Rye House & Lydde

[Ray Stadia]

6 minutes ago, f-s-p said:

Only flat track action I saw this season was at Forssa during the LT Nordic final. A 1000 meter long gravel track with four bikes doing a 12 lap final heat. Needless to say I used the remaining 11 laps to have a wee before the final heat of LT.

The old prostate playing up? 

[Guest]

I can accept that what we see in the UK and Europe is Flat Track of a low novice standard. But I also see youtube items covering Flat Track in the USA and Canada and it demonstrates some top class riding.

In the UK it's rather like we are matching a poor standard National League speedway match against what is presented in a high class Speedway GP. The UK still has a long way to go before it gets anywhere near what takes place in the USA and Canada. Hopefully one day it will get there.

Edited January 14, 2019 by Guest

[f-s-p]

14 minutes ago, Ray Stadia said:

The old prostate playing up? 

Yes, you know it.

[iris123]

10 minutes ago, gustix said:

I can accept that what we see in the UK and Europe is Flat Track of a low novice standard. But I also see youtube items covering Flat Track in the USA and Canada and it demonstrates some top class riding.

In the UK it's rather like we are matching a poor standard National League speedway match against what is presented in a high class Speedway GP. The UK still has a long way to go before it gets anywhere near what takes place in the USA and Canada. Hopefully one day it will get there.

Guess it is like comparing Polish League speedway with British League speedway?The UK still has some way to go to get anywhere near Poland,but maybe we can be positive and hope one day it will?I doubt European Flat Track will ever reach US level.Just not the market imo

In fact I think we have been here before,but looking at this article it admits Flat Track in the US hit the doldrums in the 1990s and is hoping to get a boost(2017)

https://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/motorcycles/a28103/flat-track-motorcycle-racing/

Edited January 14, 2019 by iris123

[Guest]

This is an interesting Link in regard to happenings in Flat Track racing worldwide: http://www.speedwaychampions.com/flat-track.php

[iris123]

5 minutes ago, gustix said:

This is an interesting Link in regard to happenings in Flat Track racing worldwide: http://www.speedwaychampions.com/flat-track.php

Yes,quite interesting how the FIM championship in Europe has gone from 5 or so rounds down to only one round last year!!!What does that tell us?Is European Flat Track in the doldrums like the US?

Edited January 14, 2019 by iris123

[adonis]

20 minutes ago, gustix said:

This is an interesting Link in regard to happenings in Flat Track racing worldwide: http://www.speedwaychampions.com/flat-track.php

at least when the whole lot ceases the bikes wont go to waste like speedway bikes will ,  dirt track is a niche style of customisation of motorcycles  in a similar vein to Cafe racers

[Guest]

Like it or not (and the latter appears the case on here) in the USA Flat Track racing is far better supported both financially and by supporters than is American speedway. 

I have never seen a UK meeting but seen USA and Canadian FT on youtube. It looks fairly well supported according to what is seen both on track and by supporters. Yet there appears to be reasoning that the formula is in the doldrums across the Atlantic. With big support from both Harley Davidson and Indian that opinion valid as it may be is hard to reconcile.

[adonis]

7 minutes ago, gustix said:

Like it or not (and the latter appears the case on here) in the USA Flat Track racing is far better supported both financially and by supporters than is American speedway. 

I have never seen a UK meeting but seen USA and Canadian FT on youtube. It looks fairly well supported according to what is seen both on track and by supporters. Yet there appears to be reasoning that the formula is in the doldrums across the Atlantic. With big support from both Harley Davidson and Indian that opinion valid as it may be is hard to reconcile.

American Dirt track track  on the half mile or even mile tracks , is nothing like what you would see here ,  in the usa dirt track is one of the disciplines for the AMA championship so big names from all motorcylcle sports  compete in amercian dirt track ..

[Vince]

10 hours ago, adonis said:

American Dirt track track  on the half mile or even mile tracks , is nothing like what you would see here ,  in the usa dirt track is one of the disciplines for the AMA championship so big names from all motorcylcle sports  compete in amercian dirt track ..

The AMA Championship was divided into separate disciplines many decades ago so flat track is ridden by specialists. The Flat track championship now consists of two classes Twins (the top guys) and Singles (still pro class riders but a step down from the top 20 or so). The events are split into miles, half miles, short track and TT (right hand turn and a jump). In the UK we run what would be their short track and a TT, there is one bigger track that isn't quite a half mile but the average speed for the top boys is still 80mph. It's right to say that what you see here isn't much like the mile or half miles you see from the USA.

Your view of UK Flat Track also appears to be a bit out of date, it has evolved and developed a great deal in the past few years and the standard of riding has improved a huge amount since the first meeting I saw in 2007. The top riders that day wouldn't get near a final if they rode to the same standard now.

Flat Track in the USA appears to be regaining some popularity but it's a long way from the crowd and income levels of it's heyday, very comparable to Speedway in the UK in many ways.

