Wroclaw GP`s 1 and 2 Friday and Saturday 28th and 29th August

[IainB]

Also, looking at the lower scorers, 2 finished on 6 and 3 riders on 5... Yet I have to put all those heat details into a super computer to work out the championship points... It's absolutely BARMY!

[HenryW]

3 minutes ago, iainb said:

Also, looking at the lower scorers, 2 finished on 6 and 3 riders on 5... Yet I have to put all those heat details into a super computer to work out the championship points... It's absolutely BARMY!

R+R must be feeling proud that his pen and paper are now the equivalent of a supercomputer 

[racers and royals]

6 minutes ago, iainb said:

Also, looking at the lower scorers, 2 finished on 6 and 3 riders on 5... Yet I have to put all those heat details into a super computer to work out the championship points... It's absolutely BARMY!

But you don`t- if you are filling in a programme then it takes a minute- and if you are not filling in a programme - then why not. !!!! Quality one here for downloading https://www.speedwayservice.at/images/racecards/2020/SGP2020-02.pdf

Edited August 29, 2020 by racers and royals

[THE DEAN MACHINE]

1 hour ago, steve69 said:

So following this scoring system we now have tyres banned from tonights meeting? Only Anlas being used?

Such is the often ridiculous nature of speedway, it will probably rain a bit tonight and the meeting will get called off with the riders saying the Anlas tyres don’t work in the wet 

[IainB]

2 minutes ago, racers and royals said:

But you don`t- if you are filling in a programme then it takes a minute- and if you are not filling in a programme - then why not. !!!! Quality one here for downloading https://www.speedwayservice.at/images/racecards/2020/SGP2020-02.pdf

I haven't filled a programme in for about 20 years... The point is you shouldn't need to. Perhaps it's why they've changed the scoring system to boost programme sales, it's the only logical reason.

[Hodgy]

The GP’s have kept me going with my fading long term Speedway support. All those responsible for this pathetic scoring points concept should change it back immediately or be sacked. If they continue with it I will almost certainly be out for good. Judging by the comments, so will many more. 

[Gambo]

35 minutes ago, iainb said:

Also, looking at the lower scorers, 2 finished on 6 and 3 riders on 5... Yet I have to put all those heat details into a super computer to work out the championship points... It's absolutely BARMY!

You don't need a super computer, just a super Spreadsheet! 

[IainB]

19 minutes ago, Gambo said:

You don't need a super computer, just a super Spreadsheet! 

My name's not Sam Ermolenko 

[ytsejam]

1 hour ago, NeilWatson said:

But each GP is an individual (in both senses) meeting - albeit with the scores also counting towards the World Championship.

Oh dear!!....I think your "albeit" bit at the end sort of makes a mockery of your first sentence!!!!....Who cares or even remembers who won the Czech GP in 2018 for example?!!....but EVERYONE in here at least, will remember who won the World title that year as THAT'S all that matters! The way you talk is as if each individual GP winner is as important as the overall GP World Champion at the end of each year!!

[fatface]

5 hours ago, Grachan said:

A valid point regarding the race fixing, but the old points scoring was always open to the same thing in World Championship qualifiers. Penhall in 82 being a prime example.

There is a lot of talk from people complaining that the heats are just qualifiers, but, in the days of one off finals, entire meetings were qualifiers. Nobody complained then.

Also, in old World finals, you had 5 scoring heats to decide the winner. Here, you have 8 finals.

I liked the old system better, but to me this isn't as bad as people are saying.

Of course and you won't find me advocating a return to the old system and the Nordic-British-American-Intergalactic Final and such. It had had its day and was flawed. I'm no black and white extremist - unfashionable as that may be. 

Broadly speaking, I think the GPs are a great product, with excellent racing and well presented. I'd like to see the sport in more territories, but overall the World Championship has taken a significant step forward under the GP format from its latter years as a one off. I also congratulate the organisers for pulling togther a series at all this year in a very challenging climate. 

But, the new scoring format dents the series' credibility, by removing some of the edge from the heats and increasing the possibility of manipulation.

 

[SPEEDY69]

4 hours ago, lucifer sam said:

Yup, plus the pressure of winning the final and therefore the Grand Prix and standing at top of that podium at the end of the night.  If Bellamy thinks riders are happy to sit back in second place in the final, he needs to go back and watch some of the finals from the last few years.

