IainB Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 (edited) 24 minutes ago, waytogo28 said: Sadly I have to agree with you there mostly, as neither of them have been able to really cut it - not that I regard them as crap ( except perhaps poor at world class level ) But as for Bomber's ridiculous point of view -delusional is about right on how much he is worth in the UK. He seems to believe he is worth about 250k profit here. Most of the doubling up - top riders - have never glanced at the terraces in the last 2 -3 years to see how many are now interested in watching them chase each other ( after the gating competition is over ). I agree with all the dangers of the job, but it has always been a choice they make to chase glory and fortune. At the moment hardly any rider is worth more than 75k profit / nett income ( inc. from both teams ) in the UK - based on the interest of the general public. If there are many more who agree with Bomber they have no chance of acquiring that lifestyle unless and until they crack Poland and Sweden and are "in demand" outside of the UK. maybe crap was a bit harsh, Bomber used to be world class but that was 10 years ago and I still believe Cookie can be world class, though time is not on his side. To expect to make a world class living without world class performances is, frankly, pie in the sky, especially in a profession where everybody can actually see how good you are week in week out, there's no hiding place. I'm all for believing in yourself but after 10 years of year on year decline sometimes you need a reality check Edited July 21, 2018 by iainb 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winstoncigar Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 17 hours ago, Stoke Potter said: You and the others like you are so clueless it's untrue. It's evident that if you do watch the sport you do not actually see what is going on! People do not go to watch the sport. Why is that? It's because it's boring and they are not remotely interested in it. So, tell me the real problem in ONE sentence. The bikes are the problem, to the uninitiated (new fan) they look like something from the 1970's, which is pretty much what they are. Like it or not, Speedway as a team sport has had it's day and to attract a new breed of fan the machinery and the presentation has got to look 21st century. The actual track, its' surface, shape and length is pretty much immaterial. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acef Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 20 hours ago, BWitcher said: That is absolutely nowhere near the real problem. Its exactly the problem. Stop basing your argument on the foundations that have propped speedway up for the last 50 years. It's no longer relevant. If I was to canvas new potential fan bases, in local areas across the UK with a general age group of 18 to 30, the answer will be the same. It's boring. That is the new audience speeedway needs. Your making the classic mistake that all current speedway fans make. Your stuck in the f&&&&&&g past. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acef Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 17 hours ago, BWitcher said: The racing at Cardiff is at best average every year... yet 40,000 will descend upon it again this year. So continue to spout your nonsense, alas for you, there is absolutely no evidence to back up what you claim. Down from the mid 50s. That is called YOY decline and if it continues it will not be viable in 10 years. Which leads nicely to your 2nd claim because thats precisely the proof needed. There is a reason I don't employ people like you. I'd be shut within a year. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acef Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 17 hours ago, Stoke Potter said: Put Cardiff on every week, would you get 40K going? (Answer the question) The tracks have never been particularly good, exacerbated by the fact that modern day bikes don't go well around British circuits. The evidence you ask for is the quality of the racing, i.e. very little passing. There is so much competition for the entertainment pound these days when compared to say the 70's, that people will not turn out for something that amounts to a nothing show. What the idiot doesn't get is that Cardiff is declining YOY. You can literally see it. Speedway needs to turn over its fan base. I'm getting sick and tired of the same old school posters posting the same old tripe post after post. They live in the past. Whatever happened to the sport, whatever it did, it doesn't matter TODAY. It doesn't matter in the future. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acef Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 (edited) 16 hours ago, mikebv said: Spot on... Losing 400 regular fans from 3000 isn't really noticeable... Lose 400 from 1200 and their absence is obvious and stark. Giving an irrefutable barometer of a fading entity... And when any business has that reputation it really is a huge uphill struggle to turn this view around.. Each track has its own 'tipping point' I would suggest whereby the atmosphere drops to a level that then becomes sterile and mundane enough for those still attending to consider "is it is really worth coming again next week"? The vicious circle of low crowds/poor atmosphere, poor atmosphere/even lower crowds, kicks in... And not too many clubs it seems have managed to break this vicious cycle sadly, with it appears almost all currently going through it to varying degrees.. As we know. It doesn't matter how 'awesome' a Speedway meeting is if only 'one man and his dog' show up to watch it... We don't want the old man and his dog showing up. That's the guy I'm turning over. We agree that speedway is declining but at what stage are we going to address it and change what we do? I'm tired of seeing 'well speedway has never been that entertaining'. Well you know in my crap restaurant the food has 'always been rubbish'. Yep that makes it okay then! Wow! You know what I do when someone tells me that? I fix it! Same principle here. If speedway is not 'that entertaining' then make it entertaining!!!!! And before anyone bleats on, yes it can be entertaining on the RIGHT TRACKS. Edited July 21, 2018 by acef 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acef Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 (edited) 18 hours ago, BWitcher said: The racing at Belle Vue is of the top drawer, as good as even Hyde Road ever used to produce (some would say better). Yet even last year on their preferred race nights they weren't packing the crowds in... this year they've gone down the pan. The more I dissect this post the more each paragraph becomes utter nonsense. The issue with BV is promoting. They haven't attracted any new supporters because nobody knows we are here. They are not on their own in this regard. You don't just 'pack the crowds in', business isn't that easy. You have to make the product saleable and then build. That takes time. BV have an excellent product but they are not marketing