Reassessed Averages

[Gavan]

Wow got to love the usual Poole people missing the point.

 

Riders who didnt ride over here last season but did in the GP are reassessed at 9.0

Tai Woffinden and Matej Zager had averages under 8 points gained in the 2016 season and have now been reassessed as a 9.0

 

Why is it wrong to suggest that any foreign rider who rode over here before or during 2016 but missed last year, shouldnt also be reassessed?

 

Chris Holder never completed a full season last year. As a gp rider surely he should also be looked at?

 

I dont care less who people ride for but its amazing how often that one club in particular benefit from the rulings.

Edited November 29, 2017 by Gavan

[Mattfordfan]

Wow got to love the usual Poole people missing the point.

 

Riders who didnt ride over here last season but did in the GP are reassessed at 9.0

Tai Woffinden and Matej Zager had averages under 8 points gained in the 2016 season and have now been reassessed as a 9.0

 

Why is it wrong to suggest that any foreign rider who rode over here before or during 2016 but missed last year, shouldnt also be reassessed?

 

Chris Holder never completed a full season last year. As a gp rider surely he should also be looked at?

 

I dont care less who people ride for but its amazing how often that one club in particular benefit from the rulings.

 

You only want him looked at because your worried he is coming home to Poole.

[Gavan]

 

You only want him looked at because your worried he is coming home to Poole.

Yes im very worried about Chris Holder riding for Poole as my team are in the league below

[Starman2006]

 

You only want him looked at because your worried he is coming home to Poole.

Mate leave it alone, they are trying to wind you up.

[Mattfordfan]

Yes im very worried about Chris Holder riding for Poole as my team are in the league below

 

Yeah but Poole Speedway has a massive impact on your day to day life.

 

You are on our thread on a daily basis. Same cant be said for the Ippo thread though.

Mate leave it alone, they are trying to wind you up.

 

I know.

[Starman2006]

 

Yeah but Poole Speedway has a massive impact on your day to day life.

 

You are on our thread on a daily basis. Same cant be said for the Ippo thread though.

 

I know.

Stevebrum cant talk on his thread because theres nothing to talk about.

[Gavan]

 

Yeah but Poole Speedway has a massive impact on your day to day life.

 

You are on our thread on a daily basis. Same cant be said for the Ippo thread though.

 

I know.

Oh dear Starman and Gater1 teaming up!!

 

I started the Ippo thread thanks buddy. Ive commented on our team and also on the Glasgow thread as you well know.

[Mattfordfan]

Oh dear Starman and Gater1 teaming up!!

 

I started the Ippo thread thanks buddy. Ive commented on our team and also on the Glasgow thread as you well know.

 

No mention of Gater1 in my screen name history.

 

Speedway Fanatic to Poole Pirates Fanatic because someone said I only care about Poole and not British Speedway in General

 

and now Matt Ford Fan just as banter to get back at the jealous haters for blaming Matt Ford for next season's rules.

 

Why don't you go back to it then.

[g13webb]

I put out sensible post and here we go again with another teams supporter having a go at Ford again.

 

Read the post properly.

 

The last comment I make is:

"I think all these guys should be given lowish GSA's and let the individual promoters decide if they want to try and sign them and take the inevitable risks associated. We want young talent here not this constant dumbing down of the league with GSA's being set high just to distract promoters from taking that chance"

 

In effect saying give them all a low GSA and let promoters decide if they want to sign and take whatever risk is involved.

 

I don't care who signs them be it Ford or even Chapman..... If ANY premotor has the foresight and is willing to finance any of these guys coming over then I applaud them for bringing the real potential future World talent to these shores. Believe me if Woryna had signed for KL I would be saying well done Buster for taking a long term view and yes I think its worth it.

 

All this crap about unfairness/manipulation of the rules, Ford always allegedly guilty of underhand dealing - pulling a fast one.

 

I am sure if Buster had signed Woryna you would be saying, nice one Buster, you did well in having the foresight to sign what COULD be a future young star on a good low average. But no as its Matt Ford its viewed as manipulation or devious or unfair.

 

Yes I like Poole but I also love Speedway and unlike maybe Football I would love to see any Prem side sign what could potentially be future World Stars as this is the kind of thing I want to see on tracks and not the same old same old every week. If Lynn signed Woryna, Drabik or Smektala my view would be good on them, they have made the effort and taken the chance. Its good to see a promoter take that chance as you never really know how it will work out on our trickier/tighter (and in may cases inferior quality) tracks.

 

So I am not taking a one club view. Good luck to any promoter in bringing these guys over. The BSPA may be dumbing down our league bit by bit but these younger guys maybe offer a way around it for clubs.

