What must 2019 bring (speak now or forever hold your peace)

[foamfence]

2 hours ago, bruno said:

Maybe it's time to try the Polish way with no average limits and no guests and survival of the fittist. Could be a disaster and the death knell for the sport. Then again the current systems a roaring success isn't it?

That's how it used to be, I'm not saying it was better or worse but the wealthier clubs would keep changing riders and those dropped would be loaned to teams who had room for them. You did get periods of dominance by clubs such as Wembley and Belle Vue but you also had far bigger crowds and a lot of local media interest when the big names were in town. You also had better links between top league clubs and the lower leagues and second halves for those riders wanting to progress.

[robbieblackadder fan club]

I think one league has to be a good shout as the class difference between the two leagues is non existent as the pl teams are full of cl riders anyway, how may of the worlds best riders ride here?.let them ride abroad, get our house in order make it a stronger product.

i haven’t been to any meetings this year for the first time in years as I just wasn’t bothered and looking from afar at teams full of guests and conference riders to replace the ones missing is really going to get me back, do I expect anything to happen ............before to long there will be no speedway........Nero and Rome springs to mind 

[Carlislecomet2]

3 hours ago, bruno said:

Maybe it's time to try the Polish way with no average limits and no guests and survival of the fittist. Could be a disaster and the death knell for the sport. Then again the current systems a roaring success isn't it? 

I presume that due to the profile of the sport in Poland there is enough money to spread around to keep their squads happy. What would happen in this country would be that the likes of Glasgow would buy up the top riders and walk the league every year.

I don't think there is a lot wrong with the rules and regulations of the sport. Maybe some tweaking here and there to simplify/clarify a few things and a new independent  governing body having the b*lls to ensure everyone sticks to them.

The sport is in desperate need of money through sponsorship which will only occur if the product is presented and marketed much better than it is at present.

We have the World champion which is something to be celebrated and I think BT Sport do a good job of presenting the GP's. If we had one league and they chose the live matches more carefully or maybe just had a weekly roundup and highlights package (a lot of races/meetings are out there on youtube/via the clubs already) it may generate a bit more interest.

But, like everything else in this world, it comes down to money.

[IronScorpion]

As others have pointed out, it is a numbers game but it is about the number of teams & number of riders available.  The Polish leagues are 8 teams with squads of 10 riders or more & some of these are never used. That is around 240 named riders that do not double up. I posted earlier that over these last 2 years we have used around 65 3.5+ riders so 8 rider squads could be used with 6 man teams.

  I also think NL riders should not be riding in the PL as there are not many of the likes of Bewley that can make it but bringing them through steadily, league to league, gaining more experience is the way to go. The likes of Kemp, Brennan & Flint are next in line but we have seen NL riders struggle to adapt in the CL this year.

If we make new plans, let us stick to them & make them work as over these last few years with the EDR(should have been used in middle league not top), 2 British riders per team(should still be in place or increased to 3) need time. The changing of rules really need thinking through by the SCB & the BSPA & tweaking to make it rigid & not half hearted(an example this week with the use of guests Morris & Ellis). Learn from previous years mistakes, rewrite them & set them in stone. There must be an unbiased group of ex referees & riders set up to sort this mess out.  

[singy13]

15 hours ago, Carlislecomet2 said:

How about Kingmoor in Carlisle? It has good transport links and was looked at recently as a possible venue for a new stadium for Carlisle United. It would certainly be handier for supporters of Edinburgh, Glasgow, Newcastle, Berwick and Redcar.

Neither Allerdale Borough Council or the good people of West Cumbria seem to be interested in speedway, and it would keep the sport in Cumbria.

Carlisle would be good..........don't knock all the west Cumbrians mind....some, but not enough granted, do love the Comets.

[leander]

16 hours ago, JCookie said:

Think you need to check the EL section as this very scenario was going to play out, until they fudged the 'rules'.

Regulation 18.10.6 No Rider, whose Team is in the Play-Offs may appear as a Guest in the Play-Offs

And

Supplementary Regulation 1810

Amendments to 2018 Regulations 18.2.4 to include all

SGB Premiership and Championship Competitions.

 A Rider may only guest for one team in any leg of a 2-legged competition (home and away).

