ruffdiamond Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 17 minutes ago, The Third Man said: but survival of the fittest will result in only one team being left wont it? Yes, but there will be a lot less fixture congestion. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS50 Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 4 minutes ago, ruffdiamond said: Yes, but there will be a lot less fixture congestion. And no doubling up. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, ruffdiamond said: Yes, but there will be a lot less fixture congestion. I admire your optimism.. We will still be running finals on cold, dark rainy nights in October... Edited October 14, 2018 by mikebv Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 39 minutes ago, RS50 said: And no doubling up. But I bet they still will use guests... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS50 Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 21 minutes ago, mikebv said: But I bet they still will use guests... Won't be any guests available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruffdiamond Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 22 minutes ago, RS50 said: Won't be any guests available. Maybe there will,,,, one club can have all the riders and many teams, A B C etc. They can run any day of the week (apart from Sunday). There will be no home advantage, all guests will be 'track ponies', the one promotion can make all the profit until they squeeze everything out of the tube. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frigbo Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 The end. The patient has suffered enough and is now terminally ill.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, The Third Man said: I agree with Einstein, and it seems we are going to go back to 2017 and hope it works this time, but survival of the fittest will result in only one team being left wont it? Not at all... Unless it is allowed to by an operating model bordering on insanity. (That word again)... Nature and Economics both have a way of naturally culling populations and businesses whose numbers are too great and pose a threat to their very existence if not checked... Speedway needs to have a strong top league, ran with credibility and integrity, to attract crowds... Do that and it gives itself at least a chance of a greater amount of sponsors, and that so important national mainstream media coverage... With that sponsorship and media coverage will then grow more awareness, and ultimately, more fans.. A virtuous circle having been completed... In football for example, the EFL lives off the coat tails of the Premier League... The huge focus on the PL naturally permeates down to the secondary competitions and they then can exist positively in some of this reflective focus.. If the PL allowed guests/ringers, and allowed competitors to appear each week for any amount of teams, and then allowed them to have more than one contracted club, it would be (quite rightly) regarded as being contrived and Mickey Mouse... And I can guarantee, enjoy nowhere near the same level of financial rewards or coverage it has today.. With the lower leagues enjoying nowhere near the same reflective spin offs it currently has.. In short, the overall entity of Football has become a 'behemoth' in England, but if ran like British Speedway, it would not be anywhere near the size it has evolved into... In Speedway the Premiership should be clearly seen as the 'alpha league', the pinnacle for every team to aspire to be in.... Therefore. Get this league right, run it properly, and put all the resource you can in pushing it out to the public, many of whom are currently oblivious to its existence.. Speedway will never evolve, grow and get stronger when riders can ride for teams in various divisions as there is simply no aspiration to get to the top. Which means the top league will never be a true pinnacle.. As an example. Craig Cook this year has rode for Glasgow and Belle Vue, therefore what is Glasgows motivation for moving up? They already have a top ten Premiership rider riding for them in the 2nd Divison so why bother moving out of this league? And for Craig himself, where is his 'growth' going to come from? He will never evolve as a rider by dropping down a level to take on lesser opponents. He has been there and done that so at best will stagnate.. No criticism intended of Craig Cook by the way, as I feel the more riders with Craig's commitment and attitude to British Speedway the better the sport will be. However he should be evolving as a rider not stagnating, or even regressing.. Get the top league ran with credibility and integrity to the best level the teams in at can afford and push this to the awaiting populous.. Give any marketing budget and media focus to these teams in this league and let them be the standard bearers for all other tracks to aspire to.. Then develop clear opportunity for promotion to this league, and through all leagues, so clubs of all levels can show the required ambition to individually better themselves through natural evolutionary growth.. Or, at least be able to participate at their natural level of capability.. Simply. Without evolutionary growth, the Sport can, and will, never move forward.. Without aspirational opportunity, no evolutionary growth can even take place and you will stagnate.. And if you stagnate, eventually you will wither and die.. Edited October 14, 2018 by mikebv 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronScorpion Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 Depending on the number of teams involved this years, certain issues need addressing. If we start with a shield it is run to a conclusion as soon as possible. Fixture dates could double up ie having one date for 2 competitions. If on that date, any team is involved in the shield then it takes priority. If not it becomes a league fixture. The league is run to a conclusion, league winners & no play- offs. The end of season is the KO Cup meaning more teams & riders are involved for a longer period. SIMPLES !!