Poole 2019

[LisaColette]

I can see both sides with the Harris debate. But if Matt is struggling to get a 'superstar' over then I think Harris is worth sticking with. Maybe go with a strength in depth team like last season. 

[wtf]

If you are looking for riders who can put a point on their average, are uk based, your own assets, ride your own track pretty well, and can ride all the away tracks well. I wouldn't be surprised if Charles Wright ended up at Poole. On a 5.1 or thereabouts I'd say he would be pretty good value.

[SteveLyric2]

Matt's comments in the Echo today just about nail it!!

[GWC]

1 hour ago, Skidder1 said:

Matt's comments in the Echo today just about nail it!!

Yes and he continues to live in his own little ‘speedway bubble’ .

He is the owner of assets that will probably never ride in the UK again sadly.

[STEVEHOLS54]

1 hour ago, Skidder1 said:

Matt's comments in the Echo today just about nail it!!

Indeed it does.

Don't have a team sponsor - Seems very little money - Of course Uk can't compete with Poland. We all know that and yes hardly surprising most don't want to risk their lucrative POl contracts to ride here for much lower money with the inherent risks involved. Vaculik a prime example of a rider who could have lost all of 2018 with that nasty injury early doors. Am sure Gorzow were furious and it could have cost him a fortune. Sure he won't be back on these shores again.

But Ford is one of the more fortunate ones even without a main sponsor currently - He has over the years obtained plenty of assets so he can still sign the riders to field a half decent team if you factor in the likes of Hans Andersen - Kenneth Bjerre - Chris & Jack Holder and others. Can  even include NKI but doubt he would.

I think the big bucks man he referred to was probably Woryna who is the Star in Rybnik but maybe also Kurtz is going to earn big. 

Let's be honest the top guys only ride here as it covers expenses and some live here. For example Doyle & NKI. If you can cover your costs and travelling expenses around Europe from what you earn from UK then the money you earn in POL/SWE is not drained by lots of expenses.

Of course what we don't know is if his comments are also a veiled threat as to whether he can even still afford the likes of Woryna _ Holders etc as they are all riding POL/SWE and maybe won't come cheap.

Sounds like we can discount a top 8 point plus man then. Still faces a dilemma though as he has to still shed 2.64 points from this seasons team.

[foreverblue]

1 hour ago, STEVEHOLS54 said:

Indeed it does.

Don't have a team sponsor - Seems very little money - Of course Uk can't compete with Poland. We all know that and yes hardly surprising most don't want to risk their lucrative POl contracts to ride here for much lower money with the inherent risks involved. Vaculik a prime example of a rider who could have lost all of 2018 with that nasty injury early doors. Am sure Gorzow were furious and it could have cost him a fortune. Sure he won't be back on these shores again.

But Ford is one of the more fortunate ones even without a main sponsor currently - He has over the years obtained plenty of assets so he can still sign the riders to field a half decent team if you factor in the likes of Hans Andersen - Kenneth Bjerre - Chris & Jack Holder and others. Can  even include NKI but doubt he would.

I think the big bucks man he referred to was probably Woryna who is the Star in Rybnik but maybe also Kurtz is going to earn big. 

Let's be honest the top guys only ride here as it covers expenses and some live here. For example Doyle & NKI. If you can cover your costs and travelling expenses around Europe from what you earn from UK then the money you earn in POL/SWE is not drained by lots of expenses.

Of course what we don't know is if his comments are also a veiled threat as to whether he can even still afford the likes of Woryna _ Holders etc as they are all riding POL/SWE and maybe won't come cheap.

Sounds like we can discount a top 8 point plus man then. Still faces a dilemma though as he has to still shed 2.64 points from this seasons team.

If we are to build this team on a strength in depth as we can't afford top riders and it seems only Doyle, NKI are interested then riders like Hans, Holder and Harris should be top of the list.

I don't think Ford is fortunate he has planned well and obtained many assets, some of whom will never ride for us again and some who will never ride for us ever but because he has built a large asset base he always gets plenty of loan fees and most of his assets cost very little.

[STEVEHOLS54]

2 hours ago, foreverblue said:

If we are to build this team on a strength in depth as we can't afford top riders and it seems only Doyle, NKI are interested then riders like Hans, Holder and Harris should be top of the list.

I don't think Ford is fortunate he has planned well and obtained many assets, some of whom will never ride for us again and some who will never ride for us ever but because he has built a large asset base he always gets plenty of loan fees and most of his assets cost very little.