 

[JCookie]

23 minutes ago, leander said:

Regulation 18.10.6 No Rider, whose Team is in the Play-Offs may appear as a Guest in the Play-Offs

And

Supplementary Regulation 1810

Amendments to 2018 Regulations 18.2.4 to include all

SGB Premiership and Championship Competitions.

 A Rider may only guest for one team in any leg of a 2-legged competition (home and away).

 

Yep, a supplementary regulation made to avoid the situation that we were about to see, more information here:

https://www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/sport/16966848.adam-ellis-to-guest-for-pirates-and-kings-lynn-in-play-off-final/

[4thbender]

6 hours ago, mikebv said:

I take it you must have read a leaked copy of some far reaching, root and branch investigation in to the future of the Sport RD?

No?

My apologies...

I just presumed you were quoting its final recommendation!!!

Now THERE's a coincidence!... With regard to "root and branch investigations," I've just come across this on a lesser visited forum on this site: THE PATHFINDER REPORT AND RECOMMENDATIONS 2018". I don't know who's written this but it has the appearance of something that could have been commissioned by the sport's authorities. It identifies all the major challenges facing the sport in the UK, contains a detailed analysis of speedway's current assets, and makes recommendations as to the way forward in 2019 (which all look eminently do-able.)

In short, it seems to recommend two leagues: a National League and an 18/20-team unified Premier/championship league, which it calls the British Speedway Champions League. Each of the teams in this league will sign a core of five premiership/championship riders plus a "reserve" team of 3 riders made up mainly from National League doublers-up. At the start of each match the 3 "reserve" riders from each team will compete in a 'B' team match over three heats, from which managers can then select two riders to make up the nos. 6 and 7 in the team proper. The League match will then follow over 13 heats. If I'm reading it correctly, guests and R/R will be completely outlawed!

The report then goes on to make some astute observations about where UK speedway is letting itself down as a marketable product and gives some really practical signposts as to how it might improve its marketing potential.

Overall it contains some radical and controversial suggestions but my view is that it reads like a breath of fresh air. If promoters have really started to think along these lines then our sport may yet even manage to drag itself into the 21st century.

THERE COULD BE HOPE EVEN YET! 

[mikebv]

1 hour ago, 4thbender said:

Now THERE's a coincidence!... With regard to "root and branch investigations," I've just come across this on a lesser visited forum on this site: THE PATHFINDER REPORT AND RECOMMENDATIONS 2018". I don't know who's written this but it has the appearance of something that could have been commissioned by the sport's authorities. It identifies all the major challenges facing the sport in the UK, contains a detailed analysis of speedway's current assets, and makes recommendations as to the way forward in 2019 (which all look eminently do-able.)

In short, it seems to recommend two leagues: a National League and an 18/20-team unified Premier/championship league, which it calls the British Speedway Champions League. Each of the teams in this league will sign a core of five premiership/championship riders plus a "reserve" team of 3 riders made up mainly from National League doublers-up. At the start of each match the 3 "reserve" riders from each team will compete in a 'B' team match over three heats, from which managers can then select two riders to make up the nos. 6 and 7 in the team proper. The League match will then follow over 13 heats. If I'm reading it correctly, guests and R/R will be completely outlawed!

The report then goes on to make some astute observations about where UK speedway is letting itself down as a marketable product and gives some really practical signposts as to how it might improve its marketing potential.

Overall it contains some radical and controversial suggestions but my view is that it reads like a breath of fresh air. If promoters have really started to think along these lines then our sport may yet even manage to drag itself into the 21st century.

THERE COULD BE HOPE EVEN YET! 

Read it a while back..

Some very astute observations as you say...

All though, (as per all previous astute observations made), will be totally ignored...

For me, the only chance the Sport has is to collectively market itself...

Stop spending thousands individually on riders whom the local populous have never heard of, and therefore have no wish to see ride, for a Speedway Team they don't know actually exists...

Instead, spend thousands nationally with a marketing company who may be able to make riders better known and, if nothing else, make the Teams and Sport better known within its own locale...

The NSS, for example, delivers great Speedway racing...

However many of the population even within a one mile radius of it, have never heard of the Belle Vue Aces, and have never heard of Speedway..

This I am sure can be said for the vast majority of tracks around the Country (the lack of awareness rather then the great Speedway possibly?!)...

