marko Posted July 2, 2018 Report Share Posted July 2, 2018 You only need look at some of the races posted on youtube to see one of the reasons the sport is in decline, even some of the better races featured are not that great and raced on what are dry, dusty and often a racing line almost devoid of shale. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted July 2, 2018 Report Share Posted July 2, 2018 15 hours ago, New Science said: Most speedway clubs still have a match day programme, burger chips , a drink and a club shop That's what I was thinking. I think speedway clubs often try harder than football clubs to make more of the evening entertainment with many interviews, looking after the kids, Hot Laps like we do at Lynn, giving fans the opportunity to watch heats from the centre and pick their Rider of the Night etc. When do the majority of football fans get these chances? Football doesn't have to try very hard, people love their football clubs and support them through thick and thin, the money just rolls in, they have every facility, they charge a fortune for entry and shirts etc and get away with it as their fans are passionate.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve roberts Posted July 2, 2018 Report Share Posted July 2, 2018 58 minutes ago, Trees said: That's what I was thinking. I think speedway clubs often try harder than football clubs to make more of the evening entertainment with many interviews, looking after the kids, Hot Laps like we do at Lynn, giving fans the opportunity to watch heats from the centre and pick their Rider of the Night etc. When do the majority of football fans get these chances? Football doesn't have to try very hard, people love their football clubs and support them through thick and thin, the money just rolls in, they have every facility, they charge a fortune for entry and shirts etc and get away with it as their fans are passionate.... ...or brain washed! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shale Searcher Posted July 2, 2018 Report Share Posted July 2, 2018 Please describe "Hot Laps" at Lynn... And purpose? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Smith Posted July 2, 2018 Report Share Posted July 2, 2018 3 minutes ago, Shale Searcher said: Please describe "Hot Laps" at Lynn... And purpose? Purpose - to add extra entertainment for the fans Realty - boring as hell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemini Posted July 2, 2018 Report Share Posted July 2, 2018 Perhaps try mobility scooters for a change then like Glasgow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waytogo28 Posted July 2, 2018 Report Share Posted July 2, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Gemini said: Perhaps try mobility scooters for a change then like Glasgow. Closer racing I reckon. Please, NO turbocharged mobility scooters and NO tuners permitted. And NO underweight jockeys either. Edited July 2, 2018 by waytogo28 Additional point made 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted July 2, 2018 Report Share Posted July 2, 2018 (edited) 4 hours ago, Shale Searcher said: Please describe "Hot Laps" at Lynn... And purpose? I think it startms at 1900, 4 riders from each team do timed flying laps and a note made each week of who is the fastest, just a little extra entertainment.... Also supporters club members can accompany the manager and riders on the track walk Edited July 2, 2018 by Trees Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trees Posted July 2, 2018 Report Share Posted July 2, 2018 4 hours ago, Daniel Smith said: Purpose - to add extra entertainment for the fans Realty - boring as hell That's interesting, what would make them good, more commentary? I've not seen them as I am always on the Supporters Club table in the bar! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Smith Posted July 2, 2018 Report Share Posted July 2, 2018 Maybe 2 lap match races from the tapes against the day's opposition? Seeing there's no money in it for the rider's they ain't really going to go full tilt at it anyway. It's pointless 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marko Posted July 2, 2018 Report Share Posted July 2, 2018 If they done hot laps as some tracks there would be no shale left by the time the main meeting comes around, not mentioning any names (cough kent cough Birmingham) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted July 2, 2018 Report Share Posted July 2, 2018 (edited) So much of what generates a crowd these days is down to great marketing and hype.. I have mentioned before the differences between the PDC and the BDO in darts.. Two organisations in the same 'sport'... The result? One very, very successful, and the other woefully inadequate trying desperately to keep up, and failing miserably.. Speedway on any given meeting in the Premiership must pay out for 14 riders around £15,000 (or maybe even more?)... Not bad 'prize money' for a very small minority sport. Figures that, I suggest, would surprise many non Speedway followers if they were informed of it.... Therefore, how about a different spin on this £15,000..? Change the word 'wages' and replace it with 'Prize Money', with cheques being given post match to the team captains during an interview... 