MattK Posted February 6, 2018 Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 7 minutes ago, GiveusaB said: I wish the powers that be would adopt a more 'central/flexible' points system for the National League ? Scrap the average selection and use a A,B,C,D category....1 rider from A and 2 riders from B,C,D each category A = ave 8 or above B = ave 6 to 8 C = 4 to 6 and D 0 to 4 (may be category D riders being under 18) Afterall, it's about developing British talent, not winning trophies and accolades !? We want to see/encourage our future stars...not impede them! How would that help? If you have more riders in each category than team places, you are guaranteeing that some riders will be without a team (as the points limit effectively does). If you have the same number of riders as team places, you will have to lock some riders out of the league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalterPlinge Posted February 6, 2018 Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 (edited) 15 minutes ago, GiveusaB said: I wish the powers that be would adopt a more 'central/flexible' points system for the National League ? Scrap the average selection and use a A,B,C,D category....1 rider from A and 2 riders from B,C,D each category A = ave 8 or above B = ave 6 to 8 C = 4 to 6 and D 0 to 4 (may be category D riders being under 18) Afterall, it's about developing British talent, not winning trophies and accolades !? We want to see/encourage our future stars...not impede them! Can't believe this same stupid comment keeps coming up! How many times have we all debunked this nonsense? To repeat again. The average system offers 100 individual grades for every point of the average, and is as flexible as it can be! Using your daft grades, a rider with a 6.01 average is totally unemployable. Why would anyone want a 6.01 rider when they could use a 7.99 in the same place? Similarly, a 5.99 rider is in massive demand. He's much better value than a 4.01 rider in the same spot. So we have Mr 6.01 unemployable, and Mr 5.99 (who is of equal ability) in massive demand. There are 11 NL teams, and 77 places. There are only ever going to be 77 places, and bringing in a barmy system which would give totally unequal teams will not change that. Please can no one ever repeat this stupid idea ever again? Edited February 6, 2018 by WalterPlinge 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GiveusaB Posted February 6, 2018 Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 37 minutes ago, WalterPlinge said: Can't believe this same stupid comment keeps coming up! How many times have we all debunked this nonsense? To repeat again. The average system offers 100 individual grades for every point of the average, and is as flexible as it can be! Using your daft grades, a rider with a 6.01 average is totally unemployable. Why would anyone want a 6.01 rider when they could use a 7.99 in the same place? Similarly, a 5.99 rider is in massive demand. He's much better value than a 4.01 rider in the same spot. So we have Mr 6.01 unemployable, and Mr 5.99 (who is of equal ability) in massive demand. There are 11 NL teams, and 77 places. There are only ever going to be 77 places, and bringing in a barmy system which would give totally unequal teams will not change that. Please can no one ever repeat this stupid idea ever again? LOL....I think you might need a cup of tea and a biscuit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GiveusaB Posted February 6, 2018 Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 May be its a crap idea....I dont know? I guess increasing the points limit will only prevent lower average riders/newcomers progressing ? Who will want them if the points limit's increased? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalterPlinge Posted February 6, 2018 Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 13 minutes ago, GiveusaB said: May be its a crap idea....I dont know? Perhaps you're new to the sport, since you don't know. If you'd been around a while you'd know it was a crap idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazzac Posted February 6, 2018 Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 (edited) I've said it before make all 3 leagues 42.5, leave it alone for a minimum of 3 years, you're always get stronger and weaker teams (no different to now with 39) but shouldn't have this problem with riders like Knight unable to get a ride, and the likes of Brennen ,Kemp etc will ride against better riders before going up a league. Actually having thought about it again scrap that idea, it's far too simple. Edited February 6, 2018 by gazzac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shippy22 Posted February 6, 2018 Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 Perhaps a better idea would be to go back to the squad system that the league used to have. The heat leaders currently without a place could share a position with riders who are also riding in the Championship and therefore will often miss meetings. Surely much better than using guests and forcing some riders into retirement. It is ironic that promoters state that they need doubling up between the PL & CL as there is a shortage of riders, yet several riders in both CL and NL, could retire if they are unable to get a place, meaning even less riders in the sport ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bloom89 Posted February 6, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 Looking at the bigger picture why is it that say Australian riders in particular get much more opportunities than young English riders? Now don’t get me wrong some of them do add quality to the British leagues but it’s just so wrong when promoters bring them over supply them with a brand new van, a load of sponsorship and somewhere to live during the season. Why don’t promoters do all this for English riders? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East End Fan Posted February 6, 2018 Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 Well, Bloom89, I am sure that some British riders DO get help. In the past I have been on very friendly terms with a few promoters. All of them, without exception would have preferred a British rider to an overseas one. The difference is that the overseas rider is more single minded and simply HAS to succeed or go home for ever ( as many have done). So the best of the overseas riders succeed and the comparable Brit will still be following another occupation alongside his speedway. This does not help him to go forward. I have heard and read many complaints from the parents of young British riders about overseas riders being helped more than "Their" boy...usually it is because the lad does not show the right talent or attitude and has nothing to do with him being "British".. I do not see any young rider with any talent without a team place excepting for those with an average who are frozen out by silly rules. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raddog Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 (edited) 11 hours ago, bloom89 said: Looking at the bigger picture why is it that say Australian riders in particular get much more opportunities than young English riders? Now don’t get me wrong some of them do add quality to the British leagues but it’s just so wrong when promoters bring them over supply them with a brand new van, a load of sponsorship and somewhere to live during the season. Why don’t promoters do all this for English riders? My son has Never had any of that.... bought his own van rents his own house n procured his own sponsorship... last year he drove himsrlf to races , raced n drove home. Then on some occasions went to work at 2am .. works on his own bikes n is then back on the road to do it all again .. all for 10 pound a point.... why .. cos he loves to ride n having fun with the fans .. even tho hes frowned apon by some cos hes 1 of them bl&%^y imports ! Edited February 7, 2018 by raddog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GiveusaB Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 16 hours ago, WalterPlinge said: Perhaps you're new to the sport, since you don't know. If you'd been around a while you'd know it was a crap idea. And perhaps you're an expert ? although I'm still looking for your suggestions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GiveusaB Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 I think there's scope to implement a system where by riders 'need' to improve on their previous season's average, or run the risk of missing out on the next season? May be with the exemption of 'first' season riders? (a season's grace to find their feet) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianbuck Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 The situation that Jake Knight and numerous other riders find themselves in is 99% due to allowing riders to race for more than one team. Speedway has had absolutely no benefit from this and all it has done is reduce the number of team places available. Most people agree that the leading National League riders should be looking to move up to the next lever, but how can they if 30plus riders are now riding for two teams? Those riders who keep trying to convince us that they must have two teams "to make it pay" should stop for a moment and think of the riders such as Jake Knight etc, that they have deprived of one team place - because they have two! This situation will only get worse until or unless the BSPA see where it is leading us and have the courage to scrap doubling-up. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moleman27 Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 In Jake's case it was also down too sponsorship as otherwise would have had a premiership place this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bloom89 Posted February 7, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 4 hours ago, Moleman27 said: In Jake's case it was also down too sponsorship as otherwise would have had a premiership place this season. But if the championship had implemented 2 reserves must be English it would surely help? It’s no good teams giving riders a few meetings then getting rid of them that’s not going to help them at all. You have people like Todd Kurtz and Mason Campton have they ever averaged more than 6 in the whole time they’ve been here? Joe Jacobs his average rises every season and Ellis Perks was outstanding for the best part of last season but both don’t have clubs why is that? You can’t say it’s because there not as good as the two aussies why not give Perks & jacobs half the chance both of the aussies have had. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bloom89 Posted February 7, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 12 hours ago, raddog said: My son has Never had any of that.... bought his own van rents his own house n procured his own sponsorship... last year he drove himsrlf to races , raced n drove home. Then on some occasions went to work at 2am .. works on his own bikes n is then back on the road to do it all again .. all for 10 pound a point.... why .. cos he loves to ride n having fun with the fans .. even tho hes frowned apon by some cos hes 1 of them bl&%^y imports ! Can I ask who your son is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProudtobeaBrummie Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 What's the crack with Tom Perry has he just not been offered nothing ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruno Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 Think he's packed it in Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
szkocjasid Posted February 12, 2018 Report Share Posted February 12, 2018 On 2/6/2018 at 3:14 PM, GiveusaB said: May be its a crap idea....I dont know? I guess increasing the points limit will only prevent lower average riders/newcomers progressing ? Who will want them if the points limit's increased? I would disagree, I don't believe the lower average riders will improve more in a weaker league, they're average may improve but only because they are racing weaker opponents! So the following year they may not get a place at all! Surely racing better riders makes it easier to move up into the Championship? JPB was almost unbeatable in the early part of last year in the NL but dropped out of the Championship, having easier rides in NL didn't help him it seems? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GiveusaB Posted February 13, 2018 Report Share Posted February 13, 2018 22 hours ago, szkocjasid said: I would disagree, I don't believe the lower average riders will improve more in a weaker league, they're average may improve but only because they are racing weaker opponents! So the following year they may not get a place at all! Surely racing better riders makes it easier to move up into the Championship? JPB was almost unbeatable in the early part of last year in the NL but dropped out of the Championship, having easier rides in NL didn't help him it seems? Good point! I think that the equipment has a big say on performance also? Taylor Hampshire struggled on some of his machinery last season, but I remember him borrowing Liam Carr's bike in one race and he flew round!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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