When I said fortunate, I meant from the current perspective. If the team has no main team sponsor - with virtually nothing from TV, having by his on words taken a massive financial hit in 2018 with the combination of the washout big Anniv meeting - other  early season washouts - lower crowds due to both an inept first half of the season and the dropping of crowds in general throughout UK, then he is indeed in the fortunate position of cleverly having purchased or had passed on various rider assets that may well serve him well in 2019 in the days of  having tighten the purse strings.

Under such circumstances he can if need be call on such assets to ride for Poole (such as Hans Anderson/Holders etc) or as you say obtain loan fees to help finance the club in these dark times.

Having said that and much as I appreciate the fact sponsors financed part of the trip, one is never going to get much sympathy after a heavily advertised and lauded over Formula 1 trip to Abu Dhabi for the whole team/manager which Matt also said was his third or fourth trip to the event in recent times. Being Matt's main source of income one has to say it is indeed a sport where finance is tight.

[foreverblue]

13 minutes ago, STEVEHOLS54 said:

When I said fortunate, I meant from the current perspective. If the team has no main team sponsor - with virtually nothing from TV, having by his on words taken a massive financial hit in 2018 with the combination of the washout big Anniv meeting - other  early season washouts - lower crowds due to both an inept first half of the season and the dropping of crowds in general throughout UK, then he is indeed in the fortunate position of cleverly having purchased or had passed on various rider assets that may well serve him well in 2019 in the days of  having tighten the purse strings.

Under such circumstances he can if need be call on such assets to ride for Poole (such as Hans Anderson/Holders etc) or as you say obtain loan fees to help finance the club in these dark times.

Having said that and much as I appreciate the fact sponsors financed part of the trip, one is never going to get much sympathy after a heavily advertised and lauded over Formula 1 trip to Abu Dhabi for the whole team/manager which Matt also said was his third or fourth trip to the event in recent times. Being Matt's main source of income one has to say it is indeed a sport where finance is tight.

I agree the Abu Dhabi trip indicates that the club finds itself in a better financial position than most in these trying times but in order to give something back to the fans that have followed the team home and away I would have thought a celebration evening could have been organised.

[STEVEHOLS54]

3 minutes ago, foreverblue said:

I agree the Abu Dhabi trip indicates that the club finds itself in a better financial position than most in these trying times but in order to give something back to the fans that have followed the team home and away I would have thought a celebration evening could have been organised.

Don't disagree.

Matt can be his own worse enemy. he has become a master of playing the local media (especially in the Echo) and wherever he can to gain the widest possible audience.. He bleats loud and clear in putting Poole Speedway into the media to gain max exposure. He has to be applauded in many senses but it can also be a negative. 

He was open when he was only to willing to share with all that 2018 had lost him well into 6  figure well before the season had ended and I think even before the play offs. So that means well in excess of £100,000 upwards. Well I am sure all the hype and guests flown in from all over Europe for the early season 70th Anniv meeting with hotel bills/flights and god knows how many other costs related took a fair chunk of that even before season started with no crowd income to offset at least part of it. Factor in rain offs - track problem cancellations, poor match results to mid season and falling crowds and there you go.

Therefore a much hyped and no doubt very expensive  jolly up for the team and Manager/owner with some partners plus some sponsors with not even a mention of a thank you to the supporters via an end of season do, must have gone down well with the locals. Lasting 4 days will all expenses paid incl flights - food/drink - entertainment - in the no doubt expensive racing village with World renowned pop stars of now and the past and no doubt decent Hotel accommodation to boot.

Now I know that some sponsors footed some of the bill so thanks to those guys. But even so when you consider the Club allegedly lost so much money with Matt also openly saying finance is tight also with as it stands NO main Team Sponsor signed or even in sight, then it is a bit rich that the supporters who are the life blood of the sport don't even get a celebration bevvy up in recognition. Could you imagine a Football team winning the League but not parading for the fans ??

I don't begrudge them their trip and good luck to anyone who can enjoy such luxuries, but at a time when the sport is almost potless it is a bit rich to then come back and your first real media article bestows the lack of money and POL pricing you out of the top riders. It sounded like he was letting the fans down gently on team expectations for 2019. No doubt he also wants to keep a lid on expenditure for 2019 as he is still confident/hopeful in flogging the Club after next season. Yeah fat chance at his inflated idea of what a speedway club is worth.

Hopefully we will still get a competitive team in 2019 as after all he has enough team assets in riders to call upon. We will no doubt see over the coming weeks - Hopefully.

[A ORLOV]

11 minutes ago, STEVEHOLS54 said:

Don't disagree.

