ruckerroo Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 Plenty of doom n gloom in speedway at the moment ,but in its guise as the 3rd tier does this league have any future long term?. As in most divisions money definitely talks, weve got a chasm between good and bad sides and it seems to be growing year on year. One could argue that maybe Eastbourne, brum and possibly mildy or even kent if they sorted the curfew would be capable and have the facilities to move up a division if required. Weve got sides that are struggling badly , buxton , the iow despite the best promotion are struggling to be competitive , Coventry are in a permanent state of flux, moving on to stoke that really are a bit of a disgrace in all honesty with never ending track issues and a poor side. Plymouth, despite its outpost and terrible injuries seem to be doing ok . What happen if sides in the championship go pop and there is lots of restructuring to be done?. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*JJ Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 I would have thought that, with a couple of exceptions, the National League is very successful at the moment. Certainly, I for one am enjoying it just as much as when we were in the two other leagues (if not more). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
25yearfan Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 The 3rd Division in its many guises has survived since 1994, even in 1995 and 96 when it became the 2nd tier because the usual top 2 Leagues amalgamated and in 1998 when the League membership dropped to 5 tracks! The trouble in recent years has been the inclusion of ex top flight clubs that have had the extra clout to outcompete against the more grassroots clubs in the Division. But without the 3rd tier, these ex top flight clubs would have folded and indeed all of the others wouldn't be running. The ex top flight clubs, Birmingham, Eastbourne and Coventry need competitive teams in order to attract viable crowds. My local NL team Mildenhall are in the same boat as well cause you'd lose half the regular crowd at West Row with a poor team. Plymouth and IoW struggle to attract riders because of their locations and Buxton is run on a shoe string budget so lose potential riders to wealthier clubs. Kent are competitive and viable, Belle Vue are the only remaining "reserve team" from a higher League track left in the NL and seem to do OK. Stoke with its middle of the Country location, decent shaped track and Saturday race night should be in a good position to be highly competitive but the dreadfully poor way its run means that's not the case and that place has been in sharp decline ever since they left the 2nd tier which was before the above mentioned 3 ex top flight clubs dropped down. Another concern of mine is the lack of 2nd half's at many tracks which results in less opportunities for riders trying to make their way! Whilst we are in tricky times (when hasn't British speedway been in tricky times in the last 36 years?) I'm sure the bottom Division will continue to exist! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurnTwo Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 Personally British Speedway should be one big league and one league consisting of about 25 teams then there is a training league for tracks that aren’t really capable of holding higher tier racing (financially) such as: Buxton Stoke IOW and having the other development teams run at tracks for them to have that large league eg Weymouth at poole, reading at Swindon, covernty at Leicester, that league should be unpaid and the big league should be a mix of all riders from all 3 leagues bearing in mind there will be no doubling up etc then all riders will be in with a job. Pay grades should be bought down. If the top riders don’t want to ride over here then don’t make them ride over here use a british rider that needs the rides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argos Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 41 minutes ago, 25yearfan said: The 3rd Division in its many guises has survived since 1994, even in 1995 and 96 when it became the 2nd tier because the usual top 2 Leagues amalgamated and in 1998 when the League membership dropped to 5 tracks! The trouble in recent years has been the inclusion of ex top flight clubs that have had the extra clout to outcompete against the more grassroots clubs in the Division. But without the 3rd tier, these ex top flight clubs would have folded and indeed all of the others wouldn't be running. The ex top flight clubs, Birmingham, Eastbourne and Coventry need competitive teams in order to attract viable crowds. My local NL team Mildenhall are in the same boat as well cause you'd lose half the regular crowd at West Row with a poor team. Plymouth and IoW struggle to attract riders because of their locations and Buxton is run on a shoe string budget so lose potential riders to wealthier clubs. Kent are competitive and viable, Belle Vue are the only remaining "reserve team" from a higher League track left in the NL and seem to do OK. Stoke with its middle of the Country location, decent shaped track and Saturday race night should be in a good position to be highly competitive but the dreadfully poor way its run means that's not the case and that place has been in sharp decline ever since they left the 2nd tier which was before the above mentioned 3 ex top flight clubs dropped down. Another concern of mine is the lack of 2nd half's at many tracks which results in less opportunities for riders trying to make their way! Whilst