Lions v Glasgow 17th August

[topsoil]

49 minutes ago, cityrebel said:

The worrying thing is, the promoters never learn from their previous mistakes. The sport is crying out for some professional people to run it.

Therein lies part of the problem, promoters are not professional people. In the vast majority of cases, they are local businessmen who happen to be speedway fans. They don't have the time or money to invest in speedway full time.

[IainB]

46 minutes ago, topsoil said:

Therein lies part of the problem, promoters are not professional people. In the vast majority of cases, they are local businessmen who happen to be speedway fans. They don't have the time or money to invest in speedway full time.

I've seen a number of promoters at various tracks and a lot of the time they don't even seem to be interested in the actual racing. I've seen Bates and DH wandering around the terraces at Leicester and not even stop to watch the racing... you've got to wonder why they do it

[cityrebel]

16 minutes ago, iainb said:

I've seen a number of promoters at various tracks and a lot of the time they don't even seem to be interested in the actual racing. I've seen Bates and DH wandering around the terraces at Leicester and not even stop to watch the racing... you've got to wonder why they do it

It can't be for the money!

[flagrag]

IainB-To answer a couple of your questions the NL riders are not allowed to warm up in the car park due to council regulations about noise and environmental controls. There was two distinct similarities between last night and the Redcar meeting both involved medical incidents where riders were unconscious for a long period of time which automatically required a hospital trip for X ray and CT scans due to the length they were unconscious for and also had other symptoms.

Last night the the county ambulance turned up very quickly but still took a long amount of time to get the rider off to hospital. Even if there had been two ambulances and paramedics  there would still have been a lengthy delay until Spencer was stable, so yes racing could have started again but would not have been completed. 

There is also the extra cost of having 2 paramedics on duty does any Lions fans know any registered Paramedics or DRs that they would want to help out ? In these situations the question was asked before but no response 

[topsoil]

7 hours ago, iainb said:

I've seen a number of promoters at various tracks and a lot of the time they don't even seem to be interested in the actual racing. I've seen Bates and DH wandering around the terraces at Leicester and not even stop to watch the racing... you've got to wonder why they do it

Busy doing other duties? Maybe don't have time to watch the racing?

[justathought]

I understand what you have pointed out. But, this is supposed to be a professional sport that is run for profit. Not a bunch of keen enthusiasts who make do. There must be away to prevent this sort of thing happening because it is basically making a lot of regular spectators think twice about attending .

Regarding getting the national league teams in for the 2nd match. What about when we staged the fours meeting. Far more riders and bikes and that worked. 

 

[IainB]

13 hours ago, flagrag said:

IainB-To answer a couple of your questions the NL riders are not allowed to warm up in the car park due to council regulations about noise and environmental controls. There was two distinct similarities between last night and the Redcar meeting both involved medical incidents where riders were unconscious for a long period of time which automatically required a hospital trip for X ray and CT scans due to the length they were unconscious for and also had other symptoms.

Last night the the county ambulance turned up very quickly but still took a long amount of time to get the rider off to hospital. Even if there had been two ambulances and paramedics  there would still have been a lengthy delay until Spencer was stable, so yes racing could have started again but would not have been completed. 

There is also the extra cost of having 2 paramedics on duty does any Lions fans know any registered Paramedics or DRs that they would want to help out ? In these situations the question was asked before but no response 

flagrag- Thanks for the info, you're a lot more informative than the club sometimes. If that is the case about clearing the pits and warming the bikes up, why did it still take nigh on 45 minutes? There should have only been 8 riders in the pits by heat 15 anyway, the 4 that were in it and 2 reserves for each team. This means that for Leicester to run a double header, at the pace they run meetings, it's going to take around 4 and a quarter hours, as I've already said a lot of fans only have a 3 and a half hour window with the parking. At least I now know that a double header is not feasible for me to attend.

As for the inadequate medical cover, again, treatment for a fallen rider on the track is of course acceptable and expected, what is not acceptable is for there to be inadequate medical cover once the rider has been removed from the track for the meeting to continue.

Anyway, do we know how the lad is? I can't find any news on him anywhere

Edited August 19, 2019 by iainb

[Lenny Lion]

There is a-lot of complaints about the speed of the lions meetings when they “try” to run a double header & the gaps between the meetings.

The speed of the meeting is down to the referee & IMO its no coincidence that for both double headers its been the same referee Barbara Horley who is known to run meetings at a slow pace & from what i was told insisted on the track being relaid & prepared as if it was a standalone meeting which is why it took so long.

