Odsal hopes

[IainB]

17 hours ago, Spl77 said:

The issue is some promoters didn't want and still don't want speedway live on tv so will happily see it fail. 

When sky got involved in 99 that was the golden opportunity to rebuild speedway sadly the BSPA as a collective totally messed up and miss that opportunity. 

TV can work look what's its done for Football and yes I know its not all been positive however football is completely reborn off the back of tv 

Late 80s top flight football playing in old stadiums with dropping attendance figures. 

The FA and the clubs knew they had to change to survive at the level they had been acustommed too. 

Along comes sky with the money and before you know it money is flowing in tatty old stada rebuilt or brand new stada constructed and money at a level that could only be dreamt about flowing in. 

Yes speedway is much smaller in scale however 99 was the golden egg and instead of the BSPA sitting on it and nurturing it they dropped and ever since have been trying to put the egg back in the broken shell. 

 

 

19 hours ago, steve roberts said:

I remember a friend of mine who would stay at home and watch a match that was televised live at Cowley rather than walk the half mile to the track as was his normal want.

Highlights I saw no problem with but live? Speedway's fan base was never going to be sustainable as attendances were already on the slide when live matches were introduced during the late (?) nineties. Whether speedway failed to capitalise is obviously a very good point and it seems that the sport missed an opportunity hence the current predicament that the sport apparently now finds itself in.

The Speedway on TV issue is a complex one, looking back at the crowds in the early Sky days and it's pretty clear promoters of today would die for those crowds. A lot of "promotions" never promoted a televised event at their track.

At the end of the day, for me and many people I suspect, it came down to money. Whenever Sky were at Coventry I never went... because they never reduced their admission, I wasn't going to pay £16 to watch a meeting I was already paying for on Sky, If they'd reduced it to a tenner (and once or twice they did) I would have attended (and I did). When clubs reduced their admission the crowds were generally much more healthy.

[ch958]

2 hours ago, iainb said:

 

The Speedway on TV issue is a complex one, looking back at the crowds in the early Sky days and it's pretty clear promoters of today would die for those crowds. A lot of "promotions" never promoted a televised event at their track.

At the end of the day, for me and many people I suspect, it came down to money. Whenever Sky were at Coventry I never went... because they never reduced their admission, I wasn't going to pay £16 to watch a meeting I was already paying for on Sky, If they'd reduced it to a tenner (and once or twice they did) I would have attended (and I did). When clubs reduced their admission the crowds were generally much more healthy.

many of us, perhaps reluctantly, pay 15 - 18 pds to go to a meeting. Casual fans won't and don't. 10/12 quid is where the market would dictate the level for a speedway match. The knock on effect is that there would be less cash for paying riders. The knock on effects of that would be the need for cheaper kit and semi pro riders. Has anyone got the authority/ cojones to implement such a plan with the associated massive gamble of having fewer big name riders? I will now don my hard hat.

[foamfence]

7 minutes ago, ch958 said:

many of us, perhaps reluctantly, pay 15 - 18 pds to go to a meeting. Casual fans won't and don't. 10/12 quid is where the market would dictate the level for a speedway match. The knock on effect is that there would be less cash for paying riders. The knock on effects of that would be the need for cheaper kit and semi pro riders. Has anyone got the authority/ cojones to implement such a plan with the associated massive gamble of having fewer big name riders? I will now don my hard hat.

I have thought that was the way forward for a long time, I'd even consider withdrawing from FIM events in time and just run our own competitions.

[ch958]

what people don't seem to get is that the market dictates what people are willing to pay, not the other way around. Its double the price of cinema tickets, for example. A family of 2 plus 2 would need to spend around 50/60 quid to go to the speedway, maybe half that for the flix or a pizza hut or takeaway meal. That's the economic reality that potential fans face and thats what decisions around admission fees have to be based on

[mikebv]

21 minutes ago, ch958 said:

what people don't seem to get is that the market dictates what people are willing to pay, not the other way around. Its double the price of cinema tickets, for example. A family of 2 plus 2 would need to spend around 50/60 quid to go to the speedway, maybe half that for the flix or a pizza hut or takeaway meal. That's the economic reality that potential fans face and thats what decisions around admission fees have to be based on

Spot on..