5 man teams.... A top League of 12 clubs, therefore 60 riders needed.. £15,000 up for grabs EVERY meeting... £10,000 to the winner, £5,000 to the loser... Home and Away twice would deliver 44 matches per team ex play offs.. Let's use a utopian vision and say every home team wins every match.... That would mean over 44 matches, each club would have 'won' £330,000 (£220,000 at home and £110,000 away) with each rider therefore averaging £1500 per meeting, meaning the average rider would earn £66,000 per year, ex play offs.. The reality will be of course some riders will earn more as their deals are better and some will earn less, as will the Clubs as there are bound to be away wins, however... After VAT, at £15 a pop, a 1500 crowd would deliver £18,000... Leaving £3,000 to pay the rent and operating costs (supplemented hopefully by Sponsorship, and profit if applicable on Car Park fees, bar take and programmes sales)... The standard for me would be teams made up at a level of Two current Premiership Heat Leaders. Two Championship Heat Leaders and a Championship Second String making up the fifth man.. Five man teams would also give a surplus of riders to cover short term and long term absences without the need for Gue.. Gu.. G (I can't even type it), and negate rider replacement... The overall 'Prize Fund' (ex play offs) from a total of 264 matches would be an incredible £3,960,000!! With the obvious proviso being of course, could you get 1500 to watch a sport that was now ran with credibilty, with similar standard teams, on nights when crowds could be best generated? I reckon you should be able to sell any Sport that offers a 'Prize Fund' of nearly £4M (not including play offs) to any prospective Sponsor or Media outlet as a very credible and popular Sport! And the beauty of course is clubs are paying this kind of money out every night now but without anyone knowing it, and gaining any publicity for themselves by doing it.. Could it work? Who knows, maybe they could get BT onside to show every team once at home and they match the 'Prize Fund' for that meeting meaning £30,000 on offer that night? British Speedway pays out literally MILLIONS of pounds to riders each season... SO. SHOUT ABOUT IT. LET THE BRITISH PUBLIC KNOW!!! And maybe, just maybe, they will start to get interested? (Or at worse, CURIOUS)... Edited July 2, 2018 by mikebv 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE DEAN MACHINE Posted July 2, 2018 Report Share Posted July 2, 2018 2 hours ago, mikebv said: So much of what generates a crowd these days is down to great marketing and hype.. I have mentioned before the differences between the PDC and the BDO in darts.. Two organisations in the same 'sport'... The result? One very, very successful, and the other woefully inadequate trying desperately to keep up, and failing miserably.. Speedway on any given meeting in the Premiership must pay out for 14 riders around £15,000 (or maybe even more?)... Not bad 'prize money' for a very small minority sport. Figures that, I suggest, would surprise many non Speedway followers if they were informed of it.... Therefore, how about a different spin on this £15,000..? Change the word 'wages' and replace it with 'Prize Money', with cheques being given post match to the team captains during an interview... 5 man teams.... A top League of 12 clubs, therefore 60 riders needed.. £15,000 up for grabs EVERY meeting... £10,000 to the winner, £5,000 to the loser... Home and Away twice would deliver 44 matches per team ex play offs.. Let's use a utopian vision and say every home team wins every match.... That would mean over 44 matches, each club would have 'won' £330,000 (£220,000 at home and £110,000 away) with each rider therefore averaging £1500 per meeting, meaning the average rider would earn £66,000 per year, ex play offs.. The reality will be of course some riders will earn more as their deals are better and some will earn less, as will the Clubs as there are bound to be away wins, however... After VAT, at £15 a pop, a 1500 crowd would deliver £18,000... Leaving £3,000 to pay the rent and operating costs (supplemented hopefully by Sponsorship, and profit if applicable on Car Park fees, bar take and programmes sales)... The standard for me would be teams made up at a level of Two current Premiership Heat Leaders. Two Championship Heat Leaders and a Championship Second String making up the fifth man.. Five man teams would also give a surplus of riders to cover short term and long term absences without the need for Gue.. Gu.. G (I can't even type it), and negate rider replacement... The overall 'Prize Fund' (ex play offs) from a total of 264 matches would be an incredible £3,960,000!! With the obvious proviso being of course, could you get 1500 to watch a sport that was now ran with credibilty, with similar standard teams, on nights when crowds could be best generated? I reckon you should be able to sell any Sport that offers a 'Prize Fund' of nearly £4M (not including play offs) to any prospective Sponsor or Media outlet as a very credible and popular Sport! And the beauty of course is clubs are paying this kind of money out every night now but without anyone knowing it, and gaining any publicity for themselves by doing it.. Could it work? Who knows, maybe they could get BT onside to show every team once at home and they match the 'Prize Fund' for that meeting meaning £30,000 on offer that night? British Speedway pays out literally MILLIONS of pounds to riders each season... SO. SHOUT ABOUT IT. LET THE BRITISH PUBLIC KNOW!!! And maybe, just maybe, they will start to get interested? (Or at worse, CURIOUS)... I haven’t looked into the figures but at least you are thinking outside the box and on the face of it does seem something that should be at least looked in to 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityrebel Posted July 3, 2018 Report Share Posted July 3, 2018 12 hours ago, marko said: If they done hot laps as some tracks there would be no shale left by the time the main meeting comes around, not mentioning any names (cough kent cough Birmingham) At rye, they are down to the base after the parade lap! