Polish Extraleague TV contract 2019-21

[Mark]

3 hours ago, PHILIPRISING said:

IT'S not missing practice that is an issue.What happens when a rider actually misses a GP because he was injured the night before. And who replaces him or indeed them?

Why so much fuss over nothing ?

One way around the problem of a rider being injured on Friday (GP eve)  is to have the first GP reserve ready and primed to ride in the GP.   It's a cost to have an additional rider travel to the GP but it gives cover.   Easy solution.       No real difference from a rider getting a knock on Thursday or Friday.    Just get the reserve at the track and ready to race. 

Edited December 29, 2018 by Mark

[Mark]

44 minutes ago, PHILIPRISING said:

HAVE suggested in SS next week that the FIM simply ban SGP riders from racing competitively 24 hours prior to a round of what is after all the World Championship.

Is this restraint of trade ?      I've given an easy solution in my previous reply.

[PHILIPRISING]

1 minute ago, Mark said:

Are we in the same situation before the SoN in Russia.     It will be harder to fly a rider out there due to the visa needed than fill a GP spot.

One way around the problem of a rider being injured on Friday (GP eve)  is to have the first GP reserve ready and primed to ride in the GP.   It's a cost to have an additional rider travel to the GP but gives cover.   Easy solution.

 

9 minutes ago, iris123 said:

The buck normally stops at the top.A number of fiascos have happened under his watch,but of course as ever someone else is to blame!!!

NOT sure what all these fiascos are and, of course, Armando is not the man at the top. The various commissions at the FIM do not have complete autonomy.

[Mark]

4 minutes ago, PHILIPRISING said:

 

NOT sure what all these fiascos are and, of course, Armando is not the man at the top. The various commissions at the FIM do not have complete autonomy.

But I've given an easy workable solution to the problem you raise.    I don't see what the fuss is all about.    It's two GP's only and for those two GP's get a reserve at the track ready to race.      I'm surprised it doesn't happen at every GP in case of illness to a top 15 rider.

What objection could you have ?

Edited December 29, 2018 by Mark

[PHILIPRISING]

3 minutes ago, Mark said:

Is this restraint of trade ?      I've given an easy solution in my previous reply.

NO, not if it is part of the contract that riders sign to compete in the championship. Your 'solution' is not that simple. Supposing the first Reserve  also required in Poland the night before. Is he expected make all the arrangement (bikes, mechanics, etc) to travel to the SGP the following day without knowing whether or not he will be needed. And what if more than one rider is injured or unable to travel? Far better to have all the riders in attendance the day before. Many of the riders would rather have that decision made for them and not have to fight their prime employers.

[Mark]

7 minutes ago, PHILIPRISING said:

NO, not if it is part of the contract that riders sign to compete in the championship. Your 'solution' is not that simple. Supposing the first Reserve  also required in Poland the night before. Is he expected make all the arrangement (bikes, mechanics, etc) to travel to the SGP the following day without knowing whether or not he will be needed. And what if more than one rider is injured or unable to travel? Far better to have all the riders in attendance the day before. Many of the riders would rather have that decision made for them and not have to fight their prime employers.

I've already said it's an additional cost so YES the first reserve should be expected to travel.    He would get paid and also have this in his GP contract.   It's only 2 GP's remember so no huge deal.    And maybe he could take the Number 16 slot or even 17 track reserve.   

Your objection to my simple solution is made on one point.  That more than 1 rider could be injured on Friday night.    A possibly of course but massively slim.   There may be a statistican out there who can let us know how many riders have had a knock on Wed/Thur night in GP week which has caused them to miss a GP.

[iwright71]

Never did I think the Polish League would ever become bigger than the FIM world championship but it seems it has now. Possibility of riders being injured on Friday nights with no adequate replacements. What happens if there is a rain off on Saturday and Polish TV don't want to cancel their 2 TV matches ?  How has it come to this that the tail wags the dog ! 

[PHILIPRISING]

1 hour ago, Mark said:

I've already said it's an additional cost so YES the first reserve should be expected to travel.    He would get paid and also have this in his GP contract.   It's only 2 GP's remember so no huge deal.    And maybe he could take the Number 16 slot or even 17 track reserve.   

