SCB Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 We were promised something new and amazing. It looks like a rehashed old pair format and a final in Poland. So just how is this different? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bavarian Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 On 2/9/2018 at 5:24 PM, Garry1603 said: If it's a 3-3 in the final, they should keep doing reruns until one team gains an advantage. Expand There is an easy solution, if it is a 3-3 in the final. The pair that has scored more points in total over the two days (42 heats) should then be the winners. That would be a fair and acceptable tie-breaker. It would give the overall top point scoring pair something of a bonus going into the final, knowing that a 3-3 would give them the title, while the other pair with a lesser points total knows they have to beat their opponents in that final heat by 4-2 or 5-1 to win the championship. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Central Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 (edited) On 2/9/2018 at 6:27 PM, Bavarian said: There is an easy solution, if it is a 3-3 in the final. The pair that has scored more points in total over the two days (42 heats) should then be the winners. That would be a fair and acceptable tie-breaker. It would give the overall top point scoring pair something of a bonus going into the final, knowing that a 3-3 would give them the title, while the other pair with a lesser points total knows they have to beat their opponents in that final heat by 4-2 or 5-1 to win the championship. Expand So the final is not a winner takes all. The guy that wins this final doesn't necessarily get top position in the podium It is really just a final chance for the second places team to it, even if they were miles behind after forty two races and two days ...But only if they get a 4-2.I I know that all makes some sort of sense here. But On TV it will look way too complicated and contrived for the casual viewer. Edited February 9, 2018 by Grand Central Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Posted February 9, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 On 2/9/2018 at 4:26 PM, Grand Central said: Everyone understands that TV wants a decisive final race. We are not stupid. But a Grand Final that may easily end 3-3 is not consistent with that, is It? Expand So what is your solution to satisfy TV and fans. Remember the WCP needs TV money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Posted February 9, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 On 2/9/2018 at 5:07 PM, Grand Central said: Perhaps they have not had enough time to think these things through. It has taken them months to get this far, after all. It being such a small, unimportant matter ... Of just how the winner is decided. Can't expect them to have that covered straight away. Expand No reason not to run the heat again until there is a winner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iris123 Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 On 2/9/2018 at 6:27 PM, Bavarian said: There is an easy solution, if it is a 3-3 in the final. The pair that has scored more points in total over the two days (42 heats) should then be the winners. That would be a fair and acceptable tie-breaker. It would give the overall top point scoring pair something of a bonus going into the final, knowing that a 3-3 would give them the title, while the other pair with a lesser points total knows they have to beat their opponents in that final heat by 4-2 or 5-1 to win the championship. Expand You got it spot on Bavarian.After all the promises about a brave new world,all we get is a world version of a competition we already have running each year!!! Quote In 2017, the two semi-finals of the European Pairs Ch'ship were held at Liberec (CZ) and Zarnovica (Slovakia), and the final was at Lonigo in Italy. The following fifteen nations participated last year: Team GB won the first semi-final, France and Denmark were the other two qualifiers from this round, while the Czech Republic, Germany, Romania, and Austria were eliminated. Poland won the second semi-final, ahead of Russia and Latvia, who also qualified for the final. The Ukraine, Slovenia, Slovakia, and Bulgaria were eliminated. Hosts Italy were seeded to the 2017 European Pairs Final at Lonigo, which was won by Poland, from Russia (2nd), France (3rd), Denmark (4th), Italy (5th), Great Britain (6th), and Latvia (7th). Expand Just slightly changed so we have a two day final.Not sure why it has taken so long for all this when we have a European version anyway.And not sure how big this call for a world pairs is,when we also have the other pairs run by the other mob as well!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f-s-p Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 On 2/9/2018 at 6:27 PM, Bavarian said: There is an easy solution, if it is a 3-3 in the final. The pair that has scored more points in total over the two days (42 heats) should then be the winners. That would be a fair and acceptable tie-breaker. It would give the overall top point scoring pair something of a bonus going into the final, knowing that a 3-3 would give them the title, while the other pair with a lesser points total knows they have to beat their opponents in that final heat by 4-2 or 5-1 to win the championship. Expand On 2/9/2018 at 6:38 PM, Mark said: No reason not to run the heat again until there is a winner. Expand Pretty basic and fundamental rule in track racing is that when ever theres a tie for a top three position, theres a run off to determine which one is better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Central Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 On 2/9/2018 at 6:36 PM, Mark said: So what is your solution to satisfy TV and fans. Remember the WCP needs TV money. Expand Well. The SWC managed very well for over 15years