 

Also as I additionally stated. IF they are good enough they will be out of any potential reserve berth anyway come end of May/early June.

 

I'll except your views of a seasoned speedway supporter. You are probably too young to remember when rider control governed team strength. There will always be winners and losers, but the aim of the sport is to be competitive. This is where 'Rider Control' came in We at Lynn won very little, but we were always competitive and most matches were close and exciting. Nobody enjoys winning or losing heavily each week, so having equal teams is important.

Now the sport is governed by suspect averages, different racing formats, out of date assessment. Where once every promoter picked a team for the whole season, now its all change as soon as the Promoter thinks fit. Crowds used to come and connect with their riders, but that has also gone.

 

So lets ask yourself one question. Did Ford sign Woryna because he was a good, young, quality, talented rider. Or did he sign him because of his low average. I think we know it was because of the later....... Ford assumed he was getting quality rider on the wrong GSA, and that can't be correct if the sport is to be the winner..

[ouch]

It wouldnt be the first time a reserve signed on an attractively low average has had it raised following a late rule change.

We signed Jason Lyons on a low average gained during his time at Poole. He was joined at reserve by local lad Ricky Ashworth. The rule was changed so we had to use Jasons second division average, which was higher and meant we couldnt fit Ricky in who ended up at Poole. I think they wanted to clamp down on riders gaining a low average whilst at another track before returning to their parent track.

 

A couple of years later we had similar foresight when signing an ex Ace who had missed the top division to concentrate on tier two. Unfortunately there was a clamp down on riders using their lower division two average when resigning for the former club and he had to use his last division one average.

 

It amazes me when fans complain about the lacklustre nature of the powers that be. As an Aces fan Ive seen them clamp down on things in a regular basis.

[Crazy robin]

 

Bla bla bla bla.

 

FACT TIME!

 

If Woryna signed for Swindon or Wolves then nobody would be having this conversation and the vast majority would agree that Woryna should be a 4.65.

Yes we would!!!

Wow got to love the usual Poole people missing the point.

 

Riders who didnt ride over here last season but did in the GP are reassessed at 9.0

Tai Woffinden and Matej Zager had averages under 8 points gained in the 2016 season and have now been reassessed as a 9.0

 

Why is it wrong to suggest that any foreign rider who rode over here before or during 2016 but missed last year, shouldnt also be reassessed?

 

Chris Holder never completed a full season last year. As a gp rider surely he should also be looked at?

 

I dont care less who people ride for but its amazing how often that one club in particular benefit from the rulings.

The worse one is PK who has been saddled with a 9 point average & was only a reserve in the GPs last season.

 

The sooner we go to one big league the better.

[stevebrum]

Yet another Poole rider. Give it a rest.

 

I beg your pardon??

its nothing to do with who he rides for. Please grow up.

Woryna is the ONLY example as he is the only rider signed for 2018 that didn't ride here in 2017.

you are aware that riders who didn't ride here in 2017 will be given a new average for 2018??

are you actually saying because it's Poole he SHOULDN'T be reassessed???

I mean, are you really???

I couldn't care less who signs/signed him. The BSPA have already said returning riders are getting new averages. Maybe you haven't read up on information before you post nonesense.

 

Woryna should be at least a 7. His Ekstraliga average in 2017 was 7.89, although he did ride at reserve.

 

it's in fitting with what PP was given for Leicester and I expect KP will be given a 7 too. Don't see a reason to be any lower. Can see Woryna on a 7 too which would be a fair assessment.

 

Bla bla bla bla.

 

FACT TIME!

 

If Woryna signed for Swindon or Wolves then nobody would be having this conversation and the vast majority would agree that Woryna should be a 4.65.

 

WRONG. I care only for transparency with the rules and regulations. You can say I wouldn't be saying it if he signed for Wolves, but you would be lying.

 

Stevebrum cant talk on his thread because theres nothing to talk about.

I haven't got my own thread thanks. A forum is for a anyone to post wherever they want. Next thing you will be telling me not to post on a Poole thread whilst you infest every other thread yourself. As we know you are such a hypocrite.

Just so you don't look any more ridiculous this is NOT a Poole thread.

Edited November 29, 2017 by stevebrum

[Mattfordfan]

Cant reassess Woryna to a 7.00 when established riders like Fricke, R. Lambert, Nicholls and Harris are on a 7 something.

[stevebrum]

Cant reassess Woryna to a 7.00 when established riders like Fricke, R. Lambert, Nicholls and Harris are on a 7 something.

Can, and will be.

If not then something very fishy going on.

[Col]

Cant reassess Woryna to a 7.00 when established riders like Fricke, R. Lambert, Nicholls and Harris are on a 7 something.