it. They are not driving it. They are not selling it. I'm grateful for what they've done in terms of saving us but they are not speedway people. They have no clue how to grow it. Oh and Hyde Road was garbage. It was a family day out after the zoo. That's where this whole family nonsense in speedway comes from, Belle Vue made it that way. This is 2018 though. We ain't in the 70s anymore. Edited July 21, 2018 by acef Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waytogo28 Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 (edited) 13 minutes ago, acef said: BV have an excellent product but they are not marketing it. They are not driving it. They are not sellin And except for one or two clubs, that is pretty much the case across the UK. The BSPA should be renamed the BSOA - British Speedway Organisers Association. Or take out the selling / give publicity to - part of the dictionary definition. There never will be "any word from the BSPA" until they say so - it's their ball and they can take it away at any time. They won't say anything about 2019 until their next winter AGM. Edited July 21, 2018 by waytogo28 additional point made 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ch958 Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 44 minutes ago, acef said: What the idiot doesn't get is that Cardiff is declining YOY. You can literally see it. Speedway needs to turn over its fan base. I'm getting sick and tired of the same old school posters posting the same old tripe post after post. They live in the past. Whatever happened to the sport, whatever it did, it doesn't matter TODAY. It doesn't matter in the future. you make good points but what if some of the aspects of the sport were better in the past? Such as continuity of teams, better looking and slower bikes, riders closer to fans, etc etc. The future matters and it should incorporate what was good in the past. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icicle Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 Small points can now be implemented. Yes, as I have said, sponsorship, ADVERTISING (if you don't know you won't go) most important. But sill little thing can be done to make the sport look a bit more professional such as the Tractors, instead of them looking like they have been saved from the scrappy, they get spruced up in the Team Colours. Tiny, but may improve image?? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icicle Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 Just now, Icicle said: Small points can now be implemented. Yes, as I have said, sponsorship, ADVERTISING (if you don't know you won't go) most important. But silly little things can be done to make the sport look a bit more professional such as the Tractors, instead of them looking like they have been saved from the scrappy, they get spruced up in the Team Colours. Tiny, but may improve image?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martinmauger Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 "Tell them about it and they may come, keep it a secret and they surely won't since they don't know about it".... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Star Lady Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 Been away for the week, Have the BSPA said anything yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluPanther Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 7 minutes ago, Star Lady said: Been away for the week, Have the BSPA said anything yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC2 Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 10 minutes ago, Star Lady said: Been away for the week, Have the BSPA said anything yet? Yep, they sent a post card saying: “Away on holiday with Star Lady, wish you were at our meetings rather than here, keep spending the money mushrooms” 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.D Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 I was with an old friend this morning, we go back 25 odd years, he's not a speedway fan but has been to a good few meetings with me but not for a few years.. An intelligent man, runs his own business, a Yorkshireman living in the south he tells it as he see's it and as a kid went to the Shay a few times. I spoke about a few things and he said "Get an American marketing team in, they know how to promote and put a show on when you get people in to watch, people want more entertainment if they are paying £12 to get in for a night" My reply was its more like £18 now for the evening and his reply was "Thats the first bit they've got wrong" He does have a point. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hot Shoe Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 23 hours ago, cityrebel said: The whole package is poor value for money. At swindon last night I handed over £20 inc prog, to stand in a dump of a stadium, to watch 15 processional races on a dust bowl of a track. It's not rocket science is it. It could have been worse. It could have been another farewell meeting that wasn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hot Shoe Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 5 hours ago, M.D said: I was with an old friend this morning, we go back 25 odd years, he's not a speedway fan but has been to a good few meetings with me but not for a few years.. An intelligent man, runs his own business, a Yorkshireman living in the south he tells it as he see's it and as a kid went to the Shay a few times. I spoke about a few things and he said "Get an American marketing team in, they know how to promote and put a show on when you get people in to watch, people want more entertainment if they are paying £12 to get in for a night" My reply was its more like £18 now for the evening and his reply was "Thats the first bit they've got wrong" He does have a point. It's easy to say that the admission prices are too high when it isn't you trying to balance the books. I'd say compared to many other sports 18 quid is about right. The problem with speedway is that the BSPA/SCB and promoters still have the 1950s attitude that they are doing the public a favour by staging the sport. When they understand that the public demands for entertainment are higher than decades ago then sport may move forward but the top tip is don't hold your breath. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hot Shoe Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 11 hours ago, winstoncigar said: The bikes are the problem, to the uninitiated (new fan) they look like something from the 1970's, which is pretty much what they are. They aren't though are they? Even to the uninitiated a 1970s speedway bike is a lot different to a current bike. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityrebel Posted July 21, 2018 Report Share Posted July 21, 2018 41 minutes ago, Hot Shoe said: It could have been worse. It could have been another farewell meeting that wasn't. I got conned at that one as well! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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