Derwent Park..update on Town RL forum

[geoff100]

58 minutes ago, jenga said:

so where in Derwent park will they be situated , car park , back of tescoes  , because they cant put them in the town (rugby ) building  or are they building new ones @ DP or portacabins on the new k100,000 pitch .?

 

the new offices are to be @ the new stadium?  

Part of the deal for the new stadium was sellafield bought the land derwent park stands on dear old ian and tom mitchell are curently spinning at 78 rpm.

[jenga]

1 hour ago, geoff100 said:

Part of the deal for the new stadium was sellafield bought the land derwent park stands on dear old ian and tom mitchell are curently spinning at 78 rpm.

good olde fashioned back handers . who would have though such a notion would have even entered the supreme councils mind !

[SteelShoe]

3 hours ago, Lord Lucan said:

Just shows the folly of all of this?

Allerdale spending hundreds of thousands in taxpayers cash to reseed DP in order to bring it up to standard for both football and rugby, exactly the same job will be done on the new stadium, if and when it gets the go ahead, millions to be spent on the project in general which begs the question...

if Allerdale had just spent a "few" million bringing "both" existing grounds up to an acceptable standard then the speedway track could easily have been retained and kept for future re use when required, instead, they chose to build one new stadium for two crap outfits and condemn the most successful sport we had into the realms of obscurity?

I was told that, during the recent local election canvassing, that both grounds had a finite lifespan (within 5yrs) in their present condition which would have seen the H&S executive declare both to be unfit for public use therefore the new stadium was essential for the survival of both Reds and Town, I asked about the Comets and why they were not included in this and he replied, with a cheap smile on his face that, DP was there for them to use but she (Laura) had no money to invest so....goodnight Vienna?

Cant see anyone crazy enough now to try and bring speedway back in the context of having to find a completely new home/track/team/support services/access etc for possibly a couple of seasons depending on the level of support as it's just not now looking a viable proposition, with DP still on the cards then yes, a chance but, in my opinion, not even a slim one especially on viewing those pix of the current state of affairs?

Happy memories from the Comets, we just wont be making any more of those!!

What you say about the lifespan of both is probably on the money. The age of these stadia 1937 Reds; 1950 Town without adequate maintenance means replacement is long overdue so replacement is probably the right option at this time but they need to make provision for speedway somewhere regardless of whether or not the previous promotion have the necessary finance. Its only right in my eyes that they make it attractive for any potentially interested parties who have the vision and determination to bring the Comets back.  

[Lord Lucan]

2 hours ago, SteelShoe said:

What you say about the lifespan of both is probably on the money. The age of these stadia 1937 Reds; 1950 Town without adequate maintenance means replacement is long overdue so replacement is probably the right option at this time but they need to make provision for speedway somewhere regardless of whether or not the previous promotion have the necessary finance. Its only right in my eyes that they make it attractive for any potentially interested parties who have the vision and determination to bring the Comets back.  

Timespan is correct SS, within 5yrs, straight from an as then Labour councillor? 

Agreed provision should have been made for the Comets, there could quite easily have been other interested parties waiting in the wings but hey, we'll probably never know or, if there were already, were they advised to "step aside" and allow this new stadium to go ahead with the proviso of help towards something else for the Comets then just quietly forgotten about, who knows?

I admire your optimism but I don't think the Comets will be back, gone out with a bang tho so at least that's something we've got to be proud of!! 

[comet49]

No matter how much football clubs are struggling not many actually fold. Speedway just doesn’t have the wider interest, we’ve had speedway recently because both Keith and Laura were fans. It was rumoured after KD that Moss Bay Metals were taking over, they soon denied it. A consortium of fans or a fan winning the lottery, as THJ said is needed. Invest in speedway, lose money...unless something drastic happens to change it. 

[SteelShoe]

I doubt anyone 'invests ' in speedway comet49. The days when promoters may have been confident of making some money seem to have gone at present, hopefully this will change because it would increase the number of potential people who would be willing to take a chance.  I think a lot of people who are in a position to put money into sports clubs do so because they are fans doesn't necessarily mean that they have to haemorrhage money though.  I just think it would be a great shame if league speedway was lost to Workington and I'm sure I'm not alone with those sentiments. Hopefully it only needs a catalyst to start the fire. Up the Comets !

When you look at both Town and Reds the officials and the club sponsors are almost exclusively local, what's the difference?. Can a squad of semi pro rugby league players plus coaching staff be cheaper to finance than 7 speedway riders ? , the rumours are the previous coach alone was on £40K a year.

[geoff100]

It will be interesting to see how town get on without the comets money  , rental for the stadium bar takings car park? What ever am sure it will be a miss perhaps why so keen to get the reds in !

[SteelShoe]

Bit of a setback for the new pitch operations, work was halted because it turned into an extension of siddick pond on Friday. !  Doesn't look that level through a trained eye like mine either. Some of the fence boards have gone missing now, more handy work by the track butchers !!