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topaz325 Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 The BSPA should answer the questions about the fixture debacle, this year , well other years to but they seem destined to close tracks rather than try and help them , surprisingly it’s their own business they are destroying, couldn’t make it up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronScorpion Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 The BSPA did. They put out a statement saying the were reverting back to only 3 meetings per race night(fixed tracks) with teams reverting back to main race night. Alternative race nights only to be used if Friday night track did not have a meeting or were riding at a similar Friday night track. Yes, fixtures were agreed back in February but the increase in injured riders meant that there were limited guests available. Even the SCB have had to make amendments to rules as the season progressed. We don't live in a perfect world where every thing & every one is perfect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedy bill Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 One league any team who cant afford to run in it drops into the National League, Teams go back to their normal race nights only British riders allowed at reserve in the top league.Allow a 45 points limit scrap the one eight point rule , guest riders only allowed for missing any top two in averages ,others replaced by R/r or rider from own asset base. RIDERS WONT LIKE THIS BUT STRiCKED PAY RATE rule to be thrashed out before season ,limited time allowed for rider digging green light mounted by start line once it goes out riders allowed only 15 seconds to line up,any rider falling off at back when other team on a 5/1 and not clearing track when obviously he can to be deducted one point from his score but not the teams score at referees discretion .Team changes only allowed up to the end of August,starting rules unless obvious jump but if no tapes touched let go .No big gaps between meetings get back to speedway every week or at lest every two week at all tracks. What do you think about that lot folks 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waco Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 Speedy Bill sounds good .personally I do not know if it would all work in practice .but hey you have obviously given it some thought... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattK Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 21 minutes ago, speedy bill said: One league any team who cant afford to run in it drops into the National League, Teams go back to their normal race nights only British riders allowed at reserve in the top league.Allow a 45 points limit scrap the one eight point rule The Championship have a league with similar entrance fees to the Premiership, but significantly lower running costs. Why would they want to double their costs without increasing their income by joining a league as you describe? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Third Man Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 30 minutes ago, speedy bill said: One league any team who cant afford to run in it drops into the National League, Teams go back to their normal race nights only British riders allowed at reserve in the top league.Allow a 45 points limit scrap the one eight point rule , guest riders only allowed for missing any top two in averages ,others replaced by R/r or rider from own asset base. RIDERS WONT LIKE THIS BUT STRiCKED PAY RATE rule to be thrashed out before season ,limited time allowed for rider digging green light mounted by start line once it goes out riders allowed only 15 seconds to line up,any rider falling off at back when other team on a 5/1 and not clearing track when obviously he can to be deducted one point from his score but not the teams score at referees discretion .Team changes only allowed up to the end of August,starting rules unless obvious jump but if no tapes touched let go .No big gaps between meetings get back to speedway every week or at lest every two week at all tracks. What do you think about that lot folks Will only work if the averages are set at championship levels, or it will be too expensive for most clubs 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattK Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 8 minutes ago, The Third Man said: Will only work if the averages are set at championship levels, or it will be too expensive for most clubs Even if the averages were set at Championship levels, most Championship clubs would see their costs rise as they would no longer benefit from sharing the cost of riders who are doubling-up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waiheke1 Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 47 minutes ago, speedy bill said: One league any team who cant afford to run in it drops into the National League, Teams go back to their normal race nights only British riders allowed at reserve in the top league.Allow a 45 points limit scrap the one eight point rule , guest riders only allowed for missing any top two in averages ,others replaced by R/r or rider from own asset base. RIDERS WONT LIKE THIS BUT STRiCKED PAY RATE rule to be thrashed out before season ,limited time allowed for rider digging green light mounted by start line once it goes out riders allowed only 15 seconds to line up,any rider falling off at back when other team on a 5/1 and not clearing track when obviously he can to be deducted one point from his score but not the teams score at referees discretion .Team changes only allowed up to the end of August,starting rules unless obvious jump but if no tapes touched let go .No big gaps between meetings get back to speedway every week or at lest every two week at all tracks. What do you think about that lot folks Not sure how that deduction of point from riders score but not team score would work? Surely the team would just pay the rider for the deducted point? And would be great for average reduction. Seems to give an incentive not to clear the track Would have to go bsck to the old start procedure rules. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foamfence Posted October 15, 2018 Report Share Posted October 15, 2018 9 hours ago, MattK said: Even if the averages were set at Championship levels, most Championship clubs would see their costs rise as they would no longer benefit from sharing the cost of riders who are doubling-up. If doubling up becomes the norm, support will continue to decline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattK Posted October 15, 2018 Report Share Posted October 15, 2018 10 minutes ago, foamfence said: If doubling up becomes the norm, support will continue to decline. Why? I'm not aware of anyone who has stopped going to Swindon because Swindon's captain Nick Morris also rides for Lakeside. Granted, it is not an ideal situation, but the fact is that doubling-up reduces costs for teams in both leagues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foamfence Posted October 15, 2018 Report Share Posted October 15, 2018 27 minutes ago, MattK said: Why? I'm not aware of anyone who has stopped going to Swindon because Swindon's captain Nick Morris also rides for Lakeside. Granted, it is not an ideal situation, but the fact is that doubling-up reduces costs for teams in both leagues. It removes credibility, If you're happy with it fair enough, in regard to Swindon; I shouldn't be surprised if nobody goes there in the near future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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