Leicester NDL 2020

[szkocjasid]

9 hours ago, Sings4Speedway said:

Woodward is definitely a surprise signing, not even the best MSDL rider available on a 3.00 so either right place right time or inside links i suspect, stating 3 practices at Leicester hardly inspires either but it is nice that at least one rider has been promoted despite the best attempts to prevent with the return to the 3.00 rule.

Not sure how the 3.00 rule stops riders stepping up? There's always been newcomers to the league when there was a 3.00 minimum!

[Sidney the robin]

5 hours ago, mac101 said:

Think he has changed a his riding style this year There was no over riding and his racing had greatly improved  having watched him in nearly every nl match this year  him and Ellis perks were pretty unstoppable ther was no daft dive bombing  wreck less passing he used his head more than the throttle think he deserves a spot   

Totally agree Mac you saw more of him  than me but what i saw live and on DVD he certainly has changed racing style  wise.In the Leicester v Belle Vue DVD that i saw the track was very rough and bumpy yet Hume never over rode used his head and the results show that by no injuries.As for the Adam incident yes that was a grave error but what rider does not do that in there career and i have seen plenty of Adam over the years and he has had his get  offs but you learn from that and move on.Even  the great Jason Doyle makes mistakes that is racing split decision making judgements.

[Sidney the robin]

9 hours ago, False dawn said:

An NDL average of 9.09 would suggest otherwise. I know it's a big step up to the Championship but the maths indicate a CL average of around 3.5 should be achievable.

He was averaging about 5.70 at home for Ipswich before his  bad smash at Poole ( engine seized) .And because  he fared pretty well with limited experience that has come back to hurt him  in the last two season's because of his average.

Edited December 30, 2019 by Sidney the robin

[False dawn]

16 minutes ago, Sidney the robin said:

He was averaging about 5.70 at home for Ipswich before his  bad smash at Poole ( engine seized) .And because  he fared pretty well with limited experience that has comeback to hurt him  the last two season's because of his average.

So if he were to land a Championship team place, what average would apply?

edit: The latest I can find is 3.27

Edited December 30, 2019 by False dawn

[mac101]

42 minutes ago, False dawn said:

So if he were to land a Championship team place, what average would apply?

edit: The latest I can find is 3.27

Will also get his Brit nl reduction 

[Sings4Speedway]

13 hours ago, szkocjasid said:

Not sure how the 3.00 rule stops riders stepping up? There's always been newcomers to the league when there was a 3.00 minimum!

There was and will be again however last year there was a glut of newcomers due to the 2.00 ruling. Now it has been returned to 3.00 the number of newcomers has dropped. Largely because there are several riders on 2.xx that are more appealing despite not being able to achieve an average of over 3 from last season.

[screm]

Leicester announce signing of Joe Lawlor.

[PotteringAround]

3 hours ago, Sings4Speedway said:

 last year there was a glut of newcomers due to the 2.00 ruling. Now it has been returned to 3.00 the number of newcomers has dropped.

That's nonsense.   Last year there was a 2.00 rule, but the points limit was slashed right down to 36.00

This year the minimum is 3.00 as normal, and another weakening of the league has seen the points limit slashed down to 39.00   (last year's 36.00 with a 2.00 rule, was the equivalent of 38.00 with the 3.00 rule - So very similar). 

The actual reason there was a glut of newcomers last year is purely due to timing.  You need to follow the Youth Series.  You'd then see that last year we had theThompson twins, Palin, McGurk, Ablitt, Mulford, Kelly etc all turning 15 (plus Gilkes who delayed his start until he was 16).

This year there is a lack of youngsters turning 15.  Probably Sam Hagon is the only one who is ready.

Even if you made the 2020 points limit 37.00 with a 2.00 limit (the same as 39.00 with a 3.00 limit) you couldn't make 15-year-olds magically appear.   They're just not there this year.

[Barrow Boy 2]

7 hours ago, screm said:

Leicester announce signing of Joe Lawlor.

With Lawlor signing I make it 17.25ish  is left to cover 3 riders. If Hume re-signs it will only leave 7.47ish for the remaining 2. 