Your objection to my simple solution is made on one point.  That more than 1 rider could be injured on Friday night.    A possibly of course but massively slim.   There may be a statistican out there who can let us know how many riders have had a knock on Wed/Thur night in GP week which has caused them to miss a GP.

PLUS the reserve dates for rain-offs, etc... get paid what? 

[Red Flag]

Have the Polish fixtures been released yet? be interesting if Zmarzlik, Janowski or Dudek have to ride on the Fridays before Krsko or Wroclaw GP's.

Could give an advantage to GP riders not having to race on the Friday

[stewmac]

59 minutes ago, Red Flag said:

Have the Polish fixtures been released yet? be interesting if Zmarzlik, Janowski or Dudek have to ride on the Fridays before Krsko or Wroclaw GP's.

Could give an advantage to GP riders not having to race on the Friday

Yes, the Extraliga fixtures are here:

https://m.sportowefakty.wp.pl/zuzel/pge-ekstraliga/kalendarz

Im awaiting the Nice 1 league and 2nd division fixtures to help me choose where to add additional meetings to a couple of weekend trips I have organised for next season. 

[f-s-p]

4 hours ago, PHILIPRISING said:

 

NOT sure what all these fiascos are and, of course, Armando is not the man at the top. The various commissions at the FIM do not have complete autonomy.

Armando is the the man VERY much on the top of track racing. WTF? Are you saying that someone else is holding his balls regarding what's going on? He did tell me to my face politic's interfere with his work May this year. We still don't have SoN allocations, we still don't have Nice league calendar...

My plan is to stick to rep until the end...

 

[teaboy279]

Wasn't it only a couple of seasons ago UK teams rode Friday night's before gps. Sure Bomber in particular missed a few practices to ride for the Bees.

[Mark]

7 hours ago, teaboy279 said:

Wasn't it only a couple of seasons ago UK teams rode Friday night's before gps. Sure Bomber in particular missed a few practices to ride for the Bees.

That is right.

[Mark]

20 hours ago, PHILIPRISING said:

PLUS the reserve dates for rain-offs, etc... get paid what? 

You are findfing ways to be negative rather than positive.   I've given an easy and workable solution to the problem, and this only happens on two GP dates, which would allow Poland and the GP to run without hassle.   You seem content finding ways to put obstacles (none of which are insurmountable) in the way to suit your argument.   No wonder this sport continues to regress without some forward thinking.

If you think there is a high chance of a GP rider being injured on Friday night in Poland it follows that there must be a good chance of the GP first reserve getting a full meeting.  Makes even more sence to have a rider in waiting.

How many riders in the last 5 years have missed a Saturday GP from an injury occuring in league racing the previous Wednesday or Thursday ?     Back up your argument with solid statistics.

Edited December 30, 2018 by Mark

[PHILIPRISING]

1 hour ago, Mark said:

You are findfing ways to be negative rather than positive.   I've given an easy and workable solution to the problem, and this only happens on two GP dates, which would allow Poland and the GP to run without hassle.   You seem content finding ways to put obstacles (none of which are insurmountable) in the way to suit your argument.   No wonder this sport continues to regress without some forward thinking.

If you think there is a high chance of a GP rider being injured on Friday night in Poland it follows that there must be a good chance of the GP first reserve getting a full meeting.  Makes even more sence to have a rider in waiting.

How many riders in the last 5 years have missed a Saturday GP from an injury occuring in league racing the previous Wednesday or Thursday ?     Back up your argument with solid statistics.

NO point, we are on a different page. You have your view and that's fine. But I am sure there will be riders unhappy about getting from Poland on a Friday night to an SGP venue the next day especially if the latest they can sign-on is 12 noon.

[Mark]

9 minutes ago, PHILIPRISING said:

NO point, we are on a different page. You have your view and that's fine. But I am sure there will be riders unhappy about getting from Poland on a Friday night to an SGP venue the next day especially if the latest they can sign-on is 12 noon.