Matt can be his own worse enemy. he has become a master of playing the local media (especially in the Echo) and wherever he can to gain the widest possible audience.. He bleats loud and clear in putting Poole Speedway into the media to gain max exposure. He has to be applauded in many senses but it can also be a negative. 

He was open when he was only to willing to share with all that 2018 had lost him well into 6  figure well before the season had ended and I think even before the play offs. So that means well in excess of £100,000 upwards. Well I am sure all the hype and guests flown in from all over Europe for the early season 70th Anniv meeting with hotel bills/flights and god knows how many other costs related took a fair chunk of that even before season started with no crowd income to offset at least part of it. Factor in rain offs - track problem cancellations, poor match results to mid season and falling crowds and there you go.

Therefore a much hyped and no doubt very expensive  jolly up for the team and Manager/owner with some partners plus some sponsors with not even a mention of a thank you to the supporters via an end of season do, must have gone down well with the locals. Lasting 4 days will all expenses paid incl flights - food/drink - entertainment - in the no doubt expensive racing village with World renowned pop stars of now and the past and no doubt decent Hotel accommodation to boot.

Now I know that some sponsors footed some of the bill so thanks to those guys. But even so when you consider the Club allegedly lost so much money with Matt also openly saying finance is tight also with as it stands NO main Team Sponsor signed or even in sight, then it is a bit rich that the supporters who are the life blood of the sport don't even get a celebration bevvy up in recognition. Could you imagine a Football team winning the League but not parading for the fans ??

I don't begrudge them their trip and good luck to anyone who can enjoy such luxuries, but at a time when the sport is almost potless it is a bit rich to then come back and your first real media article bestows the lack of money and POL pricing you out of the top riders. It sounded like he was letting the fans down gently on team expectations for 2019. No doubt he also wants to keep a lid on expenditure for 2019 as he is still confident/hopeful in flogging the Club after next season. Yeah fat chance at his inflated idea of what a speedway club is worth.

Hopefully we will still get a competitive team in 2019 as after all he has enough team assets in riders to call upon. We will no doubt see over the coming weeks - Hopefully.

Yet some claim the club is work a lot of money !!!, not if it makes that sort of loss.

[poolebolton]

Ford didn't make a loss. 

He openly said that its a club that makes a profit and continues to do so. Wasn't the biggest profit but he still made one. 

[STEVEHOLS54]

8 minutes ago, A ORLOV said:

Yet some claim the club is work a lot of money !!!, not if it makes that sort of loss.

If it was worth so much than I am sure Matt would have sold it by now.

I saw figure of £250k plus mentioned. How true that was I don't know but for what ???. In  these days where many argue the sport is on its knees and going nowhere I can't see some charitable soul paying that much money or anywhere near it.

Don't get me wrong. I think Matt has done a brilliant job for Poole over the years. Many like him and some don't. He has always been one step ahead many times in team selection and we have seen some great riders at Poole over the years. But the sport is on a downward curve in most peoples eyes (except the BSPA who seem to have a rose tinted view of the sport).

Ask yourself where the Prem would be for 2019 had Chapman not purchased Ips/Peter . Neither in my opinion would have come up and for sure Som/Leic would have dropped anyway due to lack of finance/losses and not having choice of race night. Would have left only 5 Prem teams with loss of the small bit of money coming into the sport from TV.

[STEVEHOLS54]

5 minutes ago, poolebolton said:

Ford didn't make a loss. 

He openly said that its a club that makes a profit and continues to do so. Wasn't the biggest profit but he still made one. 

Sorry PB but disagree.

Matt said in an article during the  season that he/the club had lost six figures this season with all the problems of 70th Anniv meeting and all the cancellations. Now who lost that money - the club - Matt Ford himself ??. Matt owns the club meaning surely he didnt lose it  from his own fortune. It must be the club. 

[STEVEHOLS54]

7 minutes ago, STEVEHOLS54 said:

Sorry PB but disagree.

Matt said in an article during the  season that he/the club had lost six figures this season with all the problems of 70th Anniv meeting and all the cancellations. Now who lost that money - the club - Matt Ford himself ??. Matt owns the club meaning surely he didnt lose it  from his own fortune. It must be the club. 

Apologies PB I was a bit out on the money lost.

It was in fact a large five figure sum and that was as of the 3rd week of July so not counting any other mounting losses (if any) or profits (if any) after that.

I quote you Matt's exact words from the Evening Echo release of 22nd July.

But the loss of those meetings saw us start the season in the second week of April and it had a huge impact on the club financially.

“It was a substantial loss – a large five-figure sum – and one I will not be able to recoup. It wasn’t only what it cost the club but also the loss of potential revenue and profit.

