Who is financing speedway in Poland ?

[PolskiZuzel]

 

 

If anyone of you was is still in doubt who is really financing Polish speedwayspeedway in Poland, here is the answer as “revealed” by the Polish website: po-bandzie.com.pl.

Are you surprised?

Polish speedway is kept by the local governments. It is the taxpayers' money that makes it possible for  construction of new stadiums or renovation of outdated ones. They give the opportunity to contract foreign and national stars . Without television coverage, Polish speedway would run  with miserable public interest. Without state-owned companies, it would be much poorer,  it would persist in pain and torment as a natural curiosity, but without money from local government it would fall on its face.

Truly, I tell you that without local government money there would be no Motoarena in Toruń or Łódź. It would be impossible to modernize the stadiums in Gorzów, Wrocław, Częstochowa, Zielona Góra and Grudziądz. Nobody would even bother about building a new facility in Lublin. Any plans to refresh the infrastructure in Gniezno and Tarnów would probably have to be postponed for many years. 

Stadiums are just one side of the coin, the other is money allocated for the promotion of the city by the club and the team. In this way, millions of subsidies affect the account of  clubs in Częstochowa,  Wrocław and  Lublin. All Polish clubs get more or less money. If not in live cash, then they are exempt from fees for using the stadium and their necessary repairs. More money from local government means extraliga possibilities. Smaller funds are enough for first or second league.

Let's take Częstochowa as an example. The city mayor and the city council lamented about the huge debt, but more than three millions were found. In this way, residents of Częstochowa are paying pay four foreign riders from Danmark, Sweden, Australia, and Norway plus a young man from Toruń for a good result. All this so that the speedway team from Czestochowa would fight for the Polish team championship and the people of Częstochowa had a reason to be proud. Anyway, things are similar in Wrocław. Taxpayers sponsor two Englishmen, an Australian, a Russian and a young man from Częstochowa. In Grudziądz, the strenght of the local speedway club is one hundred percent dependent on money from local government.  Grudziadz’s mayor has more to say than  the club's boss . Without the support of the town hall Rudziadz team would not even have the right to dream of an extraliga. Taxpayers' money, are spent on speedway, which can only boast  six months of competition in a year, and on its own stadium the club can stage  only seven league matches. For all kinds of speedway and leage-maniacs, that's quite normal. For everyone else it's quite abnormal.

Speedway in Poland has long been an element of local politics. Due to the great interest of fans, city presidents and councillors have become virtual slaves to the speedway tradition. They can't afford to disregard  speedway fans, because they will lose  election. And although local government debts are growing at an alarming rate, to make potential voters happy, millions for speedway must be found.   Meanwhile, education is suffering, health care is dying, and more loans are bursting annual budgets.

Local government officials, however, must take into account that citizens will eventually get fed up with long quees at the hospital waiting room, and the expenses for professional sports will start to bother them. It is likely that local government officials will say stop and significantly reduce spending on spring-summer speedway. Then unprepared clubs will remain with a budget hole. Such scenario needs be taken seriously. Meanwhile, speedway is becoming increasingly dependent on city money.

(…) 

Even in speedway cities, not everyone is mad about speedway. And not everyone is interested in spending money on foreign stars. Let everyone answer the question,  whether taxes’ money should constitute one third of the professional speedway club budget, consisting of seven players, usually four foreigners. I have the impression that in the end, local politicians will have to answer the title question, who prefers speedway and who efficient health service?

[RobMcCaffery]

Fascinating reading although I would suspect it is a touch biased. A fundamental reason for Poland's success must lie in its attendances, the levels of which then open the doors to TV and sponsorship monies.

The subsidy from cities helps project the sport's finances into the stratosphere. The recent case regarding Rybnik supports the above. When the local council complained that their subsidy to the club for the 2018 season had not been fully spent in 2019 they demanded a refund of the difference. ROW's response was to threaten closure.

When British fans use the Polish example as a stick to to beat the BSPA with, in Britain we have just one comparible case, the NSS, but even then the public money has only gone into construction, not operational costs.

It is not a level playing field and it could be argued that Polish public money is being used indirectly ruin British (and Swedish to an extent) speedway. Others would suggest that the BSPA needs no help in this.

I'm sure the average British promoter would only dream of such subsidies. Over here imagine the reaction if a wealthy sport like football had its stadia built and rebuilt at the expense of the local taxpayers!

Another interesting point is the suggestion that nationalised companies are helping contribute to the public subsidy. How many of the likes of Nice or Get Well are private businesses? I would have expected all to be private. It would be useful to know which companies the writer refers to.