[SteelShoe]

2 minutes ago, geoff100 said:

It will be interesting to see how town get on without the comets money  , rental for the stadium bar takings car park? What ever am sure it will be a miss perhaps why so keen to get the reds in !

I was looking over the business case for the new stadium on the Allerdale website and it states that Town are free to charge the Reds to play on Derwent Park !

That same business case doesn't make one reference to the Comets!!  Shame on you Allerdale !! 

[SteelShoe]

If anyone wants to contact the new Allerdale executive to express their feelings and insist that all available help should be forthcoming (land, financial and infrastructure) should there be an initiative by any group or individual to run Speedway in Workington then here are the relevant e-mail addresses of the new executive members . You may also want to lobby your own councillors.

marion.fitzgerald@allerdale.gov.uk    (leader)

mark.jenkinson@allerdale.gov.uk  (dep leader) Portfolio for Economic Growth inc Tourism

mike.johnson@allerdale.gov.uk     Portfolio for Corporate Resources

paul.scott@allerdale.gov.uk      Portfolio for Transformation.

george.kemp@allerdale.gov.uk   Portfolio for Environmental Quality

stephen.stoddart@allerdale.gov.uk Portfolio for Housing, Health & Wellbeing

john.cook@allerdale.gov.uk         Portfolio for Governance and People Resources

Up the Comets !!

 

 

 

 

Edited June 3, 2019 by SteelShoe

[Guest Loose Diamond]

On 6/2/2019 at 2:19 PM, Lord Lucan said:

Just shows the folly of all of this?

Allerdale spending hundreds of thousands in taxpayers cash to reseed DP in order to bring it up to standard for both football and rugby, exactly the same job will be done on the new stadium, if and when it gets the go ahead, millions to be spent on the project in general which begs the question...

if Allerdale had just spent a "few" million bringing "both" existing grounds up to an acceptable standard then the speedway track could easily have been retained and kept for future re use when required, instead, they chose to build one new stadium for two crap outfits and condemn the most successful sport we had into the realms of obscurity?

I was told that, during the recent local election canvassing, that both grounds had a finite lifespan (within 5yrs) in their present condition which would have seen the H&S executive declare both to be unfit for public use therefore the new stadium was essential for the survival of both Reds and Town, I asked about the Comets and why they were not included in this and he replied, with a cheap smile on his face that, DP was there for them to use but she (Laura) had no money to invest so....goodnight Vienna?

Cant see anyone crazy enough now to try and bring speedway back in the context of having to find a completely new home/track/team/support services/access etc for possibly a couple of seasons depending on the level of support as it's just not now looking a viable proposition, with DP still on the cards then yes, a chance but, in my opinion, not even a slim one especially on viewing those pix of the current state of affairs?

Happy memories from the Comets, we just wont be making any more of those!!

It's a massive disgrace.

[Lord Lucan]

6 hours ago, SteelShoe said:

I was looking over the business case for the new stadium on the Allerdale website and it states that Town are free to charge the Reds to play on Derwent Park !

That same business case doesn't make one reference to the Comets!!  Shame on you Allerdale !! 

I wonder if the game plan from Workington Town RLFC is to carry on screwing all the sport in the town to maintain itself?

They've bled speedway for years and now look like they have carte blanche to do the same thing to the Reds, when exactly are they going to stand on their own two feet and generate their own income? 

Looking like they want to remove all the opposition by bankruptcy means so they are the only sport left to watch, job well and truly done then? 

[Derwent]

14 hours ago, Lord Lucan said:

I wonder if the game plan from Workington Town RLFC is to carry on screwing all the sport in the town to maintain itself?

They've bled speedway for years and now look like they have carte blanche to do the same thing to the Reds, when exactly are they going to stand on their own two feet and generate their own income? 

Looking like they want to remove all the opposition by bankruptcy means so they are the only sport left to watch, job well and truly done then? 

Absolute rubbish. In fact, Town are owed a substantial five figure sum by the Comets promotion which it seems highly unlikely they will ever see. Despite the Comets success last year they appear to have left a trail of unpaid bills behind.

As for the issues around the pitch/track etc - Allerdale approached Town and offered this deal, were they supposed to say no ? Town's directors have a duty to their own club not to anyone else, and certainly not to a separate commercial enterprise that doesn't even exist anymore. Plus the fact that lazy journalism and local gossip has got Allerdale paying the bill for the work at DP, I can tell you with absolute certainty that approximately 70% of the cost is being covered by a grant that the Reds secured from the FA's football foundation trust. The Reds needed to do this even if the new ground doesn't materialise, current estimated cost of essential repairs to Borough Park is in excess of £150,000 and even then it'd be in the balance whether it was granted a safety certificate.