To me a large five figure sum could be say from £70k upwards in my opinion. Plus did he make money in the second half of the season as many were saying crowds were not what they used to be.

Maybe the play offs gave back some profit but I question how much considering what revenue say a crowd of 2000 would generate after expenses and after deducting season tickets - pensioner discounts and kids lower admission. Even Matt said he would not be able to recoup such losses.

[poolebolton]

I think the success of the title means he would have a made a profit. They were big crowds. 

[STEVEHOLS54]

5 minutes ago, poolebolton said:

I think the success of the title means he would have a made a profit. They were big crowds. 

Hope for his and the clubs sake they were able to wipe at least part of it out.

Nobody wants to see any club lose money  especially when its the one you support. I may be some 3.5 hours away from Poole being in Chelmsford but they are still my modern day club and rekindled my interest in the sport big time (not that i ever lost my love of Speedway).

I am sure Matt will do his level best to give us the best team he can within the financial restraints he has and that pesky 2.64 points he needs to drop off the current team to get within the 42.50 point limit. There will have to be 2 changes at least anyway as he can't jiggle it any other way even if he wanted to keep all of last seasons team. Maybe even 3 will go to get the team he and hopefully we would like to see in 2019.

Roll on the team announcements. He has said before he likes to get his teams sorted by xmas so let's hope the Team Sponsor situation doesn't put the dampener on that one.

[scottyfan]

Just to throw a name into the hat for 2019.....How about Hans Andersen??

Edited November 28, 2018 by scottyfan

[STEVEHOLS54]

8 minutes ago, scottyfan said:

Just to through a name into the hat for 2019.....How about Hans Andersen??

Was thinking similar. Is an asset and think wanted to stay at Poole. Similar to Harris situation but maybe a more consistent high end scorer and on lower than Harris GSA by 0.22. My fear is whether we will ever win a League Champ with Hans in the team and we all know he is riding out his twilight years with as many clubs as poss so up to 4 per week. I know he is conditioned to it but has too many up and down rides as travelling takes it toll during peak season. Not even incl all the SEC/SGP and DK Championship qualifiers to boot.

Wouldn't discount him and PERHAPS that slightly lower GSA may have a bearing.

Would dearly love to know if one or both Holders will play any part, Nobody on the forum seem's to know what Chris's situ is or even if he intends to ride UK anyway in 2019. Also what about Jack who is also an asset and no Somerset in the equation this year.

As usual more questions than answers. Still in favour of my idea of 2 young Aussies I named the other as reserves Pickering/Stewart and moving up with Jakobsen/Woyna/Kurtz/Jack Holder and Chris Holder (even if Chris was re-evaluated at 8 he would scrape in by o.o8 of a point into the 42.50 limit. Its a young and exciting sounding  squad with scope to improve even if not initially a league winning team. Who wins it anyway frmo March to July ?? or even Sept for that matter. Top 4 is where you need to be.

Other permutations are of course available ;-)

[scottyfan]

I would say Nicolai Klindt is virtually a certain starter for 2019.

[SteveLyric2]

19 minutes ago, STEVEHOLS54 said:

Was thinking similar. Is an asset and think wanted to stay at Poole. Similar to Harris situation but maybe a more consistent high end scorer and on lower than Harris GSA by 0.22. My fear is whether we will ever win a League Champ with Hans in the team and we all know he is riding out his twilight years with as many clubs as poss so up to 4 per week. I know he is conditioned to it but has too many up and down rides as travelling takes it toll during peak season. Not even incl all the SEC/SGP and DK Championship qualifiers to boot.

Wouldn't discount him and PERHAPS that slightly lower GSA may have a bearing.

Would dearly love to know if one or both Holders will play any part, Nobody on the forum seem's to know what Chris's situ is or even if he intends to ride UK anyway in 2019. Also what about Jack who is also an asset and no Somerset in the equation this year.

As usual more questions than answers. Still in favour of my idea of 2 young Aussies I named the other as reserves Pickering/Stewart and moving up with Jakobsen/Woyna/Kurtz/Jack Holder and Chris Holder (even if Chris was re-evaluated at 8 he would scrape in by o.o8 of a point into the 42.50 limit. Its a young and exciting sounding  squad with scope to improve even if not initially a league winning team. Who wins it anyway frmo March to July ?? or even Sept for that matter. Top 4 is where you need to be.

Other permutations are of course available ;-)

When Matt and the 'volunteers' were at the track to take the air fence down for the winter, he stated that with everything Chris Holder had had to put up with in the past year it would be highly unlikely that he would race UK this coming year.  Not sure whether the visa issue is still a [problem?