we are in tricky times (when hasn't British speedway been in tricky times in the last 36 years?) I'm sure the bottom Division will continue to exist! What an excellent Post 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foamfence Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 I certainly think the third tier needs to prioritise the development of young or new riders, there are far too many professionals making a career out of something that was never meant to be like that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityrebel Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 When the standard comes down in the top two leagues, some team places might become available for those professional juniors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 Many good points expressed so far & it's vital to see the new blood coming through. Ultimately though, the "third tier" is just like any other business - If it's not an attractive product with competitive racing, there won't be enough punters through the gate to make it viable. All down to dosh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brummie Kev Posted August 19, 2018 Report Share Posted August 19, 2018 (edited) Why cant they bring in a rule where every National League club must have one of their reserve slots occupied by an SDL/NDL or MDL rider. We had Arran Butcher for a large part of year hardly scoring a point but what hope in hell has he got against the likes Kemp or Marson when Mildenhall were in town earlier in the season. At least make it more even, we want to give chances to the SDL/NDL/MDL riders but unless their a freak like Kemp, its all about giving them confidence to aid their development. Also I think introducing that rule would partly help with the chronic rider shortage in this league, it may mean more riders currently out of work but as we all know injuries happen sadly. There's times when you need to make a change and clearly now theres only junior league riders available who will always find it tough against more established NL reserves.. Edited August 19, 2018 by Brummie Kev Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sings4Speedway Posted August 20, 2018 Report Share Posted August 20, 2018 A quick glance through the current NL sides shows almost half the riders competing have ridden in M/SDL / NJL at some point. Which makes it all the more surprising that many of the teams competing have limited interest in hosting one of these sides. Even some who do host them have no active input into running the sides and yet year on year there will be comments about the limited number of riders ready to make the step up into NL racing despite it being clear that those who are given the opportunities and guidance can progress strongly in the sport. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GiveusaB Posted August 20, 2018 Report Share Posted August 20, 2018 If this League doesn't have a future then I'd seriously be worried about the Premier League ? I've not seen one Premier League meeting this season that's been as good as some of the NL meetings I've seen ? Yes, they're ten times quicker, but nowhere near as entertaining ....imo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teaboy279 Posted August 20, 2018 Report Share Posted August 20, 2018 I heard on last week's speedway tavern, the Nigel Pearson had suggested clubs like Brum Eastbourne and Kent were to join a revamped 2nd tier. Think it needs addressing and announced as soon as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevec Posted August 20, 2018 Report Share Posted August 20, 2018 Its such a shame we have these discussions every year. It really isn't just this league in question. I mean, how can you take a league seriously when a team in the bottom half of the table (4th) could win the title? I watched 'once there was a jolly swagman' the other day and then watched some youtube videos of speedway back in the heyday. Jeez, it would be amazing to see that again but it will never be. When I was between 5 and 12 there was only one thing that mattered outside of my family and friends and that was speedway. There was not much else outside of homemade go carts and scalextric. Now days you have to drag the kids away from PS4 and social media. They have better things to do. There is one thing speedway needs and that is to find a way to get people track side. And nobody really knows how to do that. You can chuck money away with advertising, you can reduce prices and all that does is make you worse off as a club if it doesnt work. You can tinker with the format and still have ftg racing. Sure everyone likes to have a moan at Eastbourne about the track and lack of racing but I have been to big wide tracks and still sit through a load of ftg racing. Just maybe with the added bonus of the home star that misses the gate but just opens his throttle for an easy pass down the straight! Hardly racing! As for this league. I was so anti it when Eastbourne joined but I ended up loving it. I was watching 7 guys, all British with smiles on their faces all enjoying what they were doing....and some great racing. I wish I knew how to fix it so that all leagues were watchable and profit making. Maybe speedway is just what is is. A low level sport where we have to accept it and try to run clubs cheaper. I just dont know. All I do know, is I will be there, trackside until its gone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruckerroo Posted August 20, 2018 Author Report Share Posted August 20, 2018 Im not anti the third tier, I enjoy it, however its very hard