Assets and rider poaching

[superguest]

Swindon fans have a short memory.

Tobi Musieak rode for Wolves in 2016 and produced an average of around 4.5. Who benefited from that low average in 2017?

Now, I can see why you would be frustrated as he has an attractive average but he's about 23 or 24? Plenty of time to reap the rewards.  It may well be his break through year and you could either benefit from having a rider worth selling or he could come back a happier and improved rider. Time will tell! 

 

 

Edited December 3, 2018 by superguest

[hyabb17]

11 minutes ago, superguest said:

Swindon fans have a short memory.

Tobi Musieak rode for Wolves in 2016 and produced an average of around 4.5. Who benefited from that low average in 2017?

Now, I can see why you would be frustrated as he has an attractive average but he's about 23 or 24? Plenty of time to reap the rewards.  It may well be his break through year and you could either benefit from having a rider worth selling or he could come back a happier and improved rider. Time will tell! 

 

 

I would say that the slight difference here is that Wolves could have used Musielak for that season but never & thus he was surplus to requirements. Swindon were always going to try & keep Nick for 2019. 

[89buttons]

You can’t have it both ways, if clubs want loyalty in the manner the initial post is suggesting and first refusal a year later then riders need to be contracted and salaried, you can’t have riders being self employed and therefore if they’re injured don’t get paid etc. But then come the end of the season have absolutely no control over who they sign for and at the mercy of a club.

 

If you want it to be this way then clubs need to sign riders onto multi year contracts with a weekly wage agreed and performance related bonuses on top of that more like in say football as an example. But there’s simply isn’t the money in the sport to do this!

 

The original post seems to forget these guys are people trying to make a living the same as anyone else, they’re fortunate to be skilled enough at something as fun a racing motorbikes against there friends for a living but that doesn’t make them any different to anyone else and should be treated accordingly.

 

imagine you’re subcontracted to build an extension for a bigger firm. Once the job is done you get offered to build an extension for someone else for more money than the firm you’ve done a contracted job for, would it be reasonable let alone legal for that firm to say you can’t go and build an extension for someone else because I want you to do this for less money, I’m not willing to employ you full time and pay you a salary all year round but if you don’t agree because you’ve just sub contracted on a job for me, you can’t work anywhere else in this country for 12 months!! Farcical idea isn’t it!

[tonyd]

Something needs to be done about riders contracts as it stands at present a rider signs for a club to ride for them for a season but he hits a bad patch and ends up being dropped and replaced OR another rider gets injured and to fit a new rider in to the averages rider X gets dropped and replaced by a lower averaged rider either way rider X who has invested £xxxx in machinery for the season ends up teamless and unemployed.

On the other hand a rider who falls out with the promotion for whatever reason and refuses to ride ends up with a fine and a minimum 28 day ban. In either scenario it's always the rider that ends up suffering with no protection at all but the promotion just carry on. I would love to see riders contracts challenged in court because I bet they are not worth the paper they are written on in many cases.I

 

[robins les]

On ‎12‎/‎2‎/‎2018 at 12:09 PM, poolebolton said:

Thats great apart from if a club doesn't have a say on assets away from the club before December the 1st then they might never get a rider they want. 

Jason Doyle could have been stuck at Leicester for years potentially. 

Should just be the same as Poland and sweden have a set window and you have to name your team by a set date. 

Doyle wasn't an asset at Leicester. He was originally a Poole asset & they exchanged assets with Swindon with Magic moving to Poole. Doyle rode on loan to Leicester.

[robins les]

5 hours ago, superguest said:

 Swindon fans have a short memory.

Tobi Musieak rode for Wolves in 2016 and produced an average of around 4.5. Who benefited from that low average in 2017?

Now, I can see why you would be frustrated as he has an attractive average but he's about 23 or 24? Plenty of time to reap the rewards.  It may well be his break through year and you could either benefit from having a rider worth selling or he could come back a happier and improved rider. Time will tell! 

 

 

Wolves sold him to Swindon, he wasn't poached. They wanted to sign him on loan when Wolves did not use him & were told to buy him if they wanted him. No poaching there, it was Wolves decision to let him go.

Edited December 3, 2018 by robins les

[Starman2006]

On 12/2/2018 at 11:48 AM, DC2 said:

 

After the scandals involving Batchelor,  Miedzinski, Klindt and Morris, it’s about time there were clear rules regarding assets and team-building:

any rider (whether an asset or not) who rode for the club this season and who is offered a contract (on the same terms plus inflation) before 1 December must sign for that club or sit out the season;

any asset who has not been offered a contract by his parent club before 1 December is free to sign for another club.

That would stop poaching and stop clubs sitting on assets and it would encourage loyalty which benefits the fan base.

That includes Swindon i take it DC, or are you exempt.

[Mediman]

It’s just not possible Riders are not employed they are self employed and can ride for whoever under European law. Sure the individual body can have some restraints like a cut off period to change but the way speedway is set up, to impose greater sanctions would weaken the product even more and discourage riders from riding.

We have to accept that the sport won’t change unless a major league fails and riders are left without clubs and I don’t see the uk as major league.

So much for one big league and all the changes we all mooted what we have is still what we have got.

reminds me of a saying

if we allways do what we’ve allways done

we will  allways get what we’ve allways got

[SteveLyric2]

12 hours ago, Mediman said:

It’s just not possible Riders are not employed they are self employed and can ride for whoever under European law. Sure the individual body can have some restraints like a cut off period to change but the way speedway is set up, to impose greater sanctions would weaken the product even more and discourage riders from riding.

We have to accept that the sport won’t change unless a major league fails and riders are left without clubs and I don’t see the uk as major league.

So much for one big league and all the changes we all mooted what we have is still what we have got.

reminds me of a saying

if we allways do what we’ve allways done

we will  allways get what we’ve allways got

Sounds like you might be partying a bit too hard Mediman?!

[DC2]

12 hours ago, Mediman said:

 

reminds me of a saying

if we allways do what we’ve allways done

we will  allways get what we’ve allways got

 

Reminds me of two other sayings:

”Always use a dictionary”

“Why do young people keep saying: Can I get .... ?”

[old bob at herne bay]

Can I get a copy of a specimen riders "contract"  ? 

[DC2]

1 hour ago, old bob at herne bay said:

Can I get a copy of a specimen riders "contract"  ? 

 

Yeah, go get it.

[old bob at herne bay]

Cool. That’s sweet . 

 

 

[DC2]

17 hours ago, old bob at herne bay said:

Cool. That’s sweet . 

 

No, I think you’ll find it’s “sick”.