Chadster Posted December 19, 2017 Report Share Posted December 19, 2017 9 hours ago, LesR said: Have to agree there Gemini, when I think back to the 70's and early 80's when my local track Canterbury had 3000 - 5000 people per week over that time. There was a curfew, the meeting had to finish by 9.00pm. It started at 7.00pm with a centre green rider introduction and one lap parade on their bikes, swiftly followed by the first heat. 13 race league match, 3 second half junior races, 4 second half heats and the second half final, 21 races in less than 2 hours with even time for a couple of laps after the final if a rider wanted to try something out. And yes the sun was a problem, for about 20 minutes, going into the third turn but that is what the effective peaks were for on your helmet! After the meeting the fans had full access to their favourites too. Belle Vue was the same in the late 60s and early 70s when I was watching there. The Belle Vue management wanted people out of the speedway by 9.00pm and into the amusement arcades etc. There was a story that the clerk of the course had his own unofficial 2 minute buzzer if he felt the ref was tardy. My recollection was that as riders came in off one heat the riders for the next heat were being pushed off. I go to relatively few meetings these days but slow presentation is a regular annoyance when I do go. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waytogo28 Posted December 20, 2017 Report Share Posted December 20, 2017 12 hours ago, Chadster said: Belle Vue was the same in the late 60s and early 70s when I was watching there. The Belle Vue management wanted people out of the speedway by 9.00pm and into the amusement arcades etc. There was a story that the clerk of the course had his own unofficial 2 minute buzzer if he felt the ref was tardy. My recollection was that as riders came in off one heat the riders for the next heat were being pushed off. I go to relatively few meetings these days but slow presentation is a regular annoyance when I do go. That really is how it was at Brandon Stadium around the same time under CO and was was usually home in Northampton by 9.30 ( and on one memorable occasion by 9.15 pm after a match ). This is NOT a rose tinted dinosaur fan glasses long ago memory. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry The Goat Posted December 20, 2017 Report Share Posted December 20, 2017 14 hours ago, Halifaxtiger said: Most promoters treat members of the BSF as g'bs*ites, trolls, ignoramuses and keyboard commandos. They regard us with contempt, spite and aggression and as 'completely without credibility'. Is this true? You'd think a forum of dedicated fans would - or at least could - provide vital feedback for any promoter. Re Barry Bishop's words, I'm hugely impressed and wish him every success. If only I was within easy striking distance of the IOW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCB Posted December 20, 2017 Report Share Posted December 20, 2017 @barrybishop - How refreshing to actually read a promotion actually listens to his customers and doesn't just tell them what they want. And how great that it's working. More power to you and Martin and I hope crowds continue to improve, maybe the rest of the BSPA will start to listen to you and act on your advice based on your experience. As HT says, also how great of you to come on here and treat us as customers and not something you trod in, that alone I think is worth a few fans and will be appreciated. I know when Pete Toogood used to wander around chatting to the fans I always liked him for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted December 20, 2017 Report Share Posted December 20, 2017 49 minutes ago, SCB said: @barrybishop - How refreshing to actually read a promotion actually listens to his customers and doesn't just tell them what they want. And how great that it's working. More power to you and Martin and I hope crowds continue to improve, maybe the rest of the BSPA will start to listen to you and act on your advice based on your experience. As HT says, also how great of you to come on here and treat us as customers and not something you trod in, that alone I think is worth a few fans and will be appreciated. I know when Pete Toogood used to wander around chatting to the fans I always liked him for it. Adrian Smith does the same at BV.. Not just around the 'posh seats' either he ventures over to us great unwashed on the South Stand.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aces51 Posted December 20, 2017 Report Share Posted December 20, 2017 2 hours ago, mikebv said: Adrian Smith does the same at BV.. Not just around the 'posh seats' either he ventures over to us great unwashed on the South Stand.... Those of us in the superior stand were quite concerned when we first realised he had been visiting the hoi polloi in the cheap stand but assurances that he changes his clothes and washes his hands on the way back have put our minds at rest. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted December 20, 2017 Report Share Posted December 20, 2017 (edited) Re businesses and customer feedback... For a good few years now, Toys R Us have been perceived as significantly more expensive than their competitors... Feedback from an ever dwindling, income stretched customer base was they needed to reduce prices... However, sometimes a business cannot reduce prices due to its bottom line margin % which needs to be maintained to pay its running costs... Less income will obviously erode the cash value of that operating margin over time, resulting in an inevitable conclusion unless it can reduce it's cost base significantly...... Therefore listening to your customers who tell you what they think of you is a priceless commodity... Choosing to ignore that feedback through willful "we are right" stubbornness, or even genuine "because there is nothing else we can do" will still end up the with the same sad ending... I would suggest British Speedway still has plenty of opportunity to turn the ship around, as there is still "lots they can do".. Whether it has the desire, vision, leadership and capability level to do it or not is the question... Edited December 20, 2017 by mikebv Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marko Posted