One Big League - Problem Solved

[waytogo28]

12 hours ago, PHILIPRISING said:

NOT sure they have seven! Was suggested that only five have committed ... Belle Vue, Kings Lynn, Poole, Swindon and Wolves

These scenarios such as a five-team league ( no-one could have taken that seriously even at the BSPA ) make for a great new sit-com outline. You could have mikebv's idea of a four-team league ( in a four-team tournament format ) because Swindon are unlikely to have a stadium or a track on that site to race on, are they? Not unless all the new homeowners were speedway fans already.

[waytogo28]

14 hours ago, PHILIPRISING said:

TWO plus NL

So what would change if they go ahead with that idea? 2018 revisited. More supporters drift away and the 2019 AGM will be another "last chance saloon". Let's hope their joined up thinking is better than that,

[Fromafar]

13 hours ago, PHILIPRISING said:

NOT sure they have seven! Was suggested that only five have committed ... Belle Vue, Kings Lynn, Poole, Swindon and Wolves

 

Wonder what Teams they will attempt to sucker this time ,just like they did in the early 90's. Call their  bluff and tell them they have to move down would be my answer.Desperate times for speedway in GB.

[Grachan]

6 minutes ago, Fromafar said:

Wonder what Teams they will attempt to sucker this time ,just like they did in the early 90's. Call their  bluff and tell them they have to move down would be my answer.Desperate times for speedway in GB.

Typical attitude that will get us nowhere. They have to work together, not see each other as competitors.

If those 5 clubs joined with the CL clubs, it would not be a case of anyone moving up or down. That would then be the top league.

 

[Fromafar]

1 minute ago, Grachan said:

Typical attitude that will get us nowhere. They have to work together, not see each other as competitors.

If those 5 clubs joined with the CL clubs, it would not be a case of anyone moving up or down. That would then be the top league.

 

At least you get the gist of my comment

[SteveLyric2]

14 hours ago, PHILIPRISING said:

NOT sure they have seven! Was suggested that only five have committed ... Belle Vue, Kings Lynn, Poole, Swindon and Wolves

 

Maybe with Somerset and Leicester/Sheffield thats more to do with the fixed race night debate than anything else?!

[GWC]

A big league of 18 could become unworkable once injuries kick in but the sport needs to combine the PL and CL somehow.

A larger PL of 14 might be better and then the NL would become a stronger league as well and get more recognition.

Unfortunately clubs like BV colts Buxton and Cradley would drop out.

[ch958]

1 hour ago, GWC said:

A big league of 18 could become unworkable once injuries kick in but the sport needs to combine the PL and CL somehow.

A larger PL of 14 might be better and then the NL would become a stronger league as well and get more recognition.

Unfortunately clubs like BV colts Buxton and Cradley would drop out.

well how did it work when the BL was formed? Was it unworkable then? No

[Daniel Smith]

1 hour ago, ch958 said:

well how did it work when the BL was formed? Was it unworkable then? No

But the world was our oyster then when we had the luxury of any rider in the World. Now it's difficult to get anybody to commit to British Speedway. So yes, one big league is TOTALLY unworkable once rider's start to get injured.

[BWitcher]

4 minutes ago, Daniel Smith said:

But the world was our oyster then when we had the luxury of any rider in the World. Now it's difficult to get anybody to commit to British Speedway. So yes, one big league is TOTALLY unworkable once rider's start to get injured.

No it isn't.

I've seen junior riders such as David Haynes, Matt Cartmell, Ade Hoole riding in the top flight in years when the league was way stronger. They simply got promoted to No 7 when required.

[Daniel Smith]

I await with baited breath to see 18 teams built to 40-45 averages and see how many rider's are left over, or teams that can't even make up the average at all.

[BWitcher]

36 minutes ago, Daniel Smith said:

I await with baited breath to see 18 teams built to 40-45 averages and see how many rider's are left over, or teams that can't even make up the average at all.

That problem lasts for precisely one season. Then hey presto, everyone has a fresh new average applicable to the league size.

All you have to do is get the initial team building average correct. 

 

[Grachan]

Suppose there was a CL points limit of 42.5 set. A typical Swindon side might be:

Tobiasz Musielak 8.59
Adam Ellis 8.20
David Bellego 7.80
Stefan Nielsen 6.82
Zach Wajtknecht 5.31
Connor Mountain 3.62
Anders Rowe 2.00
 
 42.34

(Providing my averages are correct, that's 6 "Swindon" riders and whoever fitted in at the end!)

That immediately leaves Nick Morris free to ride for Lakeside/Rye House, plus Troy Bachelor also free.

And surely there are riders out there in Europe and in the NL that can also be used. There's one 2018 NL rider right there in the Swindon team.

 

[Daniel Smith]

52 minutes ago, BWitcher said:

That problem lasts for precisely one season. Then hey presto, everyone has a fresh new average applicable to the league size.

All you have to do is get the initial team building average correct. 

 

But people are missing the point.

Even if team building was unlimited, when you factor in injuries and retirements things start to get messy.

It's ok saying employ NL rider's but when ends don't meet for them and they have to quit (which many do) then there's an extra problem for clubs, in both the 1 big league and the NL.

Then also you'll have the problem of clubs miles behind in the league table going out of business because fans won't justify paying for it when things are going so badly.

