HGould Posted May 31, 2019 Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 very illuminating admission on inside cover of Speedway Star. claims Poole lost a 5 figure sum in matches v Ipswich says Top Riders will never return to British Speedway suggests that One League is perhaps best way, I assume pay rates would be nearer to Championship, he quotes success of Eastbourne in that League. Question is, if 1 League delivered enough matches to sustain riders pay needs (40 matches??) 20 home and 20 away for instance, would pay rates mean Clubs were put out of business or would it put too many riders out of the sport, would there be enough riders? Is he (Ford) just marketing or is this a serious suggestion? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Shovlar Posted May 31, 2019 Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 Been touted by Gary May as well. Said Somerset would definitely prefer one league. The downside is riders like the top riders Doyle would be lost. Can you imagine the remaining top guys wanting to turn up at the more remote tracks? The quality would probably sit somewhere a bit better than the current championship level. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronScorpion Posted May 31, 2019 Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 I think you would lose a lot more top riders than Doyle as the likes of Lambert would be too good for British Speedway, probably trying to get spots in 3 European leagues. Also, having a lot of riders doubling leagues, would we not need more NL riders to make up numbers or go to 6 man teams. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grachan Posted May 31, 2019 Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 35 minutes ago, Steve Shovlar said: Been touted by Gary May as well. Said Somerset would definitely prefer one league. The downside is riders like the top riders Doyle would be lost. Can you imagine the remaining top guys wanting to turn up at the more remote tracks? The quality would probably sit somewhere a bit better than the current championship level. I don't see why they would need to be lost. If they wanted to ride here they could be fitted in if the maximum converted average was set to 12.00 and averages set at Championship level. If the current standard of rider could be maintained I'd be all for it, and, with so much doubling up nowadays, I think they could. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iris123 Posted May 31, 2019 Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 Wouldn’t one league raise the amount of meetings per season? And that would be the reason I suspect that top riders would drop out. I mean the likes of Bech, Michelsen or such like are hardly top names but have gone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post ch958 Posted May 31, 2019 Popular Post Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 this is definitely the way forward. And we need to stop worrying about riders' earnings - they can only earn what can be afforded to pay them. So what if big names are lost- generally i find the lower down the leagues the more interesting the racing anyway. Don't worry about shortages of riders - they said that in '68 and '69 about Div 2 and lo and behold there was plenty - quite a few of whom went on to be top internationals. 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Steve Shovlar Posted May 31, 2019 Popular Post Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 If it was mandatory that reserves had to be British u21s, that would be a great step forward. It was disgraceful that it was dropped a couple of seasons ago. Bring on our own talent. We will benefit in the long term. 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve roberts Posted May 31, 2019 Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 34 minutes ago, Steve Shovlar said: If it was mandatory that reserves had to be British u21s, that would be a great step forward. It was disgraceful that it was dropped a couple of seasons ago. Bring on our own talent. We will benefit in the long term. Certainly needs serious consideration. There needs to be a structure in place that encourages British talent with appropriate training schools run professionally. I recall that Jan O.Pedersen was earmarked to run such a scheme some years back but it was met with apathy by the authorities and hence the continual slide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted May 31, 2019 Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 (edited) At last... Sounds like some realisation and common sense has arrived.. Put out five man teams.. Grade the riders 1-5.. Grade five being young British riders or oldies but new to the sport. Have a maximum team average based on adding the mean average of every one of the five grades. Meaning no one can pick the best rider from each grade.. Run on nights you get your best crowds, with riders only getting contracts if they agree to be at every meeting. Only run on FIM nights when there are no riders impacted by the FIM meeting And have a maximum team payroll of £4500. 