In the UK and some other parts of Europe it is most definitely a growing participant sport which attracts good press coverage and some good sponsorship for a sport it's size. I think it will grow a fair bit more in the UK and only 2 or 3 of the 7 British Championship rounds this year will be held on Speedway tracks. I still don't think it will become much of a spectator sport although the Pro Class in particular throws up some very good racing and with 12 riders on a Speedway track there's generally going to be someone battling. There are a lot of classes though and just too many races to attract casual spectators I think. Some thought has gone into it so that you can usually watch just the Saturday evening programme with fewer races at a good level.

As for the idea that the top British riders are at novice level compared to the US that is also out of date. Young Oliver Brindley was one of our best riders and has now spent two years racing in the USA and been on the podium in the singles class. That means he is among the top 10%, maybe better, over there and there are a couple of others in the UK can give him a run for his money. So the standard isn't as high but it certainly isn't novice level.

[Guest]

It is a pity the excellent debate in regard to Flat Track racing is in a thread where the title does not indicate this. Much better if it could have appeared in 

Grasstrack, Sidecar, Short Track and Cycle Speedway

Discussions, results, news and events

However, the formula's appearance as I see it in this thread originally only came about because - rightly - there was a reference to  Rye House and Flat Track racing.

[Pieman72]

Best option could be to affiliate as a Grasstrack under the guidance of the ACU.  While I don't condemn 'practice tracks' out of hand, speedway can be a dangerous sport for all involved and basic medical cover, safety and insurance must be mandatory.Perhaps guidance, advice and diplomacy might be helpful. After seeing the mess that dirt track racing is in perhaps there is a need for an Amateur Dirt Track Authority? Understandably a lot of riders want to race but there a few places to do it somehow a less formal and looser set up could work?

Edited January 15, 2019 by Pieman72
Spelling

[Vince]

13 minutes ago, Pieman72 said:

Best option could be to affiliate as a Grasstrack under the guidance of the ACU.  While I don't condemn 'practice tracks' out of hand, speedway can be a dangerous sport for all involved and basic medical cover, safety and insurance must be mandatory.Perhaps guidance, advice and diplomacy might be helpful. After seeing the mess that dirt track racing is in perhaps there is a need for an Amateur Dirt Track Authority? Understandably a lot of riders want to race but there a few places to do it somehow a less formal and looser set up could work?

If you mean dirt track/ flat track in the UK it is run by the Dirt Track Riders Association and is a long way from being in a mess. Affiliated to the MCF the DTRA has gone from strength to strength since it took over and is the most friendly club I have ever been involved with in 47 years of competition motorcycling. While it is run strictly in accordance with the regulations the overall feel is very laid back and if the organisers can do anything to help you they will. There is also the summer and winter series at Rye House which has an even more relaxed feel about it with less entrants.

I don't think any more events would attract enough riders to be able to operate and can't imagine a less formal or looser set could be possible.

[Pieman72]

I agree completely I've only seen a few races at Stoke at the back end of last year it was really friendly. I'm just being diplomatic with my words and in now way do I imply your organisation I just used it as a general term for oval racing. Please accept my aplogies. Do you not agree that there is a need for another organisation to oversee amateur/semi professional speedway? We are stuck in a rut and the SCB seem to making it deeper.

[iris123]

18 hours ago, gustix said:

Like it or not (and the latter appears the case on here) in the USA Flat Track racing is far better supported both financially and by supporters than is American speedway. 

Yet there appears to be reasoning that the formula is in the doldrums across the Atlantic. With big support from both Harley Davidson and Indian that opinion valid as it may be is hard to reconcile.

Don’t forget Harley are at war with a certain Donald Trump.Well more like Trump is at war with them and sales have fallen dramatically since he took aim at them

https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwj6q8LCjfDfAhWEJlAKHbKfClEQzPwBegQIARAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.nytimes.com%2F2018%2F10%2F24%2Fbusiness%2Fdealbook%2Fharley-davidson-trump-sales.html&psig=AOvVaw0IQZu_6Ie6Y2hQMRI8zoCj&ust=1547652645265472

[Vince]

22 hours ago, Pieman72 said:

I agree completely I've only seen a few races at Stoke at the back end of last year it was really friendly. I'm just being diplomatic with my words and in now way do I imply your organisation I just used it as a general term for oval racing. Please accept my aplogies. Do you not agree that there is a need for another organisation to oversee amateur/semi professional speedway? We are stuck in a rut and the SCB seem to making it deeper.

What you saw at Stoke is no way comparable to what you get with the DTRA meetings from what I hear from those who rode. I think when other people run flat track meetings it takes them a few goes to adapt, it did at Rye House and could well do so at Stoke.

I thought you meant another organisation for flat track but for amateur Speedway there are a few clubs running now and they seem to do OK for entries. Again I'm not convinced that another organising body is needed (you would have to battle for the right to call it Speedway for starters) although I'm sure that if there was track time available another club wouldn't hurt.