Cinemas and Pizza Hut though won't be paying out £10k (and maybe much more) for two nights work to their employees...

A £10 - £12 price point simply couldn't sustain that, however is probably the price point that reflects the sports standing, and its circa 15 mins of actual amount of on track entertainment time..

 

 

 

 

[Hawk127]

Price it low and pile it high. That is almost what they do in Poland albeit the stadia etc are better underwritten with commitment from the local authority. Are the current crop of ride s still expecting top dollar given where the rest of the U.K. work force stand and the fact that Poland has lowered its rates. Someone who owns the track should experiment and as a one off see what happens when you charge £5 per adult and £1 per child. Find 14 riders prepared to ride for a lower points money but with a chance to share in the takings over a certain level once the basic costs are covered. Unless you try you will never know and it could get new supporters if it works. Just and thought and standing by to be shot down in flames.

[greyhoundp]

For how many years have some of us been saying Speedway is a £10 sport, but the promoters are deaf to whats being said, yes by all means put meetings on for £10 per person, but there has to be an advertising/promotion campaign to go with it, otherwise its pretty pointless, Meanwhile Odsal awaits.

[iris123]

30 minutes ago, Hawk127 said:

Price it low and pile it high. That is almost what they do in Poland albeit the stadia etc are better underwritten with commitment from the local authority. Are the current crop of ride s still expecting top dollar given where the rest of the U.K. work force stand and the fact that Poland has lowered its rates. Someone who owns the track should experiment and as a one off see what happens when you charge £5 per adult and £1 per child. Find 14 riders prepared to ride for a lower points money but with a chance to share in the takings over a certain level once the basic costs are covered. Unless you try you will never know and it could get new supporters if it works. Just and thought and standing by to be shot down in flames.

Not going to shoot you down in flames. Just want to question you on what is cheap in Poland ? I mean going by rough average monthly wages and 1% of that is 49 PLN. Now that is slightly higher than the average price to get in I think, which is say 40 PLN at a rough guess. So if we take UK average wage of around 2044 quid and 1% is 20 quid. Slightly lower, and say 16 quid is the equivalent of the polish price. Ok you have a lower level and pay out less to riders. But the big problem is the rent and often I gather is not getting the money from food and drink on top of that.  5 quid is a huge huge gamble and a promoter would probably go bust before he see's any major improvements. But maybe one or two might give it a go.....

[proud panther]

We won't get speedway for £10, never mind a fiver. Get the tracks right for good racing, & the average speedway fan wouldn't have a problem with admission prices.

[ch958]

1 hour ago, proud panther said:

We won't get speedway for £10, never mind a fiver. Get the tracks right for good racing, & the average speedway fan wouldn't have a problem with admission prices.

not talking about the average fan, talking about the casual fan who might spend his 15/18 elsewhere

[IainB]

10 hours ago, proud panther said:

We won't get speedway for £10, never mind a fiver. Get the tracks right for good racing, & the average speedway fan wouldn't have a problem with admission prices.

The crowds at Belle Vue would suggest different

[greyhoundp]

11 hours ago, proud panther said:

We won't get speedway for £10, never mind a fiver. Get the tracks right for good racing, & the average speedway fan wouldn't have a problem with admission prices.

The problem PP is the average number of fans has gone down to the point of no return, so its new fans that we need to attract and at £18 per meeting its not going to happen, £36 for me and the missus to watch 15 minutes of racing sometimes on a cold night doesnt appeal to me anymore, and im a life long speedway fan.. The sport has to be more fan friendly and it can begin by bringing the cost down, dont say it cant be done because it can but i rarely see any announcement from the BSPL saying they are looking at ways of doing it..