without succumbing to the Grand Final pressure from TV. The team with most points won. And it seemed quite successful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILIPRISING Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 On 2/9/2018 at 6:16 PM, racers and royals said: What is there to gain by having the final over 2 days- apart from making a weekend of it ? Will any Polish fans turn up on the 1st day ?? Expand POLAND will compete on both days ... it's a two-day event Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racers and royals Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 On 2/9/2018 at 6:53 PM, PHILIPRISING said: POLAND will compete on both days ... it's a two-day event Expand Yes i know that but after 21 races on day 1 nothing whatsoever is decided- if they are selling tickets seperately for the 2 days i think the Polish fans will turn up( in the main ) on the 2nd day Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Central Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 On 2/9/2018 at 6:53 PM, PHILIPRISING said: POLAND will compete on both days ... it's a two-day event Expand Jos Vaessen must feel vindicated. It has taken thirty years for the FIM to resurrect his failed Amsterdam experiment on real Speedway. I bet it will be another 30 years again before it is repeated. ' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Posted February 9, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 (edited) On 2/9/2018 at 6:48 PM, Grand Central said: Well. The SWC managed very well for over 15years without succumbing to the Grand Final pressure from TV. The team with most points won. And it seemed quite successful. Expand The SWC was very predictable, and will remain that way, while Poland have huge strength in depth. There 2nd team could probably beat most other finailists. At least 2 man teams will allow many countries to compete on a more level playing field. Poland may still win it but it will not be as easy for them. That must make better viewing for fans and TV. Edited February 9, 2018 by Mark 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Central Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 (edited) On 2/9/2018 at 7:09 PM, Mark said: The SWC was very predictable, and will remain that way, while Poland have huge strength in depth. There 2nd team could probably beat most other finailists. At least 2 man teams will allow many countries to compete on a more level playing field. Poland may still win it but it will not be as easy for them. That must make better viewing for fans and TV. Expand You may be right on that. But we were actually discussing the 'climax' element demanded by TV. Which the SWC managed without for many years producing exciting Speedway that came across brilliantly on TV and seemed to satisfy the media people as well as fans. Of course by having a two day event the organisers are actually ensuring that the first meeting ends with no climax at all. Which is strange if the TV people need it so much Edited February 9, 2018 by Grand Central Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambo Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 Maybe because the old FIM/BSI World Cup contract is based on 4 Televised Meetings? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kraftwerk Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 would like to see how they will decide which 15 countries are in. For sure there will have to be quali meeting to get for the race off? and who will already be waiting in the race off ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racers and royals Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 (edited) On 2/9/2018 at 8:54 PM, kraftwerk said: would like to see how they will decide which 15 countries are in. For sure there will have to be quali meeting to get for the race off? and who will already be waiting in the race off ... Expand Top 15 in the rankings- don’t think there will be a qualifying meeting. In the SWC they have had 12 countries - so shouldn’t be a problem finding another 3 Edited February 9, 2018 by racers and royals Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willstaxi Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 Surly if there is a tie after 21 races it must be a 2 man run off Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A ORLOV Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 On 2/9/2018 at 10:02 PM, willstaxi said: Surly if there is a tie after 21 races it must be a 2 man run off Expand Or the scoring for the final could be 3,2,1,1 which would get round the 2nd and 3rd just sitting there and blocking out the 4th rider. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 (edited) On 2/9/2018 at 10:33 PM, A ORLOV said: Or the scoring for the final could be 3,2,1,1 which would get round the 2nd and 3rd just sitting there and blocking out the 4th rider. Expand It's up to his partner to slow the race and help him get past his opponent(s). You shouldn't get any reward for finishing last in pairs racing. It's not 'blocking out', it's called team riding which I believe was quite big in speedway once upon a time! Edited February 10, 2018 by Terry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sommelier Posted February 10, 2018 Report Share Posted February 10, 2018 On 2/9/2018 at 7:16 PM, Grand Central said: You may be right on that. But we were actually discussing the 'climax' element demanded by TV. Which the SWC managed without for many years producing exciting Speedway that came across brilliantly on TV and seemed to satisfy the media people as well as fans. Of course by having a two day event the organisers are actually ensuring that the first meeting ends with no climax at all. Which is strange if the TV people need it so much Expand Bloody hell, do you ever stop moaning! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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