team don't have the opportunity to double head.

[Sings4Speedway]

9 minutes ago, Halifaxtiger said:

Less than 200 tickets sold for Leicester v Mildenhall. Always a major risk running with a low points limit that people simply won't go to the stand alone NL meetings.

 

1 minute ago, gazzac said:

Be interesting to see the up take of the Eastbourne vs Kent match at the weekend as Saturday looks dry after a wet Friday which makes for an ideal track, I genuinely can't go but would have, as think there will be some really good races with Knight , Abblit,  Gilkes, Kinsley and the rest, if it's a poor crowd, not much hope for the NL clubs attached to a Championship one. Not sure Easties break even point, but imagine it must be around 400/500.

Alarming for Leicester but suffering for multiple reasons including having a good higher tier team this year along with using a lesser utilised race night doesn't help and the other team racing at the weekend. Also performances have been patchy and historically Leicester fans tend to get behind winning teams in greater numbers.

Eastbourne should be on a stronger footing with the regular race night, no CL action until next week to compete with and the local rivals being the visitors. Usually there is some second half action also which might not boost ticket sales it certainly adds to the production as a whole.

 

Maybe the most telling of all is the pricing? Eastbourne £10 Leicester £14...............

[gazzac]

7 minutes ago, Halifaxtiger said:

As I have said before. its s matter of perception rather than reality. The Speedway will be just as good but lower points limits almost always mean lower attendances.....and the NL clubs without a Championship team don't have the opportunity to double head.

Think what may help also, is Eastbourne and Kent  have just come off the back of 5 really entertaining successful years of NL racing, and although a lower points limit, both have put together 2 really good teams for the points with 2 potential future top liners in Abblit and Gilkes on show. Plus as Sings has said £14 is perhaps the big turn off for Leicester as well. 

Edited June 16, 2021 by gazzac

[mikebv]

21 minutes ago, Halifaxtiger said:

Less than 200 tickets sold for Leicester v Mildenhall. Always a major risk running with a low points limit that people simply won't go to the stand alone NL meetings.

Which is why so many are double headers..

If you as the business owner havent got faith in your own product then dont expect your customers to..