December 20, 2017 Report Share Posted December 20, 2017 Simple answer- Speedway was once all the rage, very popular, well known and cool to be part of. Times changed, things evolved but the sport did not. I can still enjoy aspects of the sport but you are not going to get youngsters wanting to go to run down stadia that plays old music and stand with a bunch with a bunch of oap's, LOOK, most people know of the "Inbetweeners" imagine how an episode would play out if they went to Speedway! "Why have you even brought us here Neil? this is embarrassing, don't you dare mention it to anyone else at the school we came here, this is so totally not cool" 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waytogo28 Posted December 20, 2017 Report Share Posted December 20, 2017 29 minutes ago, mikebv said: I would suggest British Speedway still has plenty of opportunity to turn the ship around, as there is still "lots they can do".. Whether it has the desire, vision, leadership and capability level to do it or not is the question... The people currently in the positions of power with in the BSPA are even now at daggers drawn over the "one over the eight" rule, which looks as if it is certain to erode further the fan base. NONE of them do have the desire, vision. leadership or capability ( in my opinion ) to do the "lots" that they could. They may have all or some of those qualities in their own business dealings outside, but as far a speedway goes - no way. Accepting Chapman and Godfrey as the " guardians of the sport" was the BSPA's "the last throw of the dice" - and they know now that, that was futile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moxey63 Posted December 20, 2017 Report Share Posted December 20, 2017 3 hours ago, mikebv said: I would suggest British Speedway still has plenty of opportunity to turn the ship around It will be difficult... as the ship's taking in water at an alarming rate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILIPRISING Posted December 20, 2017 Report Share Posted December 20, 2017 DID the BSPA design the new aircraft carrier 4 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barrybishop Posted December 20, 2017 Report Share Posted December 20, 2017 7 hours ago, mikebv said: Adrian Smith does the same at BV.. Not just around the 'posh seats' either he ventures over to us great unwashed on the South Stand.... I must talk to him about that.... as there is a limit ha ha ha ha ha ha... joking.. thats great to hear. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aces51 Posted December 20, 2017 Report Share Posted December 20, 2017 (edited) 22 minutes ago, PHILIPRISING said: DID the BSPA design the new aircraft carrier If only they did. Testing something new to its limits and finding any faults before bringing it into service. Never mind the long history of disastrous decisions that weren't thought through they've managed to do the same this year with the only one over 8, that only applies in the PL so a CL team could have a stronger heat leader trio than a PL team, the reassessment of GP riders who didn't race here in 2017 but not other riders who didn't and the abandonment of the 2 British riders rule. They did introduce fixed nights, Swindon excepted, but cancelled out one of the major advantages by reassessing those GP riders. Edited December 20, 2017 by Aces51 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halifaxtiger Posted December 22, 2017 Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 On 20/12/2017 at 9:02 AM, Harry The Goat said: Is this true? You'd think a forum of dedicated fans would - or at least could - provide vital feedback for any promoter. Re Barry Bishop's words, I'm hugely impressed and wish him every success. If only I was within easy striking distance of the IOW. Without a doubt, Harry - and you're dead right. Jayne Moss comes on occasionally but no other club official makes any comment at all, which speaks volumes. Problem is, the BSF is entirely out of their control so they can't throw those who criticise off it - unlike a club forum or facebook page. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halifaxtiger Posted December 22, 2017 Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 On 20/12/2017 at 10:44 AM, SCB said: @barrybishop - How refreshing to actually read a promotion actually listens to his customers and doesn't just tell them what they want. And how great that it's working. More power to you and Martin and I hope crowds continue to improve, maybe the rest of the BSPA will start to listen to you and act on your advice based on your experience. As HT says, also how great of you to come on here and treat us as customers and not something you trod in, that alone I think is worth a few fans and will be appreciated. I know when Pete Toogood used to wander around chatting to the fans I always liked him for it. I remember going to a match at Newport in early 2005 and this chap was coming round, shaking hands and talking with spectators. He shook my hand, asked about the speedway and went off to the next person. I was hugely impressed when I found out he was, at the time, chairman of the BSPA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waytogo28 Posted December 22, 2017 Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 59 minutes ago, Halifaxtiger said: Problem is, the BSF is entirely out of their control so they can't throw those who criticise off it - unlike a club forum or facebook page. And there you have it - the BSPA members don't do "powerless"! And their leader would be absolutely affronted by the thought of being powerless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilWatson Posted December 22, 2017 Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, Halifaxtiger said: Without a doubt, Harry - and you're dead right. Jayne Moss comes on occasionally but no other club official makes any comment at all, which speaks volumes. Problem is, the BSF is entirely out of their control so they can't throw those who criticise off it - unlike a club forum or facebook page. Barry And Martin from the Isle of Wight sometimes post here, Dale, Laurence Rogers, Tsunami, Gordon Pairman, there may be others. There will always be issues that are confidential that cannot be immediately responded to but I