Bottom line is....

If no one knows about you, no one will visit you...

And if that stays the case then you can have Tai, Emil, Bartosz and Majic lining up at the tapes..

The stadium will remain no where near full enough to pay for them..

 

[2ndbendbeerhut]

Go back to the 1998 season.....

Ipswich winning the treble but against some superb sides that strengthened up as the season progressed.  Their matches against Coventry were superb. Also remember Swindon and Wolves having great teams too. Unfortunately the Witches team had to be split up as what happens every year. After hearing about the great racing Sky came on board and British speedway has gone downhill since. What should have happened was for the points limit to be set at the winning teams limit and any team that wished to keep their 1-6 to do so the following year. Grow on what had happened and let the sport flourish... oh well 

[dontforgetthefueltapsbruv]

During the winter of 97 it was set that any team retaining their starting line up throughout the season would be allowed to keep it in place for the next season

Witches 98 meant that didnt even last 1 year......

[Terrace Grumbler]

12 hours ago, robbieblackadder fan club said:

I think one league has to be a good shout as the class difference between the two leagues is non existent as the pl teams are full of cl riders anyway, how may of the worlds best riders ride here?.let them ride abroad, get our house in order make it a stronger product.

i haven’t been to any meetings this year for the first time in years as I just wasn’t bothered and looking from afar at teams full of guests and conference riders to replace the ones missing is really going to get me back, do I expect anything to happen ............before to long there will be no speedway........Nero and Rome springs to mind 

"A good shout" that would  close Newcastle (see this week's SS). 

Still, as you've stopped going, you won't care. I assume you watch the Polish league of a Sunday afternoon - who's your team now?

[robbieblackadder fan club]

First and foremost I thought this forum was about opinions based on the principles of free speech, secondly where in my post do I have a go at Newcastle speedway and thirdly if you had bothered to read this post you would have noticed that someone else has already mentioned one league and I was agreeing, and by the way I also dont get the ss anymore so could not have read the article.

I do care as a matter of fact as I have attended speedway most of my life but with resources and family time a bit short I want to be entertained for my money so I have drifted into other entertainment on a Sunday which is my choice that all my family enjoy which is what speedway as a whole has to fight for and not just take it as a right, this is speedway as a sport, how may teams have turned up at brough this year full of guest r/r or conference riders without any consequences which will have an effect on the home team crowd, the sport as a whole is a mess and this is what the whole post is about and it needs sorting out before it dies.

i have watched polish and Swedish speedway on the free channel on sky where the leagues have the best riders in the world riding and I have really enjoyed it and the racing has been spot on

 

[Spl77]

13 hours ago, dontforgetthefueltapsbruv said:

During the winter of 97 it was set that any team retaining their starting line up throughout the season would be allowed to keep it in place for the next season

Witches 98 meant that didnt even last 1 year......

When that was decided the BSPA probably didn't bank on Ipswich winning it with the team that we had. Then guess what the green eyed monsters at the 98 AGM took it away..... Happens every year and every year the sport gets closer to the grave. Sad times

[Spl77]

Just seen this from Godfrey regarding the play off final last week. Question is what credibility? 

British Speedway vice-chairman Rob Godfrey said: “There was a serious risk of damaging the credibility of our sport because of guest riders switching clubs after the first leg.

[Terrace Grumbler]

54 minutes ago, robbieblackadder fan club said:

First and foremost I thought this forum was about opinions based on the principles of free speech, secondly where in my post do I have a go at Newcastle speedway and thirdly if you had bothered to read this post you would have noticed that someone else has already mentioned one league and I was agreeing, and by the way I also dont get the ss anymore so could not have read the article.

 

I almost give up. Where did  I try to deny free speech, or say you were having a go at Newcastle? I certainly didn't mean to. And what difference does it make if you were agreeing with what someone else has already said?

Let's stick to the facts, shall we? You say you want to see one big league. In this week's Speedway Star the Newcastle promoter explains that the club wouldn't be able to operate under that system. 

I'm wondering whether you're bothered...you've drifted into watching foreign speedway on tv (presumably it's Poland on Sundays) don't go to BP any longer and don't read the SS so you haven't seen what the promotion are saying; none of that should stop you spending time on here airing your views, of course. 

