Your best speedway year

[arnieg]

On the 1965 averages issue I think this is the position:

The principal source for the Oakes History of the BL came from Speedway Star season reviews. From 1966 onwards the stats in these showed matches, rides, points, etc.

BUT for 1965  (and earlier years) they only showed matches and points, no rides. So in order to produce an average (without researching every single match in 1965) it was assumed riders had four rides. Mostly they did but rides missed thru injury, tac subs and reserve rides will mean that over the season the numbers won't be right.

[E I Addio]

9 hours ago, BOBBATH said:

Hi El Addio not too sure about that. From memory  the other guys who left PL for NL when the former turned black were Stan Stevens, Trevor Hedge maybe Bob Dugard. Have to say Norman Hunter was the only "star" who switched , I think Simmo was maybe a middle order guy. The other "stars " stuck with the PL. Interested that Hackney lost 3 riders to the NL Not sure what  averages Norman Hunter, Malcolm Simmons and Trevor Hedge had in the 1964 NL maybe you know Norbold??

 Not sure whether George Hunter, Eric Boocock  and Charlie Monk would have made the jump if the leagues remained separate with the same balance of tracks- they were making better money in the Prov. league  than they would in the NL with more tracks, plus George H.  and Eric B. being able to ride relatively close to home. Interesting question whether Mauger would have moved to NL-he didn't in 1964 and he was a guy who had a good sense of his own value

I reckon more guys would have made the jump the other way- Bob Andrews, Ronnie Genz etc.

 I agree that 1965 was the start of a golden era of British speedway, a wonderful year

I was speaking in terms of Hunter and Simmons as not being top stars at the time,  but two that made tremendous progress in the course of the season. In Simmons case it was, as I said, precipitated by the need to keep his licence for grass track, but both were much better riders at the end of the season, considering Simons was only about 18 or 19 and it was only his second season, and Hunter was I think only in his third season. 
If I remember correctly without checking Simmons book, it was Malcolm that pushed Dugard out of the West Ham team when he switched leagues early season, and according to Simmons there was bad feeling between them as a result . I don’t know where Dugard went after that.

Edited April 16, 2020 by E I Addio

[E I Addio]

9 hours ago, BOBBATH said:

. Interesting question whether Mauger would have moved to NL-he didn't in 1964 and he was a guy who had a good sense of his value.

 

Wasn’t there some row between Mauger and his promoter about that ? I think the promoter concerned was Mike Parker or Bill Bridgett, but whoever it was persuaded  Mauger to stay with his PL club on the promise that the dispute would be sorted out within six weeks, which it wasn't, and Mauger’s ACU International licence got suspended as a result. I can’t remember where I read that, probably one of Maugers books.

Edited April 16, 2020 by E I Addio

[Sidney the robin]

1 minute ago, E I Addio said:

Wasn’t there some row between Mauger and his promoter about that ? I think the promoter concerned was Mike Parker or Bill Bridgett, but whoever it was persuaded  Mauger to stay with his PL club on the promise that the dispute would be sorted out within six weeks, which it wasn't, and Mauger’s ACU International licence got suspended as a result. I can’t remember where I read that, probably one of Maugers books.

He did fall out with Parker Addio who was known to be very ruthless.But  Parker has to go down as one of the greatest promoters in history even though he was far from being Mr popular.

[norbold]

28 minutes ago, E I Addio said:

I was speaking in terms of Hunter and Simmons as not being top stars at the time,  but two that made tremendous progress in the course of the season. In Simmons case it was, as I said, precipitated by the need to keep his licence for grass track, but both were much better riders at the end of the season, considering Simons was only about 18 or 19 and it was only his second season, and Hunter was I think only in his third season. 
If I remember correctly without checking Simmons book, it was Malcolm that pushed Dugard out of the West Ham team when he switched leagues early season, and according to Simmons there was bad feeling between them as a result . I don’t know where Dugard went after that.