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waytogo28 Posted July 3, 2018 Report Share Posted July 3, 2018 10 hours ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said: I haven’t looked into the figures but at least you are thinking outside the box and on the face of it does seem something that should be at least looked in to I agree but "looking into things" is far from one of the best traits of the BSPA. It is a good idea and SHOULD be looked into but don't hold your breath. They should do a lot more with the BT coverage to attract new people along with tempting offers. The venue for the AGM is yet to be sorted. Luxor? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moxey63 Posted July 3, 2018 Report Share Posted July 3, 2018 (edited) Speedway promoters are a funny breed. I don't know how they managed to earn the money to plough into speedway, but to have an attitude of "It's my money so I'll risk it how I want" is surely doomed to failure and their track's closure and a further detriment to the sport. At Belle Vue we used to have a fellow who told fans to stay away if they didn't like it, and yet complained when crowds dwindled. When you rely on the public coming through the gates to pay you back in some kind of form and it is not a crazy bucket-list idea that you have in life to simply try speedway promoting, then why do they not listen, have a head in sands attitude and then end up pulling down the shutters? Another black mark on the sport when it happens. For too long we have relied on people running the sport who don't mind losing cash and don't care what the people handing money at the turnstiles think. To announce every winter that their respective club has lost money is an embarrassment to their promoting skills and business acumen. And we, as speedway fans, are more than happy to go and watch a "sport" which is being run by these idiots. Or do the gaps on the weed-filled terraces tell otherwise? Edited July 3, 2018 by moxey63 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsunami Posted July 3, 2018 Report Share Posted July 3, 2018 3 hours ago, moxey63 said: Speedway promoters are a funny breed. I don't know how they managed to earn the money to plough into speedway, but to have an attitude of "It's my money so I'll risk it how I want" is surely doomed to failure and their track's closure and a further detriment to the sport. At Belle Vue we used to have a fellow who told fans to stay away if they didn't like it, and yet complained when crowds dwindled. When you rely on the public coming through the gates to pay you back in some kind of form and it is not a crazy bucket-list idea that you have in life to simply try speedway promoting, then why do they not listen, have a head in sands attitude and then end up pulling down the shutters? Another black mark on the sport when it happens. For too long we have relied on people running the sport who don't mind losing cash and don't care what the people handing money at the turnstiles think. To announce every winter that their respective club has lost money is an embarrassment to their promoting skills and business acumen. And we, as speedway fans, are more than happy to go and watch a "sport" which is being run by these idiots. Or do the gaps on the weed-filled terraces tell otherwise? But some critics have the nerve to make statements like that, when they were asked to pay to get in and they walked away to then be a permanent critic. Didn't you. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moxey63 Posted July 3, 2018 Report Share Posted July 3, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, Tsunami said: But some critics have the nerve to make statements like that, when they were asked to pay to get in and they walked away to then be a permanent critic. Didn't you. Please explain why I subscribe to sports channels that actually show live speedway... and yet never watch the speedway on them? I have broadband, but never watch live-streamed matches. Just that you thought I stopped going to Belle Vue because my free pass was withdrawn? Defeat your point a little. In 2018, Speedway is widely available without having to go trackside. It's like I'm saying there's speedway racing in my garden... but I draw the curtains. Edited July 3, 2018 by moxey63 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsunami Posted July 3, 2018 Report Share Posted July 3, 2018 58 minutes ago, moxey63 said: Please explain why I subscribe to sports channels that actually show live speedway... and yet never watch the speedway on them? I have broadband, but never watch live-streamed matches. Just that you thought I stopped going to Belle Vue because my free pass was withdrawn? Defeat your point a little. In 2018, Speedway is widely available without having to go trackside. It's like I'm saying there's speedway racing in my garden... but I draw the curtains. Another trying to rewrite what he has already boasted on here. You thought speedway was good enough when you got in free, but decided to leave it when you are asked to pay. Some speedway fan you are, only interested in a freebee and not paying your way but the sport was good enough for free. Another free loader. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moxey63 Posted July 3, 2018 Report Share Posted July 3, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Tsunami said: Another trying to rewrite what he has already boasted on here. You thought speedway was good enough when you got in free, but decided to leave it when you are asked to pay. Some speedway fan you are, only interested in a freebee and not paying your way but the sport was good enough for free. Another free loader. How do you come to the conclusion that my scrounging helped contribute to the continuing decline of speedway? Edited July 3, 2018 by moxey63 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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