[Carlislecomet2]

I may be naïve but I don't believe anyone is out to shaft anyone.

Allerdale need to be commended for their ambition and creativity in putting together a plan and a sensible looking funding package by utilising historically low interest rates, to replace 2 decrepit 'stadiums' which are not fit for purpose with a state of the art stadium which will raise the profile of the area and hopefully encourage further development. You never know (with SS's rose tinted glasses on) it maybe even encourage someone to come in to develop Northside at some stage, hopefully with some help from Allerdale who you would think would feel that they owe us a little something.

As regards what is presently happening at DP, it is really for the rugby club to decide as it is their stadium so I don't see the point of bleating about the shale and fence boards being removed. Harsh I know, but what do you expect them to do?

I just hope that the stadium plans go ahead and are not used as a political football and kicked into the long grass. The new facilities would give this part of West Cumbria a huge lift and benefit the community. It would then of course be up to the community to support it!

[SteelShoe]

2 hours ago, Derwent said:

Absolute rubbish. In fact, Town are owed a substantial five figure sum by the Comets promotion which it seems highly unlikely they will ever see. Despite the Comets success last year they appear to have left a trail of unpaid bills behind.

As for the issues around the pitch/track etc - Allerdale approached Town and offered this deal, were they supposed to say no ? Town's directors have a duty to their own club not to anyone else, and certainly not to a separate commercial enterprise that doesn't even exist anymore. Plus the fact that lazy journalism and local gossip has got Allerdale paying the bill for the work at DP, I can tell you with absolute certainty that approximately 70% of the cost is being covered by a grant that the Reds secured from the FA's football foundation trust. The Reds needed to do this even if the new ground doesn't materialise, current estimated cost of essential repairs to Borough Park is in excess of £150,000 and even then it'd be in the balance whether it was granted a safety certificate.

Which deal is Allerdale supposed to have offered ?

It was a separate commercial enterprise that put money into the Town coffers for many years !  The rent was only reduced because of the fine man Dave Bowden was.

Why would the Reds put £70k (based on the £100K reportedly quoted in the local press) into the work at DP when just this week they have said they won't be going anywhere until the Community Stadium situation is clarified. Today was the day talks were supposed to be held between Council/Reds.

A change of council in Penrith has resulted in a major project agreed by the previous administration being shelved; it could happen again although I hope it doesn't and £70K is half way to what Reds require for safety work.

Where would Reds have played if the Comets had of been running this season ? Would Town have evicted them ?

 

[SteelShoe]

2 hours ago, Carlislecomet2 said:

I may be naïve but I don't believe anyone is out to shaft anyone.

Allerdale need to be commended for their ambition and creativity in putting together a plan and a sensible looking funding package by utilising historically low interest rates, to replace 2 decrepit 'stadiums' which are not fit for purpose with a state of the art stadium which will raise the profile of the area and hopefully encourage further development. You never know (with SS's rose tinted glasses on) it maybe even encourage someone to come in to develop Northside at some stage, hopefully with some help from Allerdale who you would think would feel that they owe us a little something.

As regards what is presently happening at DP, it is really for the rugby club to decide as it is their stadium so I don't see the point of bleating about the shale and fence boards being removed. Harsh I know, but what do you expect them to do?

I just hope that the stadium plans go ahead and are not used as a political football and kicked into the long grass. The new facilities would give this part of West Cumbria a huge lift and benefit the community. It would then of course be up to the community to support it!

Agreed on Allerdale's ambition and i too want the stadium to go ahead.

I'm not bleating about the shale or the boards per se, its the bigger picture of track demolition including the attempted break up of the slag sub base. Surely for this to happen someone somewhere must have decreed that speedway will never again take place at Derwent Park. I'm appealing for some openness and honesty from an official source about what the bigger picture is and where the Comets now fit into that.

[TotallyHonestJohn]

4 hours ago, Carlislecomet2 said:

I may be naïve but I don't believe anyone is out to shaft anyone.

Honestly

Shafted is only a perception; a word that conveys the basic feelings most Comets fans feel with what has come to fruition throughout this whole sorry affair...

The machinations that have gone on beggar belief. The unfortunate situation the former owner found herself in losing her business. Then the manoeuvring done by the previous council for all the reasons put forward previously and the manoeuvring done by Town in the first instance then by the Reds all to the detriment of the Comets... not including the bull squat spouted by Town's management team...

Apart from the Comets going pop; to me the outgoing councillors hold the bulk of the blame with the two sporting clubs sharing what's left on the dismantling of DP... however all that Town and Reds have done to be fair is maximised there own positions due to the Speedway falling over and quite selfishly looked after their own interest to the detriment of the Comets... 

If either of those two went belly up I doubt if many Speedway fans would have lost any sleep (Well may be me old pal Singy) but if the shoe was on the other foot would we as Speedway fans feel any sympathy... possibly not...