When the Managing Director of BSI is so out of touch with the fan base, maybe a change is required.

But it's new fans/ businesses they want, not all of us anoraks. 

[SPEEDY69]

37 minutes ago, falcace said:

Of course and you won't find me advocating a return to the old system and the Nordic-British-American-Intergalactic Final and such. It had had its day and was flawed. I'm no black and white extremist - unfashionable as that may be. 

Broadly speaking, I think the GPs are a great product, with excellent racing and well presented. I'd like to see the sport in more territories, but overall the World Championship has taken a significant step forward under the GP format from its latter years as a one off. I also congratulate the organisers for pulling togther a series at all this year in a very challenging climate. 

But, the new scoring format dents the series' credibility, by removing some of the edge from the heats and increasing the possibility of manipulation.

 

Any format presents manipulation opportunity. In the old system, those who couldn't qualify for next year could help others, those safe for next year could help others. There's always room for manipulation if that's what you're open to. 

[ray c]

6 hours ago, NeilWatson said:

No

4th in the final gains 14 GP points, semi-final riders gain 12,11, 10 0r 9

if you read my post properly i was referring to last seasons system

[OveFundinFan]

In a way, the new system has already accomplished what it set out to do. Freddie fulfilled it when he raced all the way to the end, not content wit 7+3, he exerted himself and got 16. A leeson given, and possibly learnt - we shall see tonight.

[ProudtobeaBrummie]

Personally i like the new points format and brings us in line with all the more  successful motor sports 

[nw42]

I'm just glad we've got some decent speedway to watch, thoroughly enjoyed last night's meeting and am hopeful of more of the same tonight.  Freddie did a great job of making us all feel like Nicki is still in the series.

[fatface]

23 minutes ago, SPEEDY69 said:

Any format presents manipulation opportunity. In the old system, those who couldn't qualify for next year could help others, those safe for next year could help others. There's always room for manipulation if that's what you're open to. 

Nothing will be perfect. Formats should be geared to elimate or seriously hamper any potential corruption or manipulation. This new format makes it MORE likely. 

I am not citing unlikely scenarios either. 

We've all seen plenty of GPs where one rider is particularly "dialled in" that night.

On these occasions, the rider has every motivation to keep the pedal to the metal and grab every point they can to improve their World Championship standing. 

This won't be the case going forward with the new format. It doesn't take the biggest conspiracist to see a situation where that rider arrives at his last ride on 12 points, he will be much less incentivised to go all out. More likely, they will be checking their programmes and scores of their close rivals in the series and plotting what result would serve them best...Rather than going for a rewardless maximum.

The longer the series goes and the championship rivals and the qualification cut off contenders emerge, the more likely this scenario will play out. 

Edited August 29, 2020 by falcace

[lucifer sam]

22 minutes ago, SPEEDY69 said:

But it's new fans/ businesses they want, not all of us anoraks. 

The problem is us anoraks will quickly adapt to the scoring system - e.g. it wasn't that hard for me to work out the points last night, as much as I think the new system is daft.

It's the more general fans which won't understand the new points system e.g. how a rider can score 6 points in his races and yet end up with 8 Grand Prix points.  It's really weird, having two different sets of points, and throws speedway out of kilter from almost every other motorsport where points are scored per race.

[Bavarian]

3 minutes ago, lucifer sam said:

The problem is us anoraks will quickly adapt to the scoring system - e.g. it wasn't that hard for me to work out the points last night, as much as I think the new system is daft.

It's the more general fans which won't understand the new points system e.g. how a rider can score 6 points in his races and yet end up with 8 Grand Prix points.  It's really weird, having two different sets of points, and throws speedway out of kilter from almost every other motorsport where points are scored per race.

That's it, spot on. Thanks

[HenryW]

9 minutes ago, ProudtobeaBrummie said:

Personally i like the new points format and brings us in line with all the more  successful motor sports 

Probably want to get all 16 on track together in one or two very long races as well if the aim is to bring it in line with other motorsports.

That would probably be a crazy idea, though, as speedway is fairly unique...which is why having a unique scoring system makes sense as well.