[iris123]

As I have shown the cost isn’t that different to Poland in real terms. If costs were cut I doubt that would be handed on to the fans. More likely the promoter would make a bit of money, rather than running the sport as an expensive hobby

[steve roberts]

On 6/16/2020 at 8:42 AM, iainb said:

 

The Speedway on TV issue is a complex one, looking back at the crowds in the early Sky days and it's pretty clear promoters of today would die for those crowds. A lot of "promotions" never promoted a televised event at their track.

At the end of the day, for me and many people I suspect, it came down to money. Whenever Sky were at Coventry I never went... because they never reduced their admission, I wasn't going to pay £16 to watch a meeting I was already paying for on Sky, If they'd reduced it to a tenner (and once or twice they did) I would have attended (and I did). When clubs reduced their admission the crowds were generally much more healthy.

Yes I also knew of fans who kept away and fundamentally that was the issue in my view hence which is why I keep repeating why I was never sure who the target audience were and whether any genuine marketing was carried out at the time? I've never subscribed to SKY (and never likely to) so was never an issue with me personally.

[Piotr Pyszny]

24 minutes ago, steve roberts said:

Yes I also knew of fans who kept away and fundamentally that was the issue in my view hence which is why I keep repeating why I was never sure who the target audience were and whether any genuine marketing was carried out at the time? I've never subscribed to SKY (and never likely to) so was never an issue with me personally.

Like you, I'm a confirmed SKY non-subscriber, so whether or not matches (of various sports) were/are on the telly made/makes no difference to my spectating choices. I gather viewing figures for speedway club meetings shown live peaked at circa 145,000. That's probably about 115,000 more than speedway's weekly customer footfall. Pretty useful, one would imagine, for improving the sport's all but invisible profile. Were any of this 115,000 tempted along to their local circuit? If not, why not?

Further to the 'provide good racing and the crowds will come' claim: it certainly wasn't my experience during the last few seasons at Cleveland Park, Middlesbrough, where the racing was consistently excellent and the two local newspapers (the Evening Gazette and the Northern Echo, both of whom had a speedway reporter) gave the club plenty of daily publicity. Yet Boro Bears struggled to attract viable crowds. Average in the final season, 1996, was 850. I remember the promoter, Malcolm Wright, telling me he lost a grand every home meeting. Not great crowds but, ominously, still several hundred above what the club, as Redcar, are capable of drawing now.

Edited June 17, 2020 by Piotr Pyszny

[proud panther]

12 hours ago, ch958 said:

not talking about the average fan, talking about the casual fan who might spend his 15/18 elsewhere

Very true, but £10 is not feasible with the current riders in Britain. Recent events may solve this problem, with lower standard riders our only option.

[ch958]

51 minutes ago, proud panther said:

Very true, but £10 is not feasible with the current riders in Britain. Recent events may solve this problem, with lower standard riders our only option.

i've already said that

[RobMcCaffery]

1 hour ago, proud panther said:

Very true, but £10 is not feasible with the current riders in Britain. Recent events may solve this problem, with lower standard riders our only option.

A lower standard of riding does not ensure a lower standard of racing as any Championship or NL supporter will confirm - if anyone's listening.....

Edited June 17, 2020 by RobMcCaffery

[cityrebel]

17 minutes ago, RobMcCaffery said:

A lower standard of riding does not ensure a lower standard of racing as any Championship or NL supporter will confirm - if anyone's listening.....

There is a lot of snobbery in speedway. When West Ham dropped down a league, it was like pulling teeth trying to get my old man to take me to Custom House.

[proud panther]

3 hours ago, iainb said:

The crowds at Belle Vue would suggest different

Maybe I'm forgetting the fact that long term speedway fans are getting older & are unable to attend, or passing away. Agree it's a mystery why Belle Vue isn't supported more. If I lived near there, I would go every week.