Humphrey Appleby Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 7 hours ago, PHILIPRISING said: NO doubt we would all like to see SGPs in Auckland, Copenhagen, Melbourne, Stockholm, etc but the fact is that these venues are simply not viable. Imagine if Tony Rickardsson, Erik Gundersen, Hans Nielsen, Jason Crump, Leigh Adams and their ilk were still riding. Most of those riders were riding when the GP was held in similar stadiums to what it is now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humphrey Appleby Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 11 hours ago, PHILIPRISING said: As far as the SON is concerned, understand why the FIM wanted to broaden the number of participating countries in the finals stages, an incentive for young riders in the lesser nations to ride on the top stage. My real beef is with the name ... just call it the Speedway World Cup. A glorified best pairs competition is not really a World Cup though, is it? Would FIFA turn the Football World Cup into a Wembley Doubles tournament on the above basis? I think the SON format is far more a money saving exercise and to disguise the increasing lack of interest in hosting and participating it. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humphrey Appleby Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 11 hours ago, davidncohen said: BSI's own original remit was taking it to new places, but they haven't really done this, and where they have tried, it's not worked very well. Their remit was to ensure cash kept coming into the FIM to cover the prize money with a bit leftover, and to make a profit for themselves. That strategy relied on persuading enough promoters and tourist agencies to pay them for the privilege of holding a GP, whilst ensuring the sport got on television to attract sponsors. Perhaps in the early days there was some optimism that enough interest could be generated to take the SGP to bigger venues and new countries, but for various reasons the original incarnation of BSI seems to have out of capitalisation, whilst IMG(UK) made some poor investments in other areas and ended-up having to cut their cloth. I don't think the marketing of the SGP has been brilliant down the years, although I do think speedway is a hard sell to both television and sponsors nowadays. Too niche, too geographically restricted, and a difficult fan demographic. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waiheke1 Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 1 hour ago, Humphrey Appleby said: Most of those riders were riding when the GP was held in similar stadiums to what it is now. agreed. they would make zero difference to attendance in Auckland, and I suspect close to nil in Melbourne. tbh even as a speedway fan, Gundersen and Nielsen would be no bigger draw cards for me than Woffy and Zmarzlik. As for these changes, what a load of crap. Having got rid of the SWC, arguably the best event of the year, now seems they want to stuff up the GPs as well... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Central Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 (edited) 8 hours ago, PHILIPRISING said: NO doubt we would all like to see SGPs in Auckland, Copenhagen, Melbourne, Stockholm, etc but the fact is that these venues are simply not viable. Imagine if Tony Rickardsson, Erik Gundersen, Hans Nielsen, Jason Crump, Leigh Adams and their ilk were still riding. Bums on seats would not be an issue. Poland have overcome the loss of Tomasz Gollob not least because speedway in northern Poland at least is so high profile. Whether it is BSI/IMG or Discovery/Eurosport who are the custodians of the World Championship going forward run 2022, new venues will remain a problem. What a bizarre comment ... Four riders who quite demonstrably couldn't 'put bums on SGP seats' any better than the 2019 guys. Edited November 5, 2019 by Grand Central 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iris123 Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Humphrey Appleby said: Not really. The Gulf countries are trying to diversify their oil-dependent economies by attracting tourists, wealthy tax exiles, and sponsors who might invest in other sectors, but they're after the high-spending types and/or those with something invest. Speedway's audience sadly doesn't tick any of those boxes, is small and even worse is confined to a handful of countries rather than being global. I'd be amazed if hosting a speedway GP hasn't been investigated in some of these countries, but the rulers of these places aren't completely stupid. Handball is hardly high profile, nor attracts high spending fans from what I have seen and also centered around a small number of countries It is though fairly inexpensive and easy to introduce and obviously there were a good number of players willing to change their nationality. And probably unlike in speedway with a couple of years experience and training a few locals were in the National team Edited November 5, 2019 by iris123 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humphrey Appleby Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 8 minutes ago, iris123 said: Handball is hardly high profile, nor attracts high spending fans from what I have seen and also centered around a small number of countries For wherever reason, Qatar apparently picked upon handball as a way to win something at the Olympics - a bit like Britain did with track cycling and skeleton. Speedway isn't an Olympic sport, not a mass participatory sport, and sadly winning something in it wouldn't even get noticed by most of the world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IainB Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 17 hours ago, falcace said: I'd love to know what work has been done in these areas. Of course, it's very easy for me and others to say "they should be doing this and that" and there may well be perfectly good reasons why the SGP hasn't broken new markets. I don't doubt some efforts have been made. But on the face of it, I would think a place like Qatar where they don't mind losing money on sports events and have a herd of white elephant stadiums-to-be hosting the 2022 World Cup would be an obvious port of call. Ditto, somewhere like Majorca or Malaga; very reachable for all budget airlines and in a country where the locals like bike racing, decent football stadiums that might be convertable? Surely worth a go?Or Ireland? There's an established scene of bike racing and an international series like the SGP could be welcomed. Who wouldn't fancy a Dublin GP? Or can we even piggy back on the Superbike or MotoGP calendar and offer a Saturday night SGP in the same city as the Sunday's road racing? Happy to shot down on all these of course, but it would be good to know that all avenues are being explored. Didn't Prince Albert () attend the first Cardiff GP with a view of holding one in Monaco? Obviously never happened. How about a GP on the Isle of Man during TT Week? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILIPRISING Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 1 hour ago, waiheke1 said: agreed. they would make zero difference to attendance in Auckland, and I suspect close to nil in Melbourne. tbh even as a speedway fan, Gundersen and Nielsen would be no bigger draw cards for me than Woffy and Zmarzlik. As for these changes, what a load of crap. Having got rid of the SWC, arguably the best event of the year, now seems they want to stuff up the GPs as well... WOFFY and Zmarzlik are not the draw cards in Copenhagen that Gundersen and Nielsen would have been. Melbourne would have benefitted massively from Adams and Crump. Similarly Rickardsson in Stockholm. That is my point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Central Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 25 minutes ago, PHILIPRISING said: WOFFY and Zmarzlik are not the draw cards in Copenhagen that Gundersen and Nielsen would have been. Melbourne would have benefitted massively from Adams and Crump. Similarly Rickardsson in Stockholm. That is my point. Good God .... That would have been in 1988 or 1989 !! Get a grip ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILIPRISING Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 3 minutes ago, Grand Central said: Good God .... That would have been in 1988 or 1989 !! Get a grip ! WE are on different wavelengths. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Central Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 (edited) To even mention Erik and Hans now though is so backward looking ... We are thirty years beyond ANY relevance that would be helpful in decisions or understanding. In Speedway terms or the rest of society. Despite being closer to 60 than 50 myself I can appreciate that it is just this sort of 'harking back' to pre-history by oldies that must drive anyone born post 1990 absolutely bonkers. And make them switch right off from listening to us on many issues of TODAY. Edited November 5, 2019 by Grand Central Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sommelier Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 5 minutes ago, Grand Central said: To even mention Erik and Hans now though is so backward looking ... We are thirty years beyond ANY relevance that would be helpful in decisions or understanding. In Speedway terms or the rest of society. Despite being closer to 60 than 50 myself I can appreciate that it is just this sort of 'harking back' to pre-history by oldies that must drive anyone born post 1990 absolutely bonkers. And make them switch right off from listening to us. I think you are completely missing the point Philip is trying to get across, no brainer really!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HenryW Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 14 hours ago, racers and royals said: Lets not forget that BSI/IMG are right in the middle of a tender process for a further 10 years from 2022, so maybe the FIM wanted it and they said yes sir, great idea. A stupid idea coming from Castagna does seen a possibility I wonder if IMG are also changing the points system in the Rallycross World Championship. It's probably the closest to speedway of other motorsports (heats and then semi and final for top scorers in the heats) and it has a scoring system that can also see the winner of the round score less World Championship points than others. If that's staying the same we can probably assume that it's not IMG that had issue with the scoring system 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 I like the idea of new faces in the GP series but only if they have more talent than the riders they will replace. The new system may not see this happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iris123 Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 (edited) 5 hours ago, Humphrey Appleby said: For wherever reason, Qatar apparently picked upon handball as a way to win something at the Olympics - a bit like Britain did with track cycling and skeleton. Speedway isn't an Olympic sport, not a mass participatory sport, and sadly winning something in it wouldn't even get noticed by most of the world. Also hosted the world championships...plus we have had a few ventures in the region. Briggo and Mauger took the sport over and I think a decade or so later there was also a meeting or two. Edited November 5, 2019 by iris123 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RPNY Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 The points changing doesn't really bother me. It's pretty much the same as 1996 and that went down to the last race of the entire series. The qualification is a little worrying. If anything should be 5 from GP Challenge and 3 wildcards. But again I definitely think track/stadia is the bigger issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iris123 Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 (edited) Again I have to disagree on the Challenge. Not sure what a look back at the top 5 over the past decade would give. But like to bet there would be. few names that would be well out of their depth in for a whole season !!! Just because I remember watching Lubos Tomicek almost qualifying Edited November 5, 2019 by iris123 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mj82 Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 25 points for a gp win and everyone else keeps the the points they actually scored in the gp. To me this would of been better. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RPNY Posted November 5, 2019 Report Share Posted November 5, 2019 17 minutes ago, iris123 said: Again I have to disagree on the Challenge. Not sure what a look back at the top 5 over the past decade would give. But like to bet there would be. few names that would be well out of their depth in for a whole season !!! Just because I remember watching Lubos Tomicek almost qualifying I hear you. But at the same time its unfair there is only 3 spots. I think the Challenge should be 7-14 in series then qualifiers. Top 5 from that would be decent (hopefully!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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