The riders travel from a Saturday evening GP to race in Poland on Sunday afternoon so, again, you're finding an objection that's not an issue.  Change the time of the sign in - very simple and problem solved.     

Speedway should employ those who find solutions rather than those who only put forward reasons why the sport can't do something different.

Edited December 30, 2018 by Mark

[racers and royals]

1 hour ago, Mark said:

You are findfing ways to be negative rather than positive.   I've given an easy and workable solution to the problem, and this only happens on two GP dates, which would allow Poland and the GP to run without hassle.   You seem content finding ways to put obstacles (none of which are insurmountable) in the way to suit your argument.   No wonder this sport continues to regress without some forward thinking.

If you think there is a high chance of a GP rider being injured on Friday night in Poland it follows that there must be a good chance of the GP first reserve getting a full meeting.  Makes even more sence to have a rider in waiting.

How many riders in the last 5 years have missed a Saturday GP from an injury occuring in league racing the previous Wednesday or Thursday ?     Back up your argument with solid statistics.

I`m not sure there is anything positive regarding the Extraleague wanting to tie riders to racing on 10 Fridays- 24 hours before  a round of the biggest competition in world speedway. If riders want to practice(and most do) they should be allowed to. The Extraleague was very lucky with the weather in 2018- might not be the same as regards postponements in 2019. In total there are in addition to the 2 definite Friday`s another 6 are reserve dates. Poland could, if the will is  there , use other free Friday`s and Saturday`s instead.

Edited December 30, 2018 by racers and royals

[Mark]

9 minutes ago, racers and royals said:

I`m not sure there is anything positive regarding the Extraleague wanting to tie riders to racing on 10 Fridays- 24 hours before  a round of the biggest competition in world speedway. If riders want to practice(and most do) they should be allowed to. The Extraleague was very lucky with the weather in 2018- might not be the same as regards postponements in 2019. In total there are in addition to the 2 definite Friday`s another 6 are reserve dates. Poland could, if the will is  there could use other free Friday`s and Saturday`s instead.

It's 2 Friday's not 10 on the current schedule.   We hear so many riders say 'the track was different in practise' so maybe they will benefit from missing half a dozen laps.   I feel that because practise is there the riders feel oblgated to practise but not because it's a benefit.

If they cancelled Friday practise it would save loads of money spent on hotels etc.

Does the rule still stand that should a Saturday GP be cancelled due to rain the Polish League cancel there Sunday fixtures to allow the GP to run on that day ?

Edited December 30, 2018 by Mark

[racers and royals]

Just now, Mark said:

It's 2 Fridays not 10 on the current schedule.   We hear so many riders say 'the track was different in practise' so maybe they will benefit from missing half a dozen laps.   I feel that because practise is there the riders feel oblgated to practise but not because it's a benefit.

Does the rule still stand that should a Saturday GP be cancelled due to rain the Polish League cancel there Sunday fixtures to allow the GP to run on that day ?

Yes 2 but could be between 2 and 8 Friday`s. Not sure the Polish league AGREE to cancel their matches- more like the postponement day is next day for the GP`s and Poland decide to cancel if riders become unavailable for league duty- which is also what they do if riders become unavailable because of postponements to SEC comps, U21  and UEM comp`s etc. The Extraleague in my opinion on this matter have gone to far- there are many other Friday`s or Saturday`s they can use- however i would agree that it would split the round up which would lead to a disjointed league table.

[Mark]

5 minutes ago, racers and royals said:

Yes 2 but could be between 2 and 8 Friday`s. Not sure the Polish league AGREE to cancel their matches- more like the postponement day is next day for the GP`s and Poland decide to cancel if riders become unavailable for league duty- which is also what they do if riders become unavailable because of postponements to SEC comps, U21  and UEM comp`s etc. The Extraleague in my opinion on this matter have gone to far- there are many other Friday`s or Saturday`s they can use- however i would agree that it would split the round up which would lead to a disjointed league table.

Glad we agreed it was 2 not 10.    Agree the Polish could have scheduled the Friday program better, worked with the GP's, but it's not the massive issue some are making it to be.    Get on with it and find solutions. 

Maybe the new TV deal is allowing clubs to pay the riders more money ?