 

Edited October 14, 2018 by Terrace Grumbler
Still can't spell

[foamfence]

33 minutes ago, Terrace Grumbler said:

I almost give up. Where did  I try to deny free speech, or say you were having a go at Newcastle? I certainly didn't mean to. And what difference does it make if you were agreeing with what someone else has already said?

Let's stick to the facts, shall we? You say you want to see one big league. In this week's Speedway Star the Newcastle promoter explains that the club wouldn't be able to operate under that system. 

I'm wondering whether you're bothered...you've drifted into watching foreign speedway on tv (presumably it's Poland on Sundays) don't go to BP any longer and don't read the SS so you haven't seen what the promotion are saying; none of that should stop you spending time on here airing your views, of course. 

 

A lot of other clubs WOULD want it, that's why it has been considered at pre-AGM meetings.

[ch958]

44 minutes ago, Terrace Grumbler said:

I almost give up. Where did  I try to deny free speech, or say you were having a go at Newcastle? I certainly didn't mean to. And what difference does it make if you were agreeing with what someone else has already said?

Let's stick to the facts, shall we? You say you want to see one big league. In this week's Speedway Star the Newcastle promoter explains that the club wouldn't be able to operate under that system. 

I'm wondering whether you're bothered...you've drifted into watching foreign speedway on tv (presumably it's Poland on Sundays) don't go to BP any longer and don't read the SS so you haven't seen what the promotion are saying; none of that should stop you spending time on here airing your views, of course. 

 

of course they would if it was at Div 2 standard

[mikebv]

2 hours ago, foamfence said:

A lot of other clubs WOULD want it, that's why it has been considered at pre-AGM meetings.

Charles Darwin had a theory..

For a species or entity to evolve and keep in existence, it is reliant on that species or entity to continually get stronger and develop itself to help prevent its removal from the face of the earth..

To that end, he decided it was the 'Survival of the Fittest' that would lead that species or entity to grow. With the thought process being that the strength of its 'alpha example' would lead the overall continued evolution and growth of the whole species or entity..

Another eminent Scientist, Albert Einstein, suggested that doing the same thing over and over again and each time expecting a different result was actually a sign of insanity...

Both Darwin and Einstein have become revered by millions the world over through their work with their thoughts and findings influencing decision making and positively impacting billions of lives on a daily basis..

However....

British Speedway has a 'better idea' than the ones those two managed to come up with...

'Survival Of The Weakest' and 'There Is No Alternative' being what would appear to be its chief observations and belief....

If I am honest though, I am not entirely convinced Messrs Chapman and Godfrey, (and indeed the many others in charge over the past 20 years or so), will be held up in years to come with quite the same level of esteem and reverence for their ideas that 'Charlie and Bert' have received for theirs....

Maybe 'Quality not Quantity' could be a suggestion they may think about taking on board, as possibly could be 'Less is More'...?

 

Edited October 14, 2018 by mikebv

[The Third Man]

31 minutes ago, mikebv said:

Charles Darwin had a theory..

For a species or entity to evolve and keep in existence, it is reliant on that species or entity to continually get stronger and develop itself to help prevent its removal from the face of the earth..

To that end, he decided it was the 'Survival of the Fittest' that would lead that species or entity to grow. With the thought process being that the strength of its 'alpha example' would lead the overall continued evolution and growth of the whole species or entity..

Another eminent Scientist, Albert Einstein, suggested that doing the same thing over and over again and each time expecting a different result was actually a sign of insanity...

Both Darwin and Einstein have become revered by millions the world over through their work with their thoughts and findings influencing decision making and positively impacting billions of lives on a daily basis..

However....

British Speedway has a 'better idea' than the ones those two managed to come up with...

'Survival Of The Weakest' and 'There Is No Alternative' being what would appear to be its chief observations and belief....

If I am honest though, I am not entirely convinced Messrs Chapman and Godfrey, (and indeed the many others in charge over the past 20 years or so), will be held up in years to come with quite the same level of esteem and reverence for their ideas that 'Charlie and Bert' have received for theirs....

Maybe 'Quality not Quantity' could be a suggestion they may think about taking on board, as possibly could be 'Less is More'...?

 

I agree  with Einstein, and it seems we are going to go back to 2017 and hope it works this time, but survival of the fittest will result in only one team being left wont it?