 

Why not, he hasn't ridden in the UK for a year? Woffinden's average is apparently being reassessed. Woffinden is a far more useful ally in marketing terms for the BSPA than Woryna will ever be.

Delusional Gavan said C. Holder should be a 9.00 (Linked with Poole)

 

We now have a number members calling for Woryna to be anywhere between 6 and 7 because he signed for Poole.

 

What next Brady Kurtz on a 10.00? or Maybe James Shanes on a 5.00.

 

You are quite the over emotional online gibbon.

 

If former GP riders that failed to attain an end of season average for the UK, but avoided being banned from the UK are being reassessed (Kildemand & Piotr Pawlicki) why should a current GP rider that failed to complete a season in the UK, (Holder) not be reassessed? Are you going to come up with the "Outstanding commitment to British Speedway, over a period" bollocks, because I'm sure Hancock will be reassessed if someone tried to sign him.

 

I would also like to know the theory why riders who decided they couldn't be bothered to ride in the UK last season should not be subject to the same average recalculation as those that decided they did wish to ride the UK in 2017. Woryna's 2017 team building average is 6.51, why should his 2018 team building average be any different?

 

http://www.speedwaygb.co/files/downloads/2017_team_building_alphabetical.pdf

 

I know it is difficult, as it is listed alphabetically But A is after B, B is after C, you'll find Woryna 3 off the bottom.

 

Please see - http://www.speedwaygb.co/files/downloads/p17_issue_final.pdf

 

Kurtz is 8.08, Shanes is 2.95. They're both listed under Poole. Poole alphabetically are between Leicester & Rye House, which is where you will find them. I'm sure if Matt Ford asks nicely, the BSPA will list the Poole averages first just to help you out.

Edited November 30, 2017 by Col

[foreverblue]

 

Why not, he hasn't ridden in the UK for a year? Woffinden's average is apparently being reassessed. Woffinden is a far more useful ally in marketing terms for the BSPA than Woryna will ever be.

 

You are quite the over emotional online gibbon.

 

If former GP riders that failed to attain an end of season average for the UK, but avoided being banned from the UK are being reassessed (Kildemand & Piotr Pawlicki) why should a current GP rider that failed to complete a season in the UK, (Holder) not be reassessed? Are you going to come up with the "Outstanding commitment to British Speedway, over a period" bollocks, because I'm sure Hancock will be reassessed if someone tried to sign him.

 

I would also like to know the theory why riders who decided they couldn't be bothered to ride in the UK last season should not be subject to the same average recalculation as those that decided they did wish to ride the UK in 2017. Woryna's 2017 team building average is 6.51, why should his 2018 team building average be any different?

 

http://www.speedwaygb.co/files/downloads/2017_team_building_alphabetical.pdf

 

I know it is difficult, as it is listed alphabetically But A is after B, B is after C, you'll find Woryna 3 off the bottom.

 

Please see - http://www.speedwaygb.co/files/downloads/p17_issue_final.pdf

 

Kurtz is 8.08, Shanes is 2.95. They're both listed under Poole. Poole alphabetically are between Leicester & Rye House, which is where you will find them. I'm sure if Matt Ford asks nicely, the BSPA will list the Poole averages first just to help you out.

2017 team building average is irrelevant to 2018.

[STEVEHOLS54]

 

I'll except your views of a seasoned speedway supporter. You are probably too young to remember when rider control governed team strength. There will always be winners and losers, but the aim of the sport is to be competitive. This is where 'Rider Control' came in We at Lynn won very little, but we were always competitive and most matches were close and exciting. Nobody enjoys winning or losing heavily each week, so having equal teams is important.

Now the sport is governed by suspect averages, different racing formats, out of date assessment. Where once every promoter picked a team for the whole season, now its all change as soon as the Promoter thinks fit. Crowds used to come and connect with their riders, but that has also gone.

 

So lets ask yourself one question. Did Ford sign Woryna because he was a good, young, quality, talented rider. Or did he sign him because of his low average. I think we know it was because of the later....... Ford assumed he was getting quality rider on the wrong GSA, and that can't be correct if the sport is to be the winner.

Thanks for the seasoned supporter bit ;-)

 

As for probably too young ?? - Well my first meeting was at Waterden Road, Hackney in 1970 as a 15/16 year old. Cant quite remember which month without turning out my loft and the many Hackney and other programmes from that period. I will let you work out if I am too young to remember, but thanks for the "probably too young to remember" comment as its nice to have someone think you are younger than you are LOL ;-)

 

To answer your last question: I personally think he signed him on both ideas to be honest. Maybe if he was say a 7 assessed GSA then I think Matt would have had to think long and hard if he felt the rider would achieve that average and more importantly how it would affect team building plans bearing in mind the team point limit we assume was unknown when he signed him as an asset.