However we all feel shafted over losing the sport we love and enjoy and for the ground where we went to watch our sport of choice having the heart and soul being ripped out of it which means there is no chance of it coming back to that venue... and as stated there has been a certain amount of Jiggery Pokery going on what you will never get to the bottom of...

I am now close to some of the newly elected Allerdale councillors and some of the story's I am hearing from them (if true) are shocking. However there is goodwill from many of these new council members and they would be open (I believe) to suppoting the sport at another venue if somewhere suitable could be found...

However it's Catch 22 as you need someone to sink money into the sport to get the whole process with the council rolling as it won't start rolling until a promoter can be found... and all the pitfalls of that scenario have been well discussed...

Sorry but I also feel that it's gone never to return...

Sad times...

Regards 

THJ 

[Lord Lucan]

7 hours ago, Derwent said:

Absolute rubbish. In fact, Town are owed a substantial five figure sum by the Comets promotion which it seems highly unlikely they will ever see. Despite the Comets success last year they appear to have left a trail of unpaid bills behind.

As for the issues around the pitch/track etc - Allerdale approached Town and offered this deal, were they supposed to say no ? Town's directors have a duty to their own club not to anyone else, and certainly not to a separate commercial enterprise that doesn't even exist anymore. Plus the fact that lazy journalism and local gossip has got Allerdale paying the bill for the work at DP, I can tell you with absolute certainty that approximately 70% of the cost is being covered by a grant that the Reds secured from the FA's football foundation trust. The Reds needed to do this even if the new ground doesn't materialise, current estimated cost of essential repairs to Borough Park is in excess of £150,000 and even then it'd be in the balance whether it was granted a safety certificate.

Thank you for the figures, it still doesn't excuse the fact that no one from Allerdale has ever entertained any possible proposals from alternative sources to continue running speedway at DP?

An offer to Laura Morgan wasn't taken up due to financial problems and there the matter ended, once speedway thru her was gone the bulldozers moved in and that was that?

As has been explained above the Reds are now very sceptical about this stadium ever being built and their contribution to the work on a pitch elsewhere could see them forced into paying rent to play on it, short spell or not, it was not what they signed up for?

Both want a new stadium but with talk's not producing very much at the moment as to whether anything will ever get the go ahead would that leave DP as the "shared venue" and Borough Park just levelled, use the funds to renovate one ground....is that going to be acceptable to the Reds and Town?

Whichever way it pan's out the Speedway was never an option on any front and that's what is wrong with all of this, we could have accommodated all three sport's if we'd really wanted to.... certain individuals just didn't and that's the saddest part of it? 

[SteelShoe]

10 hours ago, Lord Lucan said:

Thank you for the figures, it still doesn't excuse the fact that no one from Allerdale has ever entertained any possible proposals from alternative sources to continue running speedway at DP?

An offer to Laura Morgan wasn't taken up due to financial problems and there the matter ended, once speedway thru her was gone the bulldozers moved in and that was that?

As has been explained above the Reds are now very sceptical about this stadium ever being built and their contribution to the work on a pitch elsewhere could see them forced into paying rent to play on it, short spell or not, it was not what they signed up for?

Both want a new stadium but with talk's not producing very much at the moment as to whether anything will ever get the go ahead would that leave DP as the "shared venue" and Borough Park just levelled, use the funds to renovate one ground....is that going to be acceptable to the Reds and Town?

Whichever way it pan's out the Speedway was never an option on any front and that's what is wrong with all of this, we could have accommodated all three sport's if we'd really wanted to.... certain individuals just didn't and that's the saddest part of it? 

Right on the money Lord Lucan !!

[Derwent]

17 hours ago, Lord Lucan said:

Thank you for the figures, it still doesn't excuse the fact that no one from Allerdale has ever entertained any possible proposals from alternative sources to continue running speedway at DP?

An offer to Laura Morgan wasn't taken up due to financial problems and there the matter ended, once speedway thru her was gone the bulldozers moved in and that was that?

As has been explained above the Reds are now very sceptical about this stadium ever being built and their contribution to the work on a pitch elsewhere could see them forced into paying rent to play on it, short spell or not, it was not what they signed up for?

Both want a new stadium but with talk's not producing very much at the moment as to whether anything will ever get the go ahead would that leave DP as the "shared venue" and Borough Park just levelled, use the funds to renovate one ground....is that going to be acceptable to the Reds and Town?

Whichever way it pan's out the Speedway was never an option on any front and that's what is wrong with all of this, we could have accommodated all three sport's if we'd really wanted to.... certain individuals just didn't and that's the saddest part of it? 

I believe, and its only my hunch, that we will end up with a completely renovated Derwent Park instead of a new stadium. I think the council will then use the BP site to build the commercial offices etc for Sellafield and NHS as a stand alone business park.