No job

[bloom89]

Was reading this weeks speedway star and surprised to find Alfie Bowtell without a spot good job he is at lakeside now though. A couple of others of note Dan Halsey, Connor Mountain and Jake Knight without teams also is this due to the low points limit?

[East End Fan]

It seems the most likely reason......When the 39 limit was announced, I was shocked because loads of contributors to this forum

and all around , just about everyone expected something higher, from 40  to 42....the riders now unemployed show that the 39

limit was wrong.

[flipper11]

21 minutes ago, bloom89 said:

Was reading this weeks speedway star and surprised to find Alfie Bowtell without a spot good job he is at lakeside now though. A couple of others of note Dan Halsey, Connor Mountain and Jake Knight without teams also is this due to the low points limit?

Plus on a higher average, Steve boxall 

[bloom89]

 

21 minutes ago, East End Fan said:

It seems the most likely reason......When the 39 limit was announced, I was shocked because loads of contributors to this forum

and all around , just about everyone expected something higher, from 40  to 42....the riders now unemployed show that the 39

limit was wrong.

There seems to be a lot of riders in the 4-4.70 bracket will either be riding second string or even in Plymouth’s case one will be third heatleader. With the top two leagues having a 42.50 points limit would that have been possible in the NL?

Edited February 3, 2018 by bloom89

[East End Fan]

42.5 would, IMO have been a perfectly achievable average.  No reason why the N.L. should be any different to the other leagues

Having spoken to a number of people, some of whom have the ears of promoters and managers, the points limit of 39 was imposed

on the league, not voted on by the members.  Since the figures being discussed and suggested before the meeting which decided the limit

was in general far in excess of 39, the allegations made have the ring of truth.

[NeilWatson]

1 hour ago, East End Fan said:

Having spoken to a number of people, some of whom have the ears of promoters and managers, the points limit of 39 was imposeD on the league, not voted on by the members.  

That wasn’t the case, 39.00 was the status quo after animated discussion didn’t achieve a consensus for change.

Edited February 3, 2018 by NeilWatson
Elaboration

[East End Fan]

OK Neil.  What I fail to understand is that it was generally accepted by everyone who made any comment about it,  and that included

promoters and managers, that a limit of from 40  to 42.5 would be this year's figure.  So almost nobody seemed to want 39, yet that was

the figure decided.  Something does not smell right to me.

[teaboy279]

14 hours ago, NeilWatson said:

That wasn’t the case, 39.00 was the status quo after animated discussion didn’t achieve a consensus for change.

My understanding though Neil, is that the majority wanted it higher then 39. It was just they could not decide what to raise it too, and as such it stayed as was. 

That's the problem when you put a room of self serving promotors together to sort rules. That sort of thing should have literally nothing to do with promotors.

[East End Fan]

Teaboy279 may have hit the nail on its head.  However, if it was not the promoters who decide, then who should it be ?

It is my personal belief that all leagues, including the National League, should always put teams together under the mean

average of 42.5.  Strong teams at the end of the season would HAVE to lose a rider or two but without decimating. Weak teams

would have riders to sign and yet the overall quality of the league remains high.  Now we have a situation where some very good

National League riders are out of work while many teams are forced to employ riders not up to standard.  That HAS to be ridiculous.

So WHO is advocating the present situation ?  As I have said before, something does not smell right.

[gazzac]

I bet if you looked at posts on this forum from the first years it started in any league in any year about diluting the product, there would be hundreds of posts similar to the last few, this sport will never or never want to learn. I said months ago it should be 42.5 to match the other leagues, and I remember some posts from Jake's father Richard saying this would happen, perhaps fearing the worst for Jake. What's worse we'll be having the same conversation next year with more promising riders missing out. 

[mac101]

Maybe they should make the 6/7 reserves built to say 7 points and make the rest of the team up to 42.5 that way you will need to maybe bring in new reserves most year which helps the sport in general 

[Twowheels]

Unfortunately British speedway is not consistent, The N/L should be made more competitive, how many promising young brits do we have that will go on the ride on the world stage, I am afraid that to many will be lost along the way, we are happy to bring over young oversees riders and give them team places in the upper two leagues, (nothing against this) but we need to limit the current numbers. A young rider trying to make his name in the sport needs to ride at least twice a week, he will also need to give 100% to the sport if he wants to get to the top. We know that not every rider has the natural ability, but with the right help and support he could still make it to the top.

When I started out I raced and worked for a couple of years, after a while it became to difficult, getting home from a Scottish meeting and then working the next day, took its toll. This was how most riders started out, we were all in the same boat. Trouble now is we have a lot more riders coming over from overseas that are just riding and we expect our young riders to match them from the outset. 

So let’s look at this scenario:- Young Brit in the N/L riding and working, he is number 1 and is doing well, gets a call to guest. He has to go into work and then drive straight to the meeting and ride. Gets a last in his first ride, maybe he gets a point in his next, what happens next he is taken our of heat eight. He goes home only 3 rides and 1 point. Back to work the next day and slim chance of another selection.

We must give more young Brits full team place’s from the start of the season and fast track them before we lose them. Sink or swim, I was told by a promoter that I would not make it, but hard work and dedication got me to the world final.