to find a competitive match to go and see week in week out with 2 closely matched sides . As the previous poster says, if these potential changes to the 2nd tier are mooted then the relevant parties need to know asap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityrebel Posted August 20, 2018 Report Share Posted August 20, 2018 46 minutes ago, stevec said: Its such a shame we have these discussions every year. It really isn't just this league in question. I mean, how can you take a league seriously when a team in the bottom half of the table (4th) could win the title? I watched 'once there was a jolly swagman' the other day and then watched some youtube videos of speedway back in the heyday. Jeez, it would be amazing to see that again but it will never be. When I was between 5 and 12 there was only one thing that mattered outside of my family and friends and that was speedway. There was not much else outside of homemade go carts and scalextric. Now days you have to drag the kids away from PS4 and social media. They have better things to do. There is one thing speedway needs and that is to find a way to get people track side. And nobody really knows how to do that. You can chuck money away with advertising, you can reduce prices and all that does is make you worse off as a club if it doesnt work. You can tinker with the format and still have ftg racing. Sure everyone likes to have a moan at Eastbourne about the track and lack of racing but I have been to big wide tracks and still sit through a load of ftg racing. Just maybe with the added bonus of the home star that misses the gate but just opens his throttle for an easy pass down the straight! Hardly racing! As for this league. I was so anti it when Eastbourne joined but I ended up loving it. I was watching 7 guys, all British with smiles on their faces all enjoying what they were doing....and some great racing. I wish I knew how to fix it so that all leagues were watchable and profit making. Maybe speedway is just what is is. A low level sport where we have to accept it and try to run clubs cheaper. I just dont know. All I do know, is I will be there, trackside until its gone! You and me both! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityrebel Posted August 20, 2018 Report Share Posted August 20, 2018 7 minutes ago, ruckerroo said: Im not anti the third tier, I enjoy it, however its very hard to find a competitive match to go and see week in week out with 2 closely matched sides . As the previous poster says, if these potential changes to the 2nd tier are mooted then the relevant parties need to know asap. The thing is mate, beggars can't be choosers. Recently it's been easier to find water in the Sahara than go to speedway in the South east. It is what it is at the moment. I'm up for an improvement in standards, but I'm not holding my breath. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GiveusaB Posted August 20, 2018 Report Share Posted August 20, 2018 I think one thing I've learnt to accept with third tier racing is.......change your expectancy levels? instead of 'expecting' to see neck/neck fast/furious racing (although there is some of that from time to time) I go with the anticipation of seeing a bright young talent coming through ? I'd love to see Jason Doyle ride week in week out, but it aint much exciting when he's half a lap ahead ? I get more enjoyment from watching Leon Flint develop......Tom Brennan develop.....Drew Kemp develop etc etc etc......yes it's slower, but less predictable and offers value for money ! imo Like I say, it takes some adjusting (3rd tier racing) but if you can take it for what it is? then it's quite satisfying from an entertainment spectacle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityrebel Posted August 20, 2018 Report Share Posted August 20, 2018 15 minutes ago, GiveusaB said: I think one thing I've learnt to accept with third tier racing is.......change your expectancy levels? instead of 'expecting' to see neck/neck fast/furious racing (although there is some of that from time to time) I go with the anticipation of seeing a bright young talent coming through ? I'd love to see Jason Doyle ride week in week out, but it aint much exciting when he's half a lap ahead ? I get more enjoyment from watching Leon Flint develop......Tom Brennan develop.....Drew Kemp develop etc etc etc......yes it's slower, but less predictable and offers value for money ! imo Like I say, it takes some adjusting (3rd tier racing) but if you can take it for what it is? then it's quite satisfying from an entertainment spectacle. I've been a regular from the start in 1994. When some of my local tracks dropped down, it was no culture shock to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GiveusaB Posted August 20, 2018 Report Share Posted August 20, 2018 I think the riders find it more of a culture shock when trying to step up a league? There appears to be a sizeable gulf between the NL and Championship ? (slightly digressing off topic....) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWC Posted August 20, 2018 Report Share Posted August 20, 2018 The dilemma at the moment is not the NL but what happens to the PL and CL. I don’t think the standard of the NL can be reduced any without making it a novices league and that would be bad for the clubs involved. If the two leagues above amalgamate then there could well be a demand for more riders from the NL, so doubling up comes into play, and we now how that goes! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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