Then we're shrinking the sport in this country even further, creating a less viable product.

I think we have to find a solution for 3 leagues. Bring at least another few clubs up from the Championship. The Premiership needs to run with a minimum of 10 teams. The wages at 2 paticular Championship clubs must be just as high as some pay in the Premiership. Ipswich and Glasgow spring to mind. For the top league also, I think the Bates are looking and/or being asked to swap Leicester for Sheffield. The latter being more financially stable.

It's ok just knocking teams up, or saying teams can only jave 1 or 2 over 8 etc etc but some rider's will or won't ride for certain clubs.

There are far to many risk factors currently to push 1 big league.

May be, and it's a little more out their, that every Premiership club has to have a tie in with a Championship club and they have to share 3 rider's per team. Any injuries has to come from the tie in club first. Something like that anyway. 

 

 

[AndyK86]

13 minutes ago, Daniel Smith said:

But people are missing the point.

Even if team building was unlimited, when you factor in injuries and retirements things start to get messy.

It's ok saying employ NL rider's but when ends don't meet for them and they have to quit (which many do) then there's an extra problem for clubs, in both the 1 big league and the NL.

Then also you'll have the problem of clubs miles behind in the league table going out of business because fans won't justify paying for it when things are going so badly.

Then we're shrinking the sport in this country even further, creating a less viable product.

I think we have to find a solution for 3 leagues. Bring at least another few clubs up from the Championship. The Premiership needs to run with a minimum of 10 teams. The wages at 2 paticular Championship clubs must be just as high as some pay in the Premiership. Ipswich and Glasgow spring to mind. For the top league also, I think the Bates are looking and/or being asked to swap Leicester for Sheffield. The latter being more financially stable.

It's ok just knocking teams up, or saying teams can only jave 1 or 2 over 8 etc etc but some rider's will or won't ride for certain clubs.

There are far to many risk factors currently to push 1 big league.

May be, and it's a little more out their, that every Premiership club has to have a tie in with a Championship club and they have to share 3 rider's per team. Any injuries has to come from the tie in club first. Something like that anyway. 

 

 

And with the league's as they are you have injuries, stupid doubling up that nobody likes etc

It is time make the sport more appealing, clearly the current system is not working so time to be more radical.

 

[Daniel Smith]

The most radical thing that needs to happen is to move Ipswich, Peterborough, Glasgow and Sheffield to the top division. 1 big league will shut clubs down at a more rapid rate than today. 

I'm giving this thread a wide birth now because the 1 big league seems to be the saviour to the sport with no real means of how behind it, so no more needs to be discussed. 

[Sings4Speedway]

So far the consensus is pretty much straight forward entice more GP riders and overseas based riders, reduce the wages & admission fees, don't dilute the product but do include NL riders who are just settling into heat leader roles, add extra fixtures so matches can be run every week and hope for once they all get completed before a cut off date that is drawn out of a hat. Simple really.  

[Tsunami]

56 minutes ago, Sings4Speedway said:

So far the consensus is pretty much straight forward entice more GP riders and overseas based riders, reduce the wages & admission fees, don't dilute the product but do include NL riders who are just settling into heat leader roles, add extra fixtures so matches can be run every week and hope for once they all get completed before a cut off date that is drawn out of a hat. Simple really.  

Agreed.  And then some on here call Promoters useless. 

[ch958]

1 hour ago, Daniel Smith said:

The most radical thing that needs to happen is to move Ipswich, Peterborough, Glasgow and Sheffield to the top division. 1 big league will shut clubs down at a more rapid rate than today. 

I'm giving this thread a wide birth now because the 1 big league seems to be the saviour to the sport with no real means of how behind it, so no more needs to be discussed. 

what if Peterboro, Ipswich, Glasgow and Sheffield don't want to go bust, or at least risk it with massively increased outlay and no guarantee of a return in Div 1. Thy'd probably do it if the averages were brought down but then they's be more or less at div 2 level anyway!!!

[Simonh]

Having visited a number of Swedish and Danish tracks this summer...

1. Both countries are struggling to get people through the gate, apart from GP and key matches

2. Speedway structured in a different way with Community teams and real investment from local people (volunteers), and companies, sponsorship. Eg Vetlanda programme was 86 reading pages, mainly of adverts, but also good quality features. This makes finding stuff hard as it is assumed you know the team names for each club. (eg fixtures would be Lions v Pirates)

3. Entrance fees were cheaper than uk in both countries.

4. Fans of both countries have similar concerns, speaking to a promotion (in Sweden's equivalent of our championship), they believed their costs were about a quarter of the higher league in Sweden. (previously relegated, talking from experience)

5. Meetings well ran, lots of track work, started on time, in the main good racing. Range of track shapes, surfaces, etc

6. Significantly less meetings than uk, amateur and practice leagues below pro/semi pro structures. Lots of doubling up!

So where may this all go?

Speedway dies?

Just GP Speedway? Poland? if so where do the GP riders of the future get unto speed?

I could envisage a European super league, with major city teams to suppliment the Gp, Semi pro domestic league/s.

Cost reduction...Sealed engines? standard equipment? Limit of bikes per meeting per team? (rather like the tyres rules of old).

Impact of Brexit? removal of EU permits/standardisation of rules?

I'd suggest we need some sort of commission with an overarching review. If we don't cap vested interests we are likely to end with the first option.