will generally answer reasonable questions posed without too much unpleasantness, and correct clear misunderstandings. Edited December 22, 2017 by NeilWatson Typo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted December 22, 2017 Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 (edited) In the New Year, 'Arena Cross' hits Manchester... Indoor Motocross.. I would urge any Speedway Promoters who can do, to attend... I went three years ago with my lad and so much of the total evening 'entertainment package' on view could easily be translated over to Speedway.. From an autograph, selfie opportuniy meet and greet with the riders, completed 60 mins before racing so plenty of time to browse the merchandice stalls and get a drink and food.. . (Each rider had his own posters and photos for sale too). Riders coming out in darkness doing a lap of honour under a spot light. Could tracks do something similar to create atmosphere?. A 'centre green' announcer who was loud (he had to be over the bikes and music), brash (well, the Promoters were American!) and informative, detailing background information about each individual rider and commentating on the action as it happened. (That last bit maybe not needed in Speedway?).. Before racing and during gaps in between for track maintenance, (all tractors were working by the way), their Promotion team fired their own T Shirts into the crowd via an 'pump action air gun'... Many were, it appeared, Small and Medium meaning many adults caught them as you would expect but many of the kids ended up with the T Shirt.. (My lad got one from someone five rows back who passed it on when he saw it was an 'S').... There were no gaps where 'nothing happened' between races, so the crowd was kept interested.. The interval took place half way during the evenings racing and was 30 minutes prompt.. Before the interval they told us about the 'mini moto' they had suspended from the ceiling. Just text your name to etc etc and you could be taking this bike home. Texts cost £5... There was a 7500 full house and I would suggest well over half of 'the dads' were texting away during that interval. That bike certainly paid for itself and more! (Certainly I contributed a tenner towards it)! Now maybe Speedway couldn't do the same but they could do something around winning Season Tickets, VIP evenings etc.. The winner was announced prior to the Final and came down and received his bike... The cost for me and my lad was over £70 but I am going again next time as it was fantastic value for money... How did I know they were coming back to Manchester? I got an email from them in October telling me so with a nice book early 15% saving... Three years they have had my email address and now have used it knowing I had previously attended. My own Speedway team still doesn't have my email address... How did it advertise itself? Lots of Social Media and it played on how "awesome" (as I said they are Yanks!) it must be to watch 'dirt bike racing' in the middle of a City Centre.. And let's be honest as a concept it is 'pretty unique' isn't it? Apart from obviously it already happens many nights of the week around the Country from March to October..!! It was a 'one off' so you could argue that it is 'different' from Speedway, however maybe if Speedway promoted EVERY meeting as if it was a 'one off' they would be delivering many, many more through their turnstiles.. Watching 'dirt bike racing' in a City Centre is "awesome" don't forget, so says the guys who play to full houses and make money out of doing so... NB: No mention of it being a 'family sport' but plenty about 'speed', 'danger' and being 'gnarly'! (Whatever that means....) In fact the only downside to the night was that I, as a 47 year old at the time, felt 'very old' when I looked around the rest of the crowd.. At Speedway, at least I still feel like a 'spring chicken'!! Edited December 22, 2017 by mikebv 4 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halifaxtiger Posted December 22, 2017 Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 (edited) 45 minutes ago, NeilWatson said: Barry And Martin from the Isle of Wight sometimes post here, Dale, Laurence Rogers, Tsunami, Gordon Pairman, there may be others. There will always be issues that are confidential that cannot be immediately responded to but I will generally answer reasonable questions posed without too much unpleasantness, and correct clear misunderstandings. To be fair, Neil, you are a regular and, in my opinion, much valued poster. Dale, Laurence and Gordon comment very rarely and Tsunami is a former promoter with no official position, although I know that he makes a huge difference to Newcastle and his perspective as a former promoter is often sobering. The point stands : there are 28 clubs in British Speedway and the overwhelming majority of clubs make absolutely no contribution here whatsoever, despite the fact that it is easily the biggest online speedway forum in this country. My view of the way the BSF is viewed also stands, and it is indicative of how the sport treats its fans that so few of those running teams seek to engage on here in the way that you do and Barry has. You often do not get the credit you deserve, but the number of likes that Barry has attracted shows just how much members appreciate someone coming on and telling us how it is. I believe there is a recognition by most members of this forum that information can be confidential and cannot be disclosed publicly. That does not prevent explanations being given on many, many other matters that concern the individual speedway fan. Edited December 22, 2017 by Halifaxtiger 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waytogo28 Posted December 22, 2017 Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 4 hours ago, mikebv said: There were no gaps where 'nothing happened' between races, so the crowd was kept interested.. Hmmm. That and a lot else that mikebv wrote DO have or should have an application in speedway. But as few promoters come on here ( Thanks to those that do bother to ) and they know what's best for speedway, most of these inexpensive tweaks to the show will most likely not come about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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