 

Of course at 4.65 the decision was a no brainer.

 

Honestly I get frustrated that with all these rule changes about one over 8 only, I find it amazing that the BSPA/SCB cant draw up the rules on riders GSA's be it SGP riders or those who last rode here in 2016 or whenever - young foreign riders under 21 who have never ridden here so we have no idea how they will perform - same with riders over 21 with the same situation.

 

You would expect a professional organisation to have these things sorted in advance of an AGM so that promoters/managers/club owners etc all know the full brief on what they may be able to do when they attend the meeting.

 

All we get is - new limit 42.5 points - one over 8 rule and then silence....

 

Has the 2 Brit rule (or 2 riders who qualify or rode NL) still apply as many say its been abolished ??

No firm rules on what SGP riders who didn't ride here in 2017 will be given (many say its been decided at 9)

No GSA's or rider assessments done on the riders I mention earlier above.

 

Clubs should be informed of this long before now as hardly surprising many cannot do team planning when they have no idea what riders covered by the above will be given as GSA's.

 

But then perhaps I expect it to be run like a Professional Organisation having all the angles covered. Much of what I have seen etc is far from that in my opinion.

[g13webb]

Thanks for the seasoned supporter bit ;-)

 

As for probably too young ?? - Well my first meeting was at Waterden Road, Hackney in 1970 as a 15/16 year old. Cant quite remember which month without turning out my loft and the many Hackney and other programmes from that period. I will let you work out if I am too young to remember, but thanks for the "probably too young to remember" comment as its nice to have someone think you are younger than you are LOL ;-)

 

To answer your last question: I personally think he signed him on both ideas to be honest. Maybe if he was say a 7 assessed GSA then I think Matt would have had to think long and hard if he felt the rider would achieve that average and more importantly how it would affect team building plans bearing in mind the team point limit we assume was unknown when he signed him as an asset.

 

Of course at 4.65 the decision was a no brainer.

 

Honestly I get frustrated that with all these rule changes about one over 8 only, I find it amazing that the BSPA/SCB cant draw up the rules on riders GSA's be it SGP riders or those who last rode here in 2016 or whenever - young foreign riders under 21 who have never ridden here so we have no idea how they will perform - same with riders over 21 with the same situation.

 

You would expect a professional organisation to have these things sorted in advance of an AGM so that promoters/managers/club owners etc all know the full brief on what they may be able to do when they attend the meeting.

 

All we get is - new limit 42.5 points - one over 8 rule and then silence....

 

Has the 2 Brit rule (or 2 riders who qualify or rode NL) still apply as many say its been abolished ??

No firm rules on what SGP riders who didn't ride here in 2017 will be given (many say its been decided at 9)

No GSA's or rider assessments done on the riders I mention earlier above.

 

Clubs should be informed of this long before now as hardly surprising many cannot do team planning when they have no idea what riders covered by the above will be given as GSA's.

 

But then perhaps I expect it to be run like a Professional Organisation having all the angles covered. Much of what I have seen etc is far from that in my opinion.

 

My sentiments exactly. I've preached long and hard for the rules to be set in stone, so that every year Riders, Fans and Promoter all knew what is expected. We have this scenario of them and us, and we being the enemy. The fact that the BSPA won't release minutes of their meetings indicate they have so much to hide. and do so en group with the secrecy of it all. .

 

Common sense issues, like riders GSA, should be in place way before the AGM, the fact it wasn't, shows the hideous way the sport is run. You can't make decisions like 1 over 8 rule without knowing the about the number of riders it will effect. That's so amateurism.

Your comment about Professional Organisation is so right . Most of us has been asking for that for years....

 

 

NB. My first visit to Waterden Road, Hackney was 1968 at the age of 20, Jimmy McMillan, Charlie Monk rode for Hackney . We lost 40-38 with Simmo getting 12 and Bettsy 11... The rest didn't do much.... Them 'Good Ole Days' ....

[DC2]

 

And we now get a 1.3 multiplier between the leagues instead of this year’s 1.2 and previous years’ 1.4.

 

The averages for Woryna and Holder need adjusting in the interests of fairness.

[Grachan]

And we now get a 1.3 multiplier between the leagues instead of this year’s 1.2 and previous years’ 1.4.

 

The averages for Woryna and Holder need adjusting in the interests of fairness.

 

If Holder is being reassessed, then so should Doyle and Lindgren.

 

Holder has an average. There is no reason to reassess him. His average is not from the old format.