Riders are actually penalised for doing well. 

Richard

[bloom89]

56 minutes ago, knightr said:

Unfortunately British speedway is not consistent, The N/L should be made more competitive, how many promising young brits do we have that will go on the ride on the world stage, I am afraid that to many will be lost along the way, we are happy to bring over young oversees riders and give them team places in the upper two leagues, (nothing against this) but we need to limit the current numbers. A young rider trying to make his name in the sport needs to ride at least twice a week, he will also need to give 100% to the sport if he wants to get to the top. We know that not every rider has the natural ability, but with the right help and support he could still make it to the top.

When I started out I raced and worked for a couple of years, after a while it became to difficult, getting home from a Scottish meeting and then working the next day, took its toll. This was how most riders started out, we were all in the same boat. Trouble now is we have a lot more riders coming over from overseas that are just riding and we expect our young riders to match them from the outset. 

So let’s look at this scenario:- Young Brit in the N/L riding and working, he is number 1 and is doing well, gets a call to guest. He has to go into work and then drive straight to the meeting and ride. Gets a last in his first ride, maybe he gets a point in his next, what happens next he is taken our of heat eight. He goes home only 3 rides and 1 point. Back to work the next day and slim chance of another selection.

We must give more young Brits full team place’s from the start of the season and fast track them before we lose them. Sink or swim, I was told by a promoter that I would not make it, but hard work and dedication got me to the world final.

Riders are actually penalised for doing well. 

Richard

Good post, didn't Jake have a season with Sheffield a few years back? Unfortunately more experienced riders in the team weren't performing which meant more pressure was being put on your son and in turn he lost his place and has never had another go at Championship racing as it is called now. Riders like Connor Mountain and Alfie Bowtell need NL riding in my opinion just for instance say Bowtell has a poor start to the season doesn't score many points and gets dropped by Lakeside then he'd be completely without a team which is so wrong when teams like Berwick, Edinburgh, Peterborough, Redcar, Scunthorpe and Workington all have foreign riders riding at reserve now some of these have been riding over here for a long time but still get picked over young English riders.

What's the incentive for young English riders who progress from riding in the NL to get CL places because promoters tend to pick foreign riders on "bargain" averages. 

Arguably you should have 6 & 7 in the CL for young English riders and promoters should be made and encouraged to stick with them for the full season.

[Twowheels]

Yes Bloom89 Jake signed for Sheffield and was told no pressure, we will give you plenty of time to develop, only 6 weeks into to the season Jake was dropped. He started well but then had mechanical gremlins, did not get chance to ride through this and was replaced. 

He has had a stop start career as always trying to juggle work and Speedway. Looks like he will not be the only young Brit lost to the sport.

[bloom89]

42 minutes ago, knightr said:

Yes Bloom89 Jake signed for Sheffield and was told no pressure, we will give you plenty of time to develop, only 6 weeks into to the season Jake was dropped. He started well but then had mechanical gremlins, did not get chance to ride through this and was replaced. 

He has had a stop start career as always trying to juggle work and Speedway. Looks like he will not be the only young Brit lost to the sport.

It is a shame that riders such as your son Joe Jacobs, Ellis Perks etc don’t get the opportunity that the likes of Todd Kurtz, Mason Campton, Tero Aarnio to name but a few have had. 

[GARRYH]

I had the same opinion as Richard the moment 39 point limit was announced I knew that my lad Shane hazelden would struggle to get a team place with his average and coming back from injury. I was talk to by a couple of teams he was in their team plans if the limit was higher. Basically 4.5 to 6 point riders geting replaced by untried 3 pointers

Edited February 6, 2018 by GARRYH
Typo

[Sings4Speedway]

I have to admit that i was one that thought the 39 point limit should stay and on some side i agree with that but i am far more divided with my opinion now that teams are starting to be finalised. The issue that the league has developed is that with a lesser product than a few years ago riders averages are being greatly inflated over the course of a season and it makes it difficult to fit certain riders into certain teams. 

The major issues lay with the leagues above as there is nowhere for riders to progress to whilst the league is also peppered with riders who have reached their level and look very unlikely to progress any further yet still have the "right" averages to fit into teams year on year while others struggle to make a break into a team or string a run of seasons together.

[gee jay]

in the early 00's wasn't there a reduction of something like 1.5 pts on a riders average if they were british ? why was that dropped ? or am i the only one who thinks this rule existed   

Edited February 6, 2018 by gee jay

[Jayne]

46 minutes ago, gee jay said:

in the early 00's wasn't there a reduction of something like 1.5 pts on a riders average if they were british ? why was that dropped ? or am i the only one who thinks this rule existed   

It did indeed exist but has never done so in the NL.

[Guest GiveusaB]

I wish the powers that be would adopt a more 'central/flexible' points system for the National League ?

Scrap the average selection and use a A,B,C,D category....1 rider from A and 2 riders from B,C,D each category 

A = ave 8 or above B = ave 6 to 8 C = 4 to 6 and D 0 to 4 (may be category D riders being under 18)

Afterall, it's about developing British talent, not winning trophies and accolades !?

We want to see/encourage our future stars...not impede them!