45 points at an average of £100 per point. Top riders £150 down to £50 for number fives.. That will mean it will cost circa £9k to pay for two matches from your home meeting.. £15 to get in, and just 800 punters would bring £12000.. Got to be do able 800 surely? And if you bring more in, performance pay the riders more. Let them be in charge of their own pay destiny.. Kids up to 18 free if in education.. And no g****s.. (wishful thinking). Lots of variety of teams.. More local ish derbies.. Lots of different riders only turning up once so, if decent, you won't get to see then again so you have to go.. Affordable to fans, on nights they want to watch, young fans in for free to help the future and credibility.. Come on Matt, you know it makes sense..!! Edited May 31, 2019 by mikebv 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moxey63 Posted May 31, 2019 Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 (edited) It would create more variety. But, as someone mentioned, certain riders would be put off by the increase of meetings, the same riders I bet who say they ride in Poland and Sweden because there aren't sufficient meetings over here. The set-up would have to be what all clubs could afford, perhaps on second division level of pay. Perhaps replace riders who refuse to race the extra meetings with hungrier ones who perhaps would never get a chance, from the lesser countries. More meetings would hopefully cut the need for riders to flit to and fro other countries. This would hopefully reignite the meaning of a proper team sport and not freelancers. British speedway doesn't rule the waves any longer, so we have to sort of begin from scratch and rebuild. Even have money-spinning meetings every so often during the season and invite big stars to race. Edited May 31, 2019 by moxey63 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityrebel Posted May 31, 2019 Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 It has to be a two league set up next season for the sport to survive. A championship level top flight and the NDL to develop the british talent to feed the top league. No one wants to see a reduction in standards, but what other options are there. When the likes of Poole are hemorrhaging money, the games up. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moxey63 Posted May 31, 2019 Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 (edited) What Mr Ford did mention was supporters getting used to success and that sometimes it's best to give them second place and leave them wanting more. At a time when league speedway is set-up for a win at all costs, perhaps we may revert to a time when supporters were interested in watching their team, their riders, no matter how good, and that winning isn't the be all and end all. Edited June 1, 2019 by moxey63 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midland Red Posted May 31, 2019 Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 13 minutes ago, cityrebel said: It has to be a two league set up next season for the sport to survive. A championship level top flight and the NDL to develop the british talent to feed the top league. No one wants to see a reduction in standards, but what other options are there. When the likes of Poole are hemorrhaging money, the games up. I think in essence the term "one league" refers to the "top flight", with room for a development league as well Similar to when the NL and PL amalgamated into the British League in the 60s, there was still room for a Div 2 development league 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenga Posted May 31, 2019 Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 and when the riders who have already qualified for the GP season have to qualify the day before the GP for gate start positions . just pull the draw out of a velvet bag with hand warm balls the day/week before . save shaed loads of money , sheds loads of time . no mechs having to strip down bikes for proper racing the following day . no riders passing the cost onto the paying public and no huge stadium rent to pay . speedway is struggling big time ATM . so lets try and save it f.f.s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chadster Posted May 31, 2019 Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 I'm a little puzzled by the timing of this. If you'd asked me a year ago, I'd have said that the logic underpinning the BSPA's actions over the previous decade had been to reduce the gap between the 2 leagues so as to make one big league possible, but last winter the decisions taken seemed more likely to widen the gap, making a big league less likely. I know I used logic and BSPA in the same sentence there..... To make it viable, you'd need 18 teams at least in a big league, so 34 league meetings, 2 (minimum) in cups and some meaningful regional competitions. Individual meetings become more attractive because you're not seeing the same old riders every week. I'd always thought Matt Ford was a convinced top league man, so maybe there's a significant shift in attitudes developing. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Shovlar Posted May 31, 2019 Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 Absolutely no way would I support 5 man teams. Has to be 7 man teams with the points limit set between championship and premiership. A second league for the lesser championship teams who can expand the national development league. The problem is finding extra riders. Currently there are not enough to go between the two league without doubling up.Using young NL British riders will help. Sure, some will be out of their depth while others will thrive. Polish Extra league has u21 6 and 7 regardless of ability who stay there even if they are world champion. We should take the same mentality. Seven teams is no good. Not enough variety or meetings. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted May 31, 2019 Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 4 hours ago, IronScorpion said: I think you would lose a lot more top riders than Doyle as the likes of Lambert would be too good for British Speedway, probably trying to get spots in 3 European leagues. Also, having a lot of riders doubling leagues, would we not need more NL riders to make up numbers or go to 6 man teams. It needs to cut its cloth accordingly... Domestic Speedway in Britain is a world away from Poland, the GP's and even Sweden.. So plough its own furrow.. At whatever standard.. I've said before, look at the BSB model against the WSB model.. British Superbikes don't try and compete with their more well renowned 'big brother'... Instead they have a very successful competition based on mainly 'decent' UK riders supplemented by riders who have tried the WSB or MotoGp and just came up short.. They augment this by having other competitions aimed at youth development, to ensure when their best move up to WSB, they have replacements ready.. If the likes of Lambert, Doyle etc cannot meet the demands of riding several times per week due to extensive oversees commitments, sometimes at weekend if the clubs require it, then they can move their careers forward elsewhere against riders of a similar level.. If someone of the calibre of Matt Ford is coming out with these type of comments and ideas, then I would suggest Speedway is pretty much being moved from the High Dependancy Unit into the Critical Ward.. Drastic times therefore means drastic measures... And if the patient cannot be revived in the Critical Ward, then no one will be earning any money over here anyway.. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted May 31, 2019 Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 21 minutes ago, Steve Shovlar said: Absolutely no way would I support 5 man teams. Has to be 7 man teams with the points limit set between championship and premiership. A second league for the lesser championship teams who can expand the national development league. The problem is finding extra riders. Currently there are not enough to go between the two league without doubling up.Using young NL British riders will help. Sure, some will be out of their depth while others will thrive. Polish Extra league has u21 6 and 7 regardless of ability who stay there even if they are world champion. We should take the same mentality. Seven teams is no good. Not enough variety or meetings. Five man teams will cut wages (by four per match) and hopefully mean more supply than demand which will reduce costs.. And also meaning credibility as more 'subs on the bench' to replace injured riders, rather than using guests... And hopefully mean many more clubs than at present can put together teams at a similar level. Not ideal by any stretch but we heading for the last chance saloon I would say.. It might even need a 'supremo' or 'supreme committee' to start with a blank piece of paper and map out 18 or so 'even teams' (90 riders) and use rider control to deliver it.. If Matt Ford is losing over £10k in two matches what exactly are these lads earning? As I presume 'takings' (without sponsorship) were around £18k - £20k or so for the home leg if around 1000 were there.. Whatever they earn, it must be well out of kilter with the standing of such a miniscule sport (in Britain), for Poole to lose over £10k. Something has to give. And radically.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambo Posted May 31, 2019 Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 9 minutes ago, mikebv said: Five man teams will cut wages (by four per match) and hopefully mean more supply than demand which will reduce costs.. And also meaning credibility as more 'subs on the bench' to replace injured riders, rather than using guests... And hopefully mean many more clubs than at present can put together teams at a similar level. Not ideal by any stretch but we heading for the last chance saloon I would say.. It might even need a 'supremo' or 'supreme committee' to start with a blank piece of paper and map out 18 or so 'even teams' (90 riders) and use rider control to deliver it.. If Matt Ford is losing over £10k in two matches what exactly are these lads earning? As I presume 'takings' (without sponsorship) were around £18k - £20k or so for the home leg if around 1000 were there.. Whatever they earn, it must be well out of kilter with the standing of such a miniscule sport (in Britain), for Poole to lose over £10k. Something has to give. And radically.. Meeting costs are not affected by the number of riders (apart from travel money). It's the number of heats and therefore points that determine the outlay. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orion Posted May 31, 2019 Report Share Posted May 31, 2019 Here we go again lets cut the standard ..When will speedway ever learn . Year 30 of the same plan 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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