Edited December 31, 2019 by Barrow Boy 2

[szkocjasid]

36 minutes ago, PotteringAround said:

That's nonsense.   Last year there was a 2.00 rule, but the points limit was slashed right down to 36.00

This year the minimum is 3.00 as normal, and another weakening of the league has seen the points limit slashed down to 39.00   (last year's 36.00 with a 2.00 rule, was the equivalent of 38.00 with the 3.00 rule - So very similar). 

The actual reason there was a glut of newcomers last year is purely due to timing.  You need to follow the Youth Series.  You'd then see that last year we had theThompson twins, Palin, McGurk, Ablitt, Mulford, Kelly etc all turning 15 (plus Gilkes who delayed his start until he was 16).

This year there is a lack of youngsters turning 15.  Probably Sam Hagon is the only one who is ready.

Even if you made the 2020 points limit 37.00 with a 2.00 limit (the same as 39.00 with a 3.00 limit) you couldn't make 15-year-olds magically appear.   They're just not there this year.

Agreed, Palin, Gilkes, Thompson's etc would all have been signed if the minimum was 3.00!

[Sings4Speedway]

36 minutes ago, PotteringAround said:

That's nonsense.   Last year there was a 2.00 rule, but the points limit was slashed right down to 36.00

This year the minimum is 3.00 as normal, and another weakening of the league has seen the points limit slashed down to 39.00   (last year's 36.00 with a 2.00 rule, was the equivalent of 38.00 with the 3.00 rule - So very similar). 

The actual reason there was a glut of newcomers last year is purely due to timing.  You need to follow the Youth Series.  You'd then see that last year we had theThompson twins, Palin, McGurk, Ablitt, Mulford, Kelly etc all turning 15 (plus Gilkes who delayed his start until he was 16).

This year there is a lack of youngsters turning 15.  Probably Sam Hagon is the only one who is ready.

Even if you made the 2020 points limit 37.00 with a 2.00 limit (the same as 39.00 with a 3.00 limit) you couldn't make 15-year-olds magically appear.   They're just not there this year.

Firstly with the increase of 3.00 as the base and the points limit increased to 39 the league has surely been strengthened this year?

You are also correct that there was a crop of talent that was ready to make the breakthrough last season and Thompsons, Palin, Ablitt, Gilkes, Wirtzfeld and likely Kelly would have featured no matter the minimum.  Not sure the same could be said of Rathbone, Spencer, McGurk, King, Bursill, Clouting, Davies, Butcher, Sheppard (again) but some took the chances and other didn't. 

15 year olds aside as age is only reference for eligibility not ability there have been less new faces into the league this year (1 youth & 1 dev league) thus far so as this season stands its hardly a progressive year although there is always time for that to change.

[IronScorpion]

22 hours ago, ProudtobeaBrummie said:

Comments: Stopped. Hume loses control on Bend 3 Lap 1, takes Ellis out and both riders come down. Hume excluded. Ellis unfit for the re-run and Shanes replaces him.
Re-Run: From The Gate.

Comments: Hume, in second, with Ayres at the back when Hume loses it on Bend 2 Lap 3, goes into the fence and Ayres goes into his bike and he too comes down. Both up and OK. Hume excluded. Race Awarded.

These were the comments taken from speedway updates from the last home meeting he was involved with at Birmingham in 2020.From memory these comments are accurate.

Having watched him alot over the past 3 seasons in MY opinion nothing has changed with his riding at all. Maybe it was a case at Birmingham last year that he was to eager to impress. 
 

Who do you think you are? Doctor Who?

It is still 2019! .................. later

[PotteringAround]

1 hour ago, Sings4Speedway said:

Firstly with the increase of 3.00 as the base and the points limit increased to 39 the league has surely been strengthened this year?

 

No.  It's been massively weakened again. 

Regardless of rider ability, there are always 6 points available in a race, and 90 points available in a match.   Therefore at the end of season a league will always tend towards a 42 points average. 

Setting a points limit below 42 for the following year will weaken a league.     (The only exception being where the number of teams in the league is increasing the following year, and the limit has to be dropped to facilitate staffing new teams - This still actually weakens the league, but keeps the standard even).  