Yes, Malcolm Simmons started the season blacklisted, but realised he would not be able to ride in grass track events, his first love at that time, so he applied for his licence back. This was granted on condition, of course, he rode for a National League team and Tommy Price signed him up for West Ham. And yes, it was Bobby Dugard he replaced. Dugard moved on to Wimbledon. And in that memorable 14 August meeting at Wimbledon, Simmons beat Dugard once in the match and once in the second half.

Yes, Simmons' second season; Hunter's third.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 16, 2020 by norbold

[E I Addio]

On 4/14/2020 at 8:24 AM, norbold said:

Out of interest, I thought I would look up to see who were the best PL riders and how they did against former NL riders.
In the 1965 league averages top of the list of former PL riders was Charlie Monk, who was 6th overall with 10.28.

Then: Eric Boocock (13th with 9.43); George Hunter (15th with 9.35); Ivor Brown (16th with 9.27); Bill Andrew (19th with 9.07); Dave Younghusband (20th with 9.06)
Those were the top six and the only former PL riders with a 9+ average.

Incidentally, our old friend from another thread, Nigel Boocock, was top of the averages, the only rider with an 11+ average.

According to Classic Speedway , Spring 2012, Norman Hunters average from official BL and KO Cup matches in 1965 was 9.67. 

[steve roberts]

I think that records were not always particulary reliable until Bryan Seery became the official statistician...can't remember when however although there was a fascinating article in "Backtrack" a couple or so years ago.

[BL65]

12 hours ago, norbold said:

And according to Peter Oakes History of British League it was 8.867!

 

12 hours ago, chunky said:

According to Speedway History (proboards) he averaged 8.7 in 1965.

According to The British Speedway Handbook, with statistics by Bryan Seery, Peter Jarman appeared in 27 league matches, with 108 rides, scored 221 points, with 14 bonus points, giving a total of 235 points.  That gives a calculated match average of 8.70.

Jarman also rode in one KO Cup match, at Exeter, scoring 12 plus a bonus point from 6 rides.  The total official match figures should, therefore, be 28 matches, 114 rides, 233 points, 15 bonus, total 248 points.  This gives a CMA of 8.70.  JoeW has pointed out the reason for the error in the History of the British League book.

Edited April 16, 2020 by BL65

[customhouseregular]

1965 aside, I have to mention 1960, the year I discovered speedway. Sunday afternoons at Rye House, no big names, no major meetings or championships, just the thrill of standing against the fence on the first bend, getting showered as the riders sped past. Heroes to watch on a sunday...no stars, just good solid riders like Mudge, Hitch, Sweetman, McGillivray and Broadbank. Magic days for a 12 year old boy.

[E I Addio]

51 minutes ago, BL65 said:

 

According to The British Speedway Handbook, with statistics by Bryan Seery, Peter Jarman appeared in 27 league matches, with 108 rides, scored 221 points, with 14 bonus points, giving a total of 235 points.  That gives a calculated match average of 8.70.

Jarman also rode in one KO Cup match, at Exeter, scoring 12 plus a bonus point from 6 rides.  The total official match figures should, therefore, be 28 matches, 114 rides, 233 points, 15 bonus, total 248 points.  This gives a CMA of 8.70.  JoeW has pointed out the reason for the error in the History of the British League book.

The Lemon Drop Kid ! Never a great star but IMO a very underrated rider. One of the reasons for speedways golden era was not just that there were some outstanding riders at the top but there was also a strong second tier of riders to keep the top dogs on their toes. I stand to be corrected but I think PLJ never made a British Final let alone a World Final, or if he did he didn’t do very well, yet he was really a very good rider. That was the quality of the sport in this times. 
oh, where did it all go wrong ?

[steve roberts]

1 minute ago, E I Addio said:

The Lemon Drop Kid ! Never a great star but IMO a very underrated rider. One of the reasons for speedways golden era was not just that there were some outstanding riders at the top but there was also a strong second tier of riders to keep the top dogs on their toes. I stand to be corrected but I think PLJ never made a British Final let alone a World Final, or if he did he didn’t do very well, yet he was really a very good rider. That was the quality of the sport in this times. 
oh, where did it all go wrong ?