[IainB]

5 minutes ago, Lenny Lion said:

The speed of the meeting is down to the referee & IMO its no coincidence that for both double headers its been the same referee Barbara Horley who is known to run meetings at a slow pace & from what i was told insisted on the track being relaid & prepared as if it was a standalone meeting which is why it took so long.

I also go to Peterborough quite often, for a fix of proper Speedway, and this year their meetings have always run at the same pace and from a 7:30 start, I've usually been away by 9pm. Has that just been co-incidence that all the different refs have kept to the same time scheduling, putting the 2 minute warning on as soon as the riders from the previous race have cleared the track... or maybe it's just been the same ref at all of the meetings?

... And it was a different ref for the 2nd meeting at Leicester on Saturday evening

[Big Al]

When Tom Spencer lay on the track and didn't move, it was obviously a serious and worrying situation but it was reassuring that he seemed able, eventually, to get into the ambulance with some assistance. I went to the loo as soon as the ambulance had left the track, and returned to the sight of a tractor going around, so immediately decided that was enough and left. So I don't know what announcements were made if any to explain what the situation was.

But the whole episode has shown that attempting to start a second match at 8.30, especially an NDL match is not a good idea, especially as I think these matches are sadly more prone to long delays due to accidents. And of course that inadvisability includes the possibility that substantial track remedial work will be necessary in order to produce as safe a racetrack as possible for these inexpreienced riders. It was therefore ironic and annoying that, after the lengthy work done following the Glasgow match, the first heat of Cubs v Cradley revealed a lethal fault on the racing line on bend 3 which required yet more time to fix.

And if the availability of additional medical cover is problematic when attempting to stage a double header, for whatever reasons whether that is cost or availability, then it's a no-brainer to just not attempt it in the first place.

 

 

[mac101]

Think it is really hard to get a second ambulance because it's a Saturday night  the busiest night of the week for them I think they called for one and was over a hour before it could get there maybe they should have not bothered to full grade the track after Ht 15  and kept it slick for the unexperenced riders 

[Sings4Speedway]

There is always a danger when trying to rescue a slick track that dragging dirt over the holes etc means that you have a marble-y surface with hidden dangers underneath. Sadly meetings like this cause the NL no end of harm as the product on show does not reflect what can actually be served up. In reality this should have been run the other way round with the NL match starting first (and earlier) as the track damage would be lesser and then the big names could have ridden the track later in the day with their superior abilities.

That way Leicester could have charged the double header rate until X time/heats of the NL match and then the regular rate for those who just wanted to view the higher tier.

Edited August 19, 2019 by Sings4Speedway

[Gemini]

Even with a good track to ride on it's usually the case that N.L. riders are more prone to falling as they are not so experienced so what would happen if it had been the other way around on Saturday and we were hanging around for ages waiting for the match to eventually finish before the more important Lions v Glasgow one could start?  And yes I have watched loads of N.L. matches going back to the Cougars and The Storm at Coventry and the Bees riding at Leicester. 

Edited August 19, 2019 by Gemini

[Big Al]

5 hours ago, Gemini said:

Even with a good track to ride on it's usually the case that N.L. riders are more prone to falling as they are not so experienced so what would happen if it had been the other way around on Saturday and we were hanging around for ages waiting for the match to eventually finish before the more important Lions v Glasgow one could start?  And yes I have watched loads of N.L. matches going back to the Cougars and The Storm at Coventry and the Bees riding at Leicester. 

Maybe NL matches should not be over15 heats anyway, perhaps 12 heats is enough with, if time and circumstances allows, a couple of additional races for the highest scorers with points earned accumulating over the season to an individual award? If the extra heats don't take place, it's a shame but it doesn't mess up the match result. Also it's ridiculous that Leicester, for example, can use r/r at this level for almost the full season. This is another delayer to matches and it should only be allowed in limited circumstances.

[Sings4Speedway]

11 hours ago, Big Al said:

Maybe NL matches should not be over15 heats anyway, perhaps 12 heats is enough with, if time and circumstances allows, a couple of additional races for the highest scorers with points earned accumulating over the season to an individual award? If the extra heats don't take place, it's a shame but it doesn't mess up the match result. Also it's ridiculous that Leicester, for example, can use r/r at this level for almost the full season. This is another delayer to matches and it should only be allowed in limited circumstances.

Been banging that second point for years. RR is the durge of a good meeting. Allow it for emergencies but the rest its guests to allow experience. 

Definitely don't agree with cutting the length of a match though, spectators want more value for money not less.  

[Happy Hunter]

According to this week's Speedway Star no more double headers at Leicester. Cubs to ride midweek to clear fixture backlog.