 

Edited February 8, 2020 by RobMcCaffery

[PolskiZuzel]

9 hours ago, RobMcCaffery said:

... A fundamental reason for Poland's success must lie in its attendances, the levels of which then open the doors to TV and sponsorship monies.

To have attendances you must have funds to contract good riders.

You won't have attendences if your team is losing match after match.

To have a successful team you need riders who will deliver that, and such riders (if available) cost money.

 

 

 

 

[RobMcCaffery]

1 hour ago, PolskiZuzel said:

To have attendances you must have funds to contract good riders.

You won't have attendences if your team is losing match after match.

To have a successful team you need riders who will deliver that, and such riders (if available) cost money.

 

 

On that basis only your top teams would have high attendances. They all have figures that are the envy of other speedway nation. Gates at relegated Torun would still be enough to delight any promoter outside Poland.

 

Edited February 9, 2020 by RobMcCaffery

[racers and royals]

17 hours ago, RobMcCaffery said:

Fascinating reading although I would suspect it is a touch biased. A fundamental reason for Poland's success must lie in its attendances, the levels of which then open the doors to TV and sponsorship monies.

The subsidy from cities helps project the sport's finances into the stratosphere. The recent case regarding Rybnik supports the above. When the local council complained that their subsidy to the club for the 2018 season had not been fully spent in 2019 they demanded a refund of the difference. ROW's response was to threaten closure.

When British fans use the Polish example as a stick to to beat the BSPA with, in Britain we have just one comparible case, the NSS, but even then the public money has only gone into construction, not operational costs.

It is not a level playing field and it could be argued that Polish public money is being used indirectly ruin British (and Swedish to an extent) speedway. Others would suggest that the BSPA needs no help in this.

I'm sure the average British promoter would only dream of such subsidies. Over here imagine the reaction if a wealthy sport like football had its stadia built and rebuilt at the expense of the local taxpayers!

Another interesting point is the suggestion that nationalised companies are helping contribute to the public subsidy. How many of the likes of Nice or Get Well are private businesses? I would have expected all to be private. It would be useful to know which companies the writer refers to.

 

Polska Grupa Energetyczna( PGE) is  one of the nationalised company they refer to.

[f-s-p]

As I understand, this is the system how Polish sport operates, not just speedway. 

[arnieg]

7 minutes ago, f-s-p said:

As I understand, this is the system how Polish sport operates, not just speedway. 

And it is not unique to Poland. In the USA (home of unbridled capitalism) municipal funding of baseball and NFL stadiums has long been the norm (although there has been some recent pushback)

[Bavarian]

Same here in Germany, sports stadia (incl. Speedway tracks) are usually owned and payed for by the municipality and tax payer. 

[iris123]

There was a Polish investigation into corruption, which had a small section mentioning sport. It was basically involving football, but suggested if it was s bad in football and looking at the money involved in speedway, the conclusion is(without any evidence, I may add) that it would be much the same in speedway

One such report on football

https://www.dw.com/en/polish-soccer-plagued-by-cronyism-and-corruption/a-15980132

Edited February 9, 2020 by iris123

[PolskiZuzel]

12 hours ago, RobMcCaffery said:

On that basis only your top teams would have high attendances. They all have figures that are the envy of other speedway nation. Gates at relegated Torun would still be enough to delight any promoter outside Poland.

 

It is interesting to see attendence figures compared with stadium capacity.

Here they are compiled by sportowefakty.pl.

 

Club	Stadium capacity	Home matches	Total attendance in numbers	Average attendance	Average attendance in %
LUBLIN	9’812	7	68’684	9’812	100
WROCLAW	14’000	9	115’499	12’833	91.67
GRUDZIADZ	8’000	7	48’000	6’857	85.71
CZESTOCHOWA	16’850	9	124’500	13’833	82.10
ZIELONA GORA	15’000	9	110’000	12’222	81.48
GORZOW	15’000	7	70’750	10’107	67.27
LESZNO	16’700	9	100’760	11’196	67.04
TORUN	15’500	7	53’936	7’705	49.71

The undisputed winner of this ranking is Lublin. All home matches in Lublin were sold to the last place. Some said - half jokingly, half seriously - that if Lublin’s stadium had 20,000 seats, fans, even then would buy all available tickets.

In the case of Częstochowa there is an interesting situation, because in the attendance ranking they came first with an average of 13,833 fans per meeting. However, after taking into account the total capacity of their stadium Częstochowa are no longer the leader. 