'Speedy Pete' and 'Joe' Gooddy used to look out for each other when they rode for "The Cheetahs". Woe betide anyone who messed about with one because they then had the other to contend wit!

[fatface]

14 hours ago, waiheke1 said:

Again, our experience so similar. My first away trip was Brandon in 81, from 82 I dont think we missed an Aces meeting at the Shay, and caught most of their meetings at Brandon. Didn't make Owlerton til 84, made the trek to Dudley Wood in 83 only for the meeting to be washed out...

Never got to Dudley Wood. I also don't think we missed an away trip to the Shay either from 82-85. Always a great view, great atmosphere, good banter and with Kenny Carter, PC and Mort, always great racing too 

Another thoroughly enjoyable season was watching Exeter in 1989. Richard Green was unmissable and there were some brilliant cup matches against Berwick. 

[chunky]

40 minutes ago, falcace said:

Never got to Dudley Wood.

I'm so sorry... The pork and stuffing sandwiches, and incredible pork scratchings, were worth the trip alone!

[fatface]

18 minutes ago, chunky said:

I'm so sorry... The pork and stuffing sandwiches, and incredible pork scratchings, were worth the trip alone!

Thanks. That makes me feel a whole lot better about missing out.  

[Sidney the robin]

2 hours ago, E I Addio said:

The Lemon Drop Kid ! Never a great star but IMO a very underrated rider. One of the reasons for speedways golden era was not just that there were some outstanding riders at the top but there was also a strong second tier of riders to keep the top dogs on their toes. I stand to be corrected but I think PLJ never made a British Final let alone a World Final, or if he did he didn’t do very well, yet he was really a very good rider. That was the quality of the sport in this times. 
oh, where did it all go wrong ?

Speedy Pete won the 1964 Pride of the Midlands at Wolverhampton as you say a tough un and very underrated.I can remember seeing him in his later years in the NL for Eastbourne still very useful prepared the track at Poole for quite a while another unsung hero.

[steve roberts]

18 minutes ago, Sidney the robin said:

Speedy Pete won the 1964 Pride of the Midlands at Wolverhampton as you say a tough un and very underrated.I can remember seeing him in his later years in the NL for Eastbourne still very useful prepared the track at Poole for quite a while another unsung hero.

He also appeared a handful of times for "The Rebels" in 1975 due to our promotional tie-up (great days) and, of course, he was very involved with the construction of the White City track. He ran a training school at Cowley during the winter of 1975/76 and I recall Pip Lamb being a regular and Gary Spencer (whatever happpened to him?) Pete was also Team Manager of "The Cheetahs" in 1978...great team with the likes of George Hunter, David Shields, John Hack, Carl Askew etc.

[norbold]

52 minutes ago, chunky said:

I'm so sorry... The pork and stuffing sandwiches, and incredible pork scratchings, were worth the trip alone!

I only ever went once, 1965, as it was the match away to Cradley Heath that won West Ham the league that year. Sadly, I didn't try the pork and stuffing sandwiches.....

[iris123]

1 hour ago, falcace said:

Thanks. That makes me feel a whole lot better about missing out.  

Well I did go to the track. But as it was before the internet and never seeing it mentioned in the Star, I didn't even realise it was on sale or such a delicacy !!!

[BL65]

1 hour ago, norbold said:

I only ever went once, 1965, as it was the match away to Cradley Heath that won West Ham the league that year. Sadly, I didn't try the pork and stuffing sandwiches.....

 

31 minutes ago, iris123 said:

Well I did go to the track. But as it was before the internet and never seeing it mentioned in the Star, I didn't even realise it was on sale or such a delicacy !!!

I don't recall pork sandwiches on sale at the track until the 1980s.  Fairly certain they were not available in 1965.

[norbold]

1 hour ago, BL65 said:

 

I don't recall pork sandwiches on sale at the track until the 1980s.  Fairly certain they were not available in 1965.

That's good news. So I didn't miss out on this great delicacy then.