You are also correct that there was a crop of talent that was ready to make the breakthrough last season and Thompsons, Palin, Ablitt, Gilkes, Wirtzfeld and likely Kelly would have featured no matter the minimum.  Not sure the same could be said of Rathbone, Spencer, McGurk, King, Bursill, Clouting, Davies, Butcher, Sheppard (again) but some took the chances and other didn't.

Don't understand your point here.   All the new eligible riders last year (Thompson, Thompson, Palin, McGurk, Ablitt, Wirtzfeld, Mulford, Kelly, Gilkes) got team places last year.   All the new eligible riders this year (Hagon) will get places this year.     The only difference is that there were a lot of new riders becoming eligible for NL last year.    There are hardly any new riders eligible this year.   Set the newcomers average at 2.00, 3.00 or whatever you want, you still can make them appear from thin air.

 

 

[Sings4Speedway]

21 minutes ago, PotteringAround said:

No.  It's been massively weakened again. 

Regardless of rider ability, there are always 6 points available in a race, and 90 points available in a match.   Therefore at the end of season a league will always tend towards a 42 points average. 

Setting a points limit below 42 for the following year will weaken a league.     (The only exception being where the number of teams in the league is increasing the following year, and the limit has to be dropped to facilitate staffing new teams - This still actually weakens the league, but keeps the standard even).  

 

 

Don't understand your point here.   All the new eligible riders last year (Thompson, Thompson, Palin, McGurk, Ablitt, Wirtzfeld, Mulford, Kelly, Gilkes) got team places last year.   All the new eligible riders this year (Hagon) will get places this year.     The only difference is that there were a lot of new riders becoming eligible for NL last year.    There are hardly any new riders eligible this year.   Set the newcomers average at 2.00, 3.00 or whatever you want, you still can make them appear from thin air.

 

 

Its not been weakened again it has continued to stay at the previously set weakened level. You are correct that setting below the 42 limit artificially inflates averages (although this should then force the top riders up/out).

I think you are ignoring the fact that not all newcomers are appearing from the youth ranks i suspect that if the entry limit remained at 2.00 many clubs would have used the minimum points required on the reserve berths to make stronger top 5's (only got to look how CL sides have bee built) its just a little ironic that riders who started last year on 2.00 and failed to achieve over 3.00 are now the desirable riders this year despite not being able to increase their averages.  

[False dawn]

9 minutes ago, Sings4Speedway said:

....... its just a little ironic that riders who started last year on 2.00 and failed to achieve over 3.00 are now the desirable riders this year despite not being able to increase their averages.  

Just a thought. Do we think, as fans, that one season of proper league racing is long enough to prove anything about a rider and his/her future potential?

[Chris116]

19 minutes ago, False dawn said:

Just a thought. Do we think, as fans, that one season of proper league racing is long enough to prove anything about a rider and his/her future potential?

In my opinion it has been shown time and again that one season proves nothing. Riders can take one season or five seasons to make the grade and move up the leagues. 

[Sings4Speedway]

5 hours ago, False dawn said:

Just a thought. Do we think, as fans, that one season of proper league racing is long enough to prove anything about a rider and his/her future potential?

I think that after one season a decent indication can be given even if its the levels of improvement required. I would imagine every rider will tell you the first season is the hardest / learnt the most from whatever the level

[mac101]

1 hour ago, Sings4Speedway said:

I think that after one season a decent indication can be given even if its the levels of improvement required. I would imagine every rider will tell you the first season is the hardest / learnt the most from whatever the level

I remember watching Charles Wright when he was a reserve at Glasgow many years ago  he was woeful and never got any better  for a good few years He really struggled then he just clicked a few years ago and look at him now nobody would believe you  2 years ago if you said he would be British riders champion speedway is a sport that fxxks your head and once you get it into your head that you can beat anybody you will then go from strength to strength so I would never right anybody off these days 

[False dawn]

The real trick is to have enough money to sustain your learning period, how ever long that might be. The entry costs are astronomical and your earnings potential minuscule in those formative years.

[phillwhitewasmad]

10 hours ago, False dawn said:

The real trick is to have enough money to sustain your learning period, how ever long that might be. The entry costs are astronomical and your earnings potential minuscule in those formative years.

That’s spot on we have a 12 year old who rides and have already come to the conclusion that we will have to fund his hobby until he is in his early 20s should he wish to peruse a career in speedway.