Finally, the lack of supporters at Torun’s Motoarena illustrates well the relationship between sports results and attendance at the stands. 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 9, 2020 by PolskiZuzel

[PolskiZuzel]

18 minutes ago, iris123 said:

There was a Polish investigation into corruption, which had a small section mentioning sport. It was basically involving football, but suggested if it was s bad in football and looking at the money involved in speedway, the conclusion is(without any evidence, I may add) that it would be much the same in speedway

One such report on football

https://www.dw.com/en/polish-soccer-plagued-by-cronyism-and-corruption/a-15980132

You are giving report that is eight years old.

We are talking about now, the presence.

[iris123]

11 minutes ago, PolskiZuzel said:

You are giving report that is eight years old.

We are talking about now, the presence.

So the situation is a lot better now ? I have seen reports that since this has all come into the open corruption is better, although the average person on the street still thinks it a major problem

This chart suggests, whilst things have got better after this was in the media,it is basically similar to 8 years ago again......

https://tradingeconomics.com/poland/corruption-rank

Edited February 9, 2020 by iris123

[severnsider]

Was there a suggestion that part of the downturn as Bydgoszcz was due to the council putting money into athletics rather than speedway?

[PolskiZuzel]

2 hours ago, iris123 said:

So the situation is a lot better now ? I have seen reports that since this has all come into the open corruption is better,

.... although the average person on the street still thinks it a major problem

This chart suggests, whilst things have got better after this was in the media,it is basically similar to 8 years ago again......

https://tradingeconomics.com/poland/corruption-rank

With all due respect...

What the reports on corruption at large, and perhaps more than 10 years ago in football , have to do with speedway in Poland?? Where do you see connection?

 

[iris123]

Just now, PolskiZuzel said:

With all due respect...

What the reports on corruption at large, and perhaps more than 10 years ago in football , have to do with speedway in Poland?? Where do you see connection?

 

I thought I made it perfectly clear. I don't see the connection. That was made by a Polish investigator in his report on Polish society as a whole. And he didn't even bother to investigate. He just came up with the 1+1= formula, that if Polish local politics was corrupt and Polish sport, in this case football is corrupt, it is highly likely given the importance to local town/city politicians that speedway is also....... It was all there in my earlier post if you care to go back and read it again

So I ask again. Are you saying things are better now ?

[PolskiZuzel]

1 hour ago, iris123 said:

I thought I made it perfectly clear. I don't see the connection. 

So I ask again. Are you saying things are better now ?

To be honest with you, I am getting bored with all these investigations into corruption.

My answer to your question (whether things are better now) is - I don't know.

And when it comes to corruption in speedway... I have not heard of any.

[iris123]

19 hours ago, PolskiZuzel said:

To be honest with you, I am getting bored with all these investigations into corruption.

My answer to your question (whether things are better now) is - I don't know.

And when it comes to corruption in speedway... I have not heard of any.

Wasn’t one of the Gollob involved in something a bit dodgy ? Or was it just an accusation ? And wasn’t there accusations of corruption in speedway as recently as 2017 ?

https://gniezno.naszemiasto.pl/tag/korupcja-zuzel-torun

2018 article.....

https://www.speedwaynews.pl/aktualnosci/item/59084-niechciejstwo-korupcja-alkohol-polski-zuzel-januszami-stoi-komentarz

Also see another scandal has hit Bydgoszcz this year, though nothing to do with speedway

https://bydgoszcz.tvp.pl/46221861/biznesmeni-i-oficerowie-wojska-polskiego-z-bydgoszczy-zatrzymani-mieli-ustawiac-przetargi

Edited February 10, 2020 by iris123

[RobMcCaffery]

4 hours ago, PolskiZuzel said:

To be honest with you, I am getting bored with all these investigations into corruption.

My answer to your question (whether things are better now) is - I don't know.

And when it comes to corruption in speedway... I have not heard of any.

Yes it gets boring when people won't conveniently give up and look the other way.

Regarding the attendance figures that you kindly published they are very revealing. Yes of course Torun's gates have declined. However they are still the envy of any track outside Poland In Britain, and I suspect Sweden the figures would be in collapse, not decline. It does not destroy my argument that attendances are a significant influence on commercial success. If not, why not just let the public in for free? Of course not, despite the TV deals, sponsorship and public subsidy you still need admission income.

 

Mind you I did help run a speedway team a couple of decades agothat only had gate receipts for a couple of meeting all year. The rest of the Rye House revenue in 1999 was entirely through club memberships, sponsorship and programme sales for the matches held as second halves of double-